WARNINGS NOT TO DEPART THE FAITH (HEBREWS 6:4-8; HEBREWS 10:26-39)

[3rdAngel]

why did you quote John the Baptist?

Because I love God's Word and believe and follow it.

Are you taking verses way out of context mixing then to your satisfaction?

Nope.

Are you applying scripture to yourself being as the speaker? How dangerous and ignorant.

Yes I apply all the scriptures to myself as all scripture is written for our admonition and we should believe and follow it. Ignoring God's Word does not make it dissappear. No I am not the speaker. Only one crying in the wilderness make straight the way of the Lord, as said the prophet Isaiah.

 

[loDebar]

Well that is not true. These are your words not God's. Then we have God's Word (not yours) that says...

HEBREWS 10:26-38
[26], For IF WE (BELIEVERS) sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
[27], But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
[28], He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
[29], Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace? (see HEBREWS 6:4-8)
[30], For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
[31], It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
[32], But call to remembrance the former days, in which, after ye were illuminated, ye endured a great fight of afflictions;
[33], Partly, whilst ye were made a gazingstock both by reproaches and afflictions; and partly, whilst ye became companions of them that were so used.
[34], For ye had compassion of me in my bonds, and took joyfully the spoiling of your goods, knowing in yourselves that ye have in heaven a better and an enduring substance.
[35], Cast not away therefore your confidence (speaking to believers), which hath great recompence of reward.
[36], For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done the will of God, ye might receive the promise.
[37], For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry.
[38], Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.

..............

Again key points to consider in HEBREWS 10:28-28 (from HEBREWS 10:26-27)

1. WE (BELIEVERS) return back to a life of known unrepentant SIN; HEBREWS 10:26
2. WE (BELIEVERS) being those who have received a knowledge of the truth; HEBREWS 10:26
3. WE (BELIEVERS) will receive the judgments of God; HEBREWS 10:27

4. WE (BELIEVERS) will receive a greater punishment for returning to a life of known unrepentant sin because we have receved a knowledge of the truth and turned away from it; HEBREWS 10:29

5. WE (BELIEVERS) by returning back to known unrepentant sin after we receive a knowledge of the truth we count the blood of the covenant an UNHOLY thing and do despite to the Spirit of Grace; HEBREWS 10:29

6. WE (BELIEVERS) are warned not to CAST AWAY our confidence which has great reward; HEBREWS 10:35

7. WE (BELIEVERS) receive God's promise after we do God's will; HEBREWS 10:36
8. WE (BELIEVERS) are WARNED NOT TO DRAW BACK INTO UNBELIEF; HEBREWS 10:38

As you can see here all of the above is Gods Word not mine and the scripture application and context is to believers drawing back to something that is not the Gospel of Christ. The application here is universal. If we draw back to anything that is not the gospel of Christ and continue to sin willfully after we receive a knowledge of the truth there remains no more sacrifice for sin but a fearful looking forward to of judgment.

Sorry my friend God's Word disagrees with you. What is it in the scriptures provided here that you disagree with? This is only sent in love and as a help to you. I hope you can receive these scriptures in the Spirit it was given (love).

Ignoring God's Word does not make it dissappear.

The knowledge of truth is not salvation but and understanding of the Gospel, many understand but reject Him, The Hebrews who received this book were strong Jewish traditionalist but did not accept Jesus.
The writer was showing how Jesus is better than the Law
Reference the parable of the Sower

 

[loDebar]

Because I love God's Word and believe and follow it.

Nope.
Are you applying scripture to yourself being as the speaker? How dangerous and ignorant.

Yes I apply all the scriptures to myself as all scripture is written for our admonition and we should believe and follow it. Ignoring God's Word does not make it dissappear. No I am not the speaker.[/QUOTE]
I have not ignored but examined scripture and shown your errors.

 

[3rdAngel]

The knowledge of truth is not salvation but and understanding of the Gospel, many understand but reject Him, The Hebrews who received this book were strong Jewish traditionalist but did not accept Jesus. The writer was showing how Jesus is better than the Law Reference the parable of the Sower

Where does it say in HEBREWS 10:26 they did not understand the Gospel? These are simply your words denying God's Word from the scriptures in the previous post you are quoting from. Only God's word is true and you have provided none to show that HEBREWS 10:26-39 is not a WARNING to believers not to depart the faith and return back to a life of known unrepentant sin.

 

[3rdAngel]

I have not ignored but examined scripture and shown your errors.

Nope, no you haven't. You have been provided God's Word. In response you argue against God's Word with your words. Therefore your argument is with God not me. Ignoring God's Word does not make it dissappear. What is it in the OP that you claim is not true? If you cannot show from the scriptures that have been provided that they are not true, why do you not believe them?

God's Sheep hear His Voice (the Word) and follow him. Those who are not God's Sheep do not hear and do not follow.

 

[37818]

The key phrase is HAVING PARTAKEN OF THE HOLY SPIRIT. In the NT, we never see any unbeliever receiving the Holy Spirit. This casts serious doubts upon the OSAS doctrine.

Everyone who rejects sanctification of the Spirit, partakes and resists so does not receive Him. ". . . he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment: Of sin, because they believe not on me; Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more; Of judgment, because the prince of this world is judged. . . ." -- John 16:7-11. ". . . always resist the Holy Ghost: . . ." -- Acts of the Apostles 7:51.

 

[3rdAngel]

I disagree - Jesus is our new Sabbath.

Then you should be able to find a scripture that says JESUS is the Sabbath. Yet there is none and it is God's Word alone that defines the "SABBATH" as the SEVENTH DAY of the week *EXODUS 20:8-11; MATTHEW 11:8. Your reading into the scripture something they are not teaching.

 

[loDebar]

Then you should be able to find a scripture that says JESUS is the Sabbath. Yet there is none and it is God's Word alone that defines the "SABBATH" as the SEVENTH DAY of the week *EXODUS 20:8-11; MATTHEW 11:8. Your reading into the scripture something they are not teaching.

Jesus is not the weekly Sabbath, We meet on Sunday because of the resurrection. The Sabbath is Law

 

[loDebar]

Nope, no you haven't. You have been provided God's Word. In response you argue against God's Word with your words. Therefore your argument is with God not me. Ignoring God's Word does not make it dissappear. What is it in the OP that you claim is not true? If you cannot show from the scriptures that have been provided that they are not true, why do you not believe them?

God's Sheep hear His Voice (the Word) and follow him. Those who are not God's Sheep do not hear and do not follow.

no you, and those who labor to get and keep salvation
The OP is wrong. I have shown the correct understanding and why your presentation is flawed from a simple English sentace structure. You interruption is wrong,

 

[loDebar]

Yes I apply all the scriptures to myself as all scripture is written for our admonition and we should believe and follow it. Ignoring God's Word does not make it dissappear. No I am not the speaker.

I have not ignored but examined scripture and shown your errors.[/QUOTE]

Do not apply scriptures to yourself but understand to whom it is written and why you should learn from it

Matt 27:5 Then Judas threw the silver coins down in the Temple and went out and hanged himself.

Luke 10:37 He said, “The one who showed him mercy.” And Jesus said to him, “You go, and do likewise.

 

[3rdAngel]

Jesus is not the weekly Sabbath, We meet on Sunday because of the resurrection. The Sabbath is Law

True JESUS is not the SABBATH. Where in God's Word does it say God's 4th commandment which is one of God's 10 commandments that give us a knowledge of GOOD and EVIL; Sin and Rightouesness *ROMANS 3:20; ROMANS 7:7; PSALMS 119:172; 1 JOHN 3:4 has now been abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day? JESUS did not come to abolish the law he came to fufill it *MATTHEW 5:17-19. Those who have been born again to love JESUS follow him *JOHN 14:15; 1 JOHN 2:1-4; 1 JOHN 3:3-10.

God's people are in every Church living up to all the knowedge that God has revealed to them *JOHN 10:16 and in times of ignorance when someone has not been given a knowledge of the truth God winks at but when God reveals his Word to us calls all men everywhere to repent and believe and follow His Word *ACTS 17:30-31. The hour is coming and now is that God's people are being called out from following man made teachings that lead us to break the commandments of God back to the pure Word of God. Our God is a Spirit and those who whoship him must worship him in Spirit and in truth *JOHN 4:23-24.

Those who have ears to hear will hear what the Spirit says. Those who do not will not hear because they are not His sheep.

God's Sheep hear His Voice (The Word of God) and follow him.

 

[3rdAngel]

no you, and those who labor to get and keep salvation The OP is wrong. I have shown the correct understanding and why your presentation is flawed from a simple English sentace structure. You interruption is wrong,

All I hear is your words denying God's Word that has only been shared in love and as a help to you so your argument is with God not me. We are only saved by GRACE through faith and not of ourselves it is a gift of God *EPHESIANS 2:8. OBEDIENCE to God's LAW is not how we are saved it is the FRUIT of God's work in us as we BELIEVE and FOLLOW his WORD by faith. Salvation is from sin (breaking any one of God’s 10 Commandments) not to continue in sin *ROMANS 6:1-23; JOHN 8:31-36. Those who continue in known unrepentant sin do not know God and need to be Born again into the NEW COVENANT promise to love *HEBREWS 8:10-12; ROMANS 13:8-10. This is God's work in us and a part of the NEW COVENANT promise *HEBREWS 8:10-12; PHILIPPIANS 2:13. If our faith has no fruit it is dead *JAMES 2:18-20; 26 and our tree will be cast down and thrown into the fire *MATTHEW 3:10; 7:19-20; 13:49-50.

Hope this helps

 

[Dave G]

Now where is the scripture that says God's 4th Commandments which is one of God's 10 commandments that give us a knowledge of what sin is has been abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day? There is none is there. It is interesting by the way that God starts off the 4th commandment *EXODUS 20:8-11 by stating "REMEMBER" as though he already knew that mostly everyone would "FORGET". Then we have the book of Daniel warning us that the man of sin would seek to change "TIMES AND LAWS" * DANIAL 7:25.

Who are we following by forgetting God's 4th commandment? Are we following God or man made teachings that break the commandments of God? If the second is that acceptable with God? I believe God's people are in every church but the hour is coming and now is that the true worshippers will be called out to return back to the pure Word of God because God is a Spirit and those who worship him must worship him in Spirit and in truth. What are your thoughts?

Are you Seventh Day Adventist?

EDIT:
Never mind, you just answered my question:

Then you should be able to find a scripture that says JESUS is the Sabbath. Yet there is none and it is God's Word alone that defines the "SABBATH" as the SEVENTH DAY of the week *EXODUS 20:8-11; MATTHEW 11:8. Your reading into the scripture something they are not teaching.

Thanks.

 

[Van]

HEBREWS 6:4-8 and HEBREWS 10:26-27 ARE WARNINGS TO BELIEVERS NOT TO DEPART THE FAITH

What I find amusing (well sad really) are those that are trying to argue that HEBREWS 6:4-8 and HEBREWS 10:26-38 are not direct warnings to believers not to depart the faith to return back to a life of known unrepentant sin despite these scriptures directly saying so.
SNIP

First lets start with Hebrews 6:1-9

6 Therefore leaving the elementary teaching about the Christ, let us press on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, 2 of instruction about washings and laying on of hands, and the resurrection of the dead and eternal judgment. 3 And this we will do, if God permits. 4 For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame. 7 For ground that drinks the rain which often falls on it and brings forth vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled, receives a blessing from God; 8 but if it yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless and close to being cursed, and it ends up being burned.

Note that the passage does not say "those who have once been enlightened" have been saved, born anew, regenerated, transferred into Christ, or have received reconciliation. Nope, they have heard and understood the gospel of Christ, the elementary teaching about the Christ.

Note that vague terms such as "tasted the heavenly gift" are interpreted to mean more hearing with understanding the gospel. Ditto for have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit. When we hear and understand the inspired gospel, we are partakers of the Holy Spirit. Ditto for tasted the good word.

Now there is no other gospel, if we reject or do not fully accept the gospel, or embrace it superficially (with no root) we will fall away when the going gets tough. It is impossible to change the gospel.

 

[loDebar]

He is lost by his reported Faith statement

 

[3rdAngel]

First lets start with Hebrews 6:1-9

6 Therefore leaving the elementary teaching about the Christ, let us press on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, 2 of instruction about washings and laying on of hands, and the resurrection of the dead and eternal judgment. 3 And this we will do, if God permits. 4 For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame. 7 For ground that drinks the rain which often falls on it and brings forth vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled, receives a blessing from God; 8 but if it yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless and close to being cursed, and it ends up being burned.

Note that the passage does not say "those who have once been enlightened" have been saved, born anew, regenerated, transferred into Christ, or have received reconciliation. Nope, they have heard and understood the gospel of Christ, the elementary teaching about the Christ.

Note that vague terms such as "tasted the heavenly gift" are interpreted to mean more hearing with understanding the gospel. Ditto for have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit. When we hear and understand the inspired gospel, we are partakers of the Holy Spirit. Ditto for tasted the good word.

Now there is no other gospel, if we reject or do not fully accept the gospel, or embrace it superficially (with no root) we will fall away when the going gets tough. It is impossible to change the gospel.

Hello Van, the scriptures say word for word in the rest of the post you snipped out...

1. They were once enlightened; HEBREWS 6:4
2. Having tasted of the Heavenly gift; HEBREWS 6:4
3. They were made partakers of the Holy Ghost; HEBREWS 6:4
4. Having tasted of the good Word of God; HEBREWS 6:5
5. Having tasted of the power of the world to come HEBREWS 6:5

So reviewing the CONTEXT of these scriptures we don't really need to say much, they speak for themselves. Yep, HEBREWS 6:4-8 very clearly show here that we are talking about BELIEVERS having fallen away from the HEAVENLY gift back into a life of sin crucifying the son of God afresh.

God bless

 

[Dave G]

So reviewing the CONTEXT of these scriptures we don't really need to say much, they speak for themselves. Yep, HEBREWS 6:4-8 very clearly show here that we are talking about BELIEVERS having fallen away from the HEAVENLY gift back into a life of sin crucifying the son of God afresh.

If one takes those verses all by themselves, they certainly do seem to support that idea.

But there's a problem...
You keep forgetting Christ's promises to His sheep.
Promises that, if broken, make Him a liar:

" Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. " ( John 5:24 ).

Those that believe have everlasting life, and...get this...shall not come into condemnation.
Those that believe are kept by the power of God ( 1 Peter 1:5 ).

Those that do not believe are called unbelievers.
There is no gray area.

Those that once "believed" are called "tares", and were sown in the field of Christ's "wheat" by His enemy ( read Matthew 13 )...they are, in reality, the children of the devil and were never the children of God.

Therefore, they did not genuinely believe....because if they did, they would be the children of God, who Jesus said none will be lost ( John 6:39 ), and nothing shall separate them from the love of God ( Romans 8:31-39 ).

Again, for the true believer whom God has chosen and caused to approach Him ( Psalms 65:4 ), He is their Saviour and will never leave or forsake them.

Did you get that, @3rdAngel ?

He will never leave them ( Hebrews 13:5 ).
For a person to lose their salvation, God's Spirit must leave them.

 

[Dave G]

Then you should be able to find a scripture that says JESUS is the Sabbath.

There isn't one that says "Jesus is the Sabbath".
But He did say this:

" For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day." ( Matthew 12:8 ).

He also said,
" And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:" ( Mark 2:27 ).

Therefore, I encourage you to take your eyes off the Sabbath, and put them on the Lord of the Sabbath...and remember:

" Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath [days]:
17 which are a shadow of things to come; but the body [is] of Christ." ( Colossians 2:16-17 ).

 

[HankD]

Then you should be able to find a scripture that says JESUS is the Sabbath. Yet there is none and it is God's Word alone that defines the "SABBATH" as the SEVENTH DAY of the week *EXODUS 20:8-11; MATTHEW 11:8. Your reading into the scripture something they are not teaching.

do you believe God is a Trinity then you should be able to find a verse that says God is a Trinity yet there is none.

Hebrews 4
7 Therefore God again set a certain day, calling it Today, when a long time later he spoke through David, as was said before: "Today, if you hear his voice, do not harden your hearts."
8 For if Joshua had given them rest, God would not have spoken later about another day.
9 There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God;
10 for anyone who enters God's rest also rests from his own work, just as God did from his.

 

[Dave G]

do you believe God is a Trinity then you should be able to find a verse that says God is a Trinity yet there is none.

" For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one." ( 1 John 5:7 ).

Well, not in those exact words...