Walk to Emmaus

[tragic_pizza]

Alright, no offense taken and I appreciate your kind words. While you may not be able to completely explain the experience, can you give me a general idea of what goes on at these events? For example, when you study the word of God together, how are doctrinal differences addressed in such a disparate group? Also, are labyrinths, contemplative prayer or other like practices encouraged?

Doctrinal differences are not addressed, because it isn;t about the window dressing issues. Communion is shared by intinction, and the talks center around grace and Christian life and action.

There is time for personal reflective prayer; I've never seen a labyrinth at a Walk, though they are very effective meditation tools.

 

[Rufus_1611]

Doctrinal differences are not addressed, because it isn;t about the window dressing issues.

Doctrine is a window dressing issue?

 

[tragic_pizza]

Doctrine is a window dressing issue?

Doctrine beyond belief in Christ is, yes. What's more important than that? Anything?

 

[Rufus_1611]

Doctrine beyond belief in Christ is, yes. What's more important than that? Anything?

What is your definition of "window dressing"? Every definition I find either does not fit or suggests that you are once again speaking against the Bible.

window dressing (a showy misrepresentation intended to conceal something unpleasant) (Source: WordNet)​

win·dow-dress·ing also win·dow dress·ing (wĭn'dō-drĕs'ĭng)
n.

1. Decorative exhibition of retail merchandise in store windows.
Goods and trimmings used in such displays.
2. A means of improving appearances or creating a falsely favorable impression: “The realignment … may be more window dressing than a substantive change in how the company does business” (Connie Guglielmo).(Source: Answers.com)​

Noun: window dressing 'window'dresing
A showy misrepresentation intended to conceal something unpleasant (Source: Wordweb)​

win·dow-dress·ing also win·dow dress·ing (wĭn'dō-drěs'ĭng)
n.

1. Decorative exhibition of retail merchandise in store windows.
Goods and trimmings used in such displays.
2. A means of improving appearances or creating a falsely favorable impression: "The realignment ... may be more window dressing than a substantive change in how the company does business" (Connie Guglielmo). (Source: American Heritage)​

 

[tragic_pizza]

Oh, sorry. I don't mean "window dressing" as in covering up. Perhaps a better phrase would be "theological bric-a-brack." You know, just stuff.

 

[James_Newman]

There is certainly more to the Christian life than just believing in Christ.

Hebrews 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

Titus 2:6-15
6 Young men likewise exhort to be sober minded.
7 In all things showing thyself a pattern of good works: in doctrine showing uncorruptness, gravity, sincerity,
8 Sound speech, that cannot be condemned; that he that is of the contrary part may be ashamed, having no evil thing to say of you.
9 Exhort servants to be obedient unto their own masters, and to please them well in all things; not answering again;
10 Not purloining, but showing all good fidelity; that they may adorn the doctrine of God our Savior in all things.
11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
13 Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Savior Jesus Christ;
14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.
15 These things speak, and exhort, and rebuke with all authority. Let no man despise thee.

The Catholic Christ becomes a piece of bread and is continually sacrificed for the sins of the world. The bible says He was once sacrificed and is sitting at the right hand of the Father. But that difference aside, in what way is this experience going enable one to live soberly, righteously and godly? Is it more than just an emotional high? I have had experiences that have left me dumbstruck, but once the feeling is gone, I have to get back to learning how to live my life every day. Were supposed to be looking for the appearing of Jesus Christ, not hiding in an upper room waiting for the wind to blow.

 

[tragic_pizza]

...

*sigh*

...

 

[Agnus_Dei]

Doctrine beyond belief in Christ is, yes. What's more important than that? Anything?

TP: This is probably no new news to you, but I see where ‘Rufus’ is coming from, as I used to be like him. Myself being raised a fundamentalist, we shunned ‘round table’ type discussions. Our Sunday school wasn’t ‘school’, but another preaching sermon and there were no participating in any outside church event that wasn’t sanctioned by the ‘church’. See…we relied on being told ‘what to think’ and events where discussions took place, encouraged questions and which encouraged people to learn how to think and that was a dangerous thing.

Evangelism is great at introducing one to Christ, but evangelism really lacks in developing ones walk.

I’ve been attending a Methodist Church these past two years, I have taken Disciple II and III, Alpha and a Through the Scriptures class and I had to start taking a Disciple I at a local Methodist Church while a Baptist, just to kick my spiritual life into another gear.

 

[Agnus_Dei]

The Catholic Christ becomes a piece of bread

Just as Christ said per John 6

and is continually sacrificed for the sins of the world. The bible says He was once sacrificed and is sitting at the right hand of the Father.

Christ’s sacrifice was once and for all. It would be something else if the Church were to claim Christ does die again, but the Church doesn’t make that claim. Through Christ’s intercessory ministry in heaven and through the Catholic Mass and the Greek Divine Liturgy, Jesus continues to offer himself to his Father as a living sacrifice, and Christ does so in what the Church specifically states is "an unbloody manner", one that does not involve a new crucifixion. Hence Christ’s depiction by John in Revelation as a ‘…Lamb that looks as if it’s been slain…’

 

[James_Newman]

Just as Christ said per John 6


Christ’s sacrifice was once and for all. It would be something else if the Church were to claim Christ does die again, but the Church doesn’t make that claim. Through Christ’s intercessory ministry in heaven and through the Catholic Mass and the Greek Divine Liturgy, Jesus continues to offer himself to his Father as a living sacrifice, and Christ does so in what the Church specifically states is "an unbloody manner", one that does not involve a new crucifixion. Hence Christ’s depiction by John in Revelation as a ‘…Lamb that looks as if it’s been slain…’

And you go to what kind of church? There is no bloodless sacrifice in the bible that will cleanse us from sin. But this is surely getting off topic.

 

[North Carolina Tentmaker]

Wow, sorry I had to leave this one alone for a while, you know work and sleep. I am glad the discussion is still going on.

Alright, no offense taken and I appreciate your kind words. While you may not be able to completely explain the experience, can you give me a general idea of what goes on at these events? For example, when you study the word of God together, how are doctrinal differences addressed in such a disparate group? Also, are labyrinths, contemplative prayer or other like practices encouraged?

Rufus, having been a separated ifb for a long time, I was very worried about this before I went. My sponsor was a Methodist so I knew they would be there but when I heard they had borrowed ideas from Catholicism I was really worried.

I guess the simple answer is that they never came up. Sorry I have no idea what a labyrinth is (I thought that was some kind of tunnel).

The way it works is that you are divided up into tables. Each table has a table leader who has been through the program before. The entire weekend is under the control of a lay director who is a lay person who has been through the program before. He has a spiritual director and spiritual team of ministers who help him. Some of the talks are lay delivered and some are clergy delivered.

Our spiritual director was a Baptist pastor and my table leader was a Baptist. I know some of the ministers there were Methodists. There was a youth minister from an assembly of God church there, but he was a pilgrim like me he was not part of the spiritual team. Doctrinal differences just never came up.

After each talk you have a time of discussion with your table of guys. The table leader keep you on topic but basically you just share what you think. We had our bibles at the table and would often look up a verse to two. You would have been right at home Rufus, every bible on my table was KJV.

We just listened to God’s messengers, read his word and then shared our beliefs with each other, pretty simple really. We shared communion but it was not that different than what we do at Baptist churches. The doctrinal differences just never came up. We were all in agreement on salvation, the power of prayer, the importance of holiness. Dunking and sprinkling just never became an issue.

We did not always agree on everything. Two guys got into it one morning about whether one guys tattoos were a violation of Lev 19:28. We had some smokers who had to sneak outside every once in a while. We were not all from the same point in life or the same place in our sanctification but we were all saved and we were all there looking for something from God. It really challenged some of the judgments I have made of people based on how they look without every taking the time to know their hearts.

 

[North Carolina Tentmaker]

There is certainly more to the Christian life than just believing in Christ.

Titus 2:12 Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;

The Catholic Christ becomes a piece of bread and is continually sacrificed for the sins of the world. The bible says He was once sacrificed and is sitting at the right hand of the Father. But that difference aside, in what way is this experience going enable one to live soberly, righteously and godly? Is it more than just an emotional high? I have had experiences that have left me dumbstruck, but once the feeling is gone, I have to get back to learning how to live my life every day. Were supposed to be looking for the appearing of Jesus Christ, not hiding in an upper room waiting for the wind to blow.

You are certainly right James. We spent a lot of time on sanctification and living holy separated lives. Yes we dealt with how we take this blessing we have received back to our different churches and pass it on to others. There were several pastors in our group and we spent a lot of time on how we would be better ministers, fathers, and husbands when we got back. “In the world but not of the world” you know.

One thing that we did not spend much time on was prophecy and end times. There would have probably been more disagreement in our group if we did. The only time we really spent in Revelation was talking about how we know the Devil is going down in the end and we should not hesitate to resist him.

As far as the communion, like I said it was basically the same thing we do in Baptist churches. We did not use the little plastic cups. We actually all drank from a common cup which I had done before but can be a little scary if you are a germophobic. We all knew the bread and cup were just symbols. Nothing close to transubutation.

 

[North Carolina Tentmaker]

Here is something else for yall to think about. During our talk on discipleship the speaker made the statement that being a disciple of Christ was not a part time hobby but a full time vocation. He was talking about when Jesus called the fishermen to put down their nets and follow him.

In our table discussion we talked about how as men we get a giant part of our self image and identity from our occupation. What is one of the first things we usually ask someone we meet, “What do you do?” And we mean, “What is your job.”

The next time you meet someone new and they ask, “What do you do?” try answering, “I am a full time disciple of Jesus Christ.” Our table pretty much agreed that many people would think we were loopy or just run away, but it certainly opens the door to witness. I’m going to try it.

 

[tragic_pizza]

As far as the communion, like I said it was basically the same thing we do in Baptist churches. We did not use the little plastic cups. We actually all drank from a common cup which I had done before but can be a little scary if you are a germophobic. We all knew the bread and cup were just symbols. Nothing close to transubutation.

That's very interesting, because in the Alabama, Living Waters, and Birmingham communities we took communion by intinction (take a piece of bread, di it in the grape juice, and eat). I had no idea that other communities did it differently.

 

[North Carolina Tentmaker]

Yea, we did it that way also. I did not know there was a name for it. Seems like we drank from the cup once and dipped twice. I did not think it was that big a deal though. I have participated in communion services at baptist churches both ways as well. How many times did we participate in communion anyway? Seems like at least 3.

I don't mean to be misleading, we did not have little square crackers and plastic cups. I guess some baptists have never participated in communion any other way but I have in ifb and sbc churches. Like I said I did not think it was anything unusal but I am sure some people might.

 

[donnA]

That's very interesting, because in the Alabama, Living Waters, and Birmingham communities we took communion by intinction (take a piece of bread, di it in the grape juice, and eat). I had no idea that other communities did it differently.

We did ours the same way.

 

[donnA]

Hey, did you all sing the Jesus song too?

 

[tragic_pizza]

Oh, yes. I E minor, D, C, and that diminished chord I can never remember the name of (I'm self-taught, can't read music). Oh, the chairs I've stood on while playing that song...

 

[donnA]

I love that song, was at Emmaus about 7 years ago and still sing that song sometimes.

 

[North Carolina Tentmaker]

Hey, did you all sing the Jesus song too?

Which Jesus song? We sang a bunch of songs, most of which were about Jesus. I guess just the fact that I don't know which song you mean indicates that we didn't.

We sang a bunch of songs that were new to me and they are all still rattling around in my head. The music was great.