Was Death for Man Only Spiritual in Genesis?

[Marcia]

On another thread, a few have said they think that when man suffered death as a consequence for sin, it was only spiritual (separation from God).

What do you think? If you think it was also physical death, what evidence in the Bible is there for that? I think there is plenty but would like to hear from others.

 

[Scarlett O.]

I said both.

They hid themselves and eventually God cast them away from His presence in the Garden. I would think that would be spiritual in nature.

Also, “Just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so sin spread through all men” (Romans 5:12), tells us that not not was physical death a punishment for Adam and Eve, but for all of us.

God did not lie. He said that they would surely die if they disobeyed.

And they did.

 

[canadyjd]

If you think it was also physical death, what evidence in the Bible is there for that? I think there is plenty but would like to hear from others.

I believe God meant both physical and spiritual death.

When God killed the animals to make clothes for Adam and Eve, I believe He showed mercy and instituted animal sacrifice as a way to foreshadow Christ's sacrifice for sins.

peace to youraying:

 

[Marcia]

Where are all the posters from the other thread who think death was only spiritual for Adam and Eve?

 

[preachinjesus]

It seems the Bible is clear that the death was spiritual and physical.

 

[David Michael Harris]

I went for not sure, as I really do not know. I just find it hard to grasp that man could not eventually grow old and die peacefully in God. In Him we live and move and have our being.
Flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God/heaven. Someone once said to me in a Bible study that when God said 'you will surely die' it apparently means a double death. 'In dying you will surely die' Back to the Book I suppose.

 

[Darrenss1]

Where are all the posters from the other thread who think death was only spiritual for Adam and Eve?

The other thread was different, did death exist in the earth before Adam and Eve sinned?? The key word here in this thread is "for man". Different context. Of course Adam and Eve's sin caused both spiritual and physical death for mankind from that day forward, not one poster denied that. However the death of Adam and Eve did coincide with the fruit of the Tree of life as God said that they could, after they sinned, eat of the fruit and live forever. So being cut off from the fruit of the tree of life mankind would not live forever.

A better question would be, was Adam and Eve created immortal that they could not die before the fall and therefore their children would be likewise born immortal as well??

Darren

 

[ReformedBaptist]

While it is an interesting discussion, whether or not Adam and his posterity could be or would have been immortal is irrelevant. There is no teaching in the Scripture to this regard.

Not to put anyone down, but I think its just a stupid question that detracts from the Gospel.

Death in the world before sin, the death spoken as being physical...this is relevant to the GOspel.

 

[OldRegular]

Eve yielding to temptation; Adam sinned with deliberate intent; thus death entered the creation of God, both physical death and spiritual death. With spiritual death Adam and Eve also lost the unfettered ability to freely choose; that ability was now marred by the influence of their sinful nature. That nature which had been created upright [Ecclesiastes 7:29] was, because of willful rebellion against God, a nature that was in bondage to sin. When Adam and Eve sinned they immediately suffered spiritual death, alienation from God. At the same time those natural processes that result in physical death were set in motion and Adam and Eve slowly began to die.

Moreover, through the rebellion of Adam all successive generations of mankind have been heirs to a nature in bondage to sin, alienated toward God and subject to the wrath of God. The Apostle Paul tells us that death came not only to Adam and Eve but that, because of their transgression, death came to all mankind. All descendants of Adam and Eve are heirs not only to physical death but to spiritual death.

Romans 5:12, KJV
12. Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

 

[blackbird]

While it is an interesting discussion, whether or not Adam and his posterity could be or would have been immortal is irrelevant. There is no teaching in the Scripture to this regard.



Death in the world before sin, the death spoken as being physical...this is relevant to the GOspel.

There was no death in the world before Adam's sin

When Adam disobeyed---his spirit/soul entered into death--IOW--spiritually--he died--thus as Scripture reveals--we all are born into death--we are born spiritually dead

So--at moment of disobedience--Adam's spirit died

It took a little while longer for death to catch up with Adam's physical body, though---just like its gonna take death just a little while to catch up with all of us---physically

Genesis 5:5 teaches, "And all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years: and he died"

 

[ReformedBaptist]

There was no death in the world before Adam's sin

When Adam disobeyed---his spirit/soul entered into death--IOW--spiritually--he died--thus as Scripture reveals--we all are born into death--we are born spiritually dead

So--at moment of disobedience--Adam's spirit died

It took a little while longer for death to catch up with Adam's physical body, though---just like its gonna take death just a little while to catch up with all of us---physically

Genesis 5:5 teaches, "And all the days that Adam lived were nine hundred and thirty years: and he died"

I know this is the common view today, but I am not seeing this in Scripture, except maybe by inference. The death spoken of by God to Adam must be physical, otherwise it seems to me to render Jesus being the Second Adam, and the incarnation, meaningless.

Where, in your view, does the Scripture speak of a spirit being dead?

 

[Darrenss1]

Romans 5:12, KJV
12. Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

OK so world in Rom 5:12 suddenly means everything,, all life and animals, reptiles, marine life, every thing walks the earth, is the world. THAN Paul said "AND SO" death passed upon ALL men for ALL the World (that is, those in the world that COULD sin) have sinned AND THAT is the world Paul is talking about!! God so loved the world, that God loved all the cats and dogs and cows and sheep and goats and fish and wild life, birds and MANKIND that GOD gave HIS only begotten SON to save ALL life on earth (the WORLD)??

The gospel is to be preached in the whole world - to the farm animals, to the fish, to the wild animals, to the birds that ANY of them whom put their trust in Jesus can be saved!! That's how some of you are rendering world in Rom 5:12.

Darren

 

[David Michael Harris]

OK so world in Rom 5:12 suddenly means everything,, all life and animals, reptiles, marine life, every thing walks the earth, is the world. THAN Paul said "AND SO" death passed upon ALL men for ALL the World (that is, those in the world that COULD sin) have sinned AND THAT is the world Paul is talking about!! God so loved the world, that God loved all the cats and dogs and cows and sheep and goats and fish and wild life, birds and MANKIND that GOD gave HIS only begotten SON to save ALL life on earth (the WORLD)??

The gospel is to be preached in the whole world - to the farm animals, to the fish, to the wild animals, to the birds that ANY of them whom put their trust in Jesus can be saved!! That's how some of you are rendering world in Rom 5:12.

Darren

This is a good point.

I see this a lot these days, Bible words beginning to mean a whole lot more than what they should.

I mean, geez, even our pets are going to heaven! Is the Bible being sanitized to meet our personal distractive needs?

What ever happened to potter and clay with regards to men. Yet suddenly our pets are more important than human souls?

The Bible is about God and mankind. Are we losing this picture?

Who abides for ever? After all the world an everything in it is passing away.

Thats a quote from John btw.

 

[pinoybaptist]

My parakeets poop on me when I preach to them, and my dog tucks his tail too far and look at me with those doleful eyes I couldn't bear to tell him he's a sinner.

oh, my gawrsh, well, at least I tried, right ?

 

[David Michael Harris]

My parakeets poop on me when I preach to them, and my dog tucks his tail too far and look at me with those doleful eyes I couldn't bear to tell him he's a sinner.

oh, my gawrsh, well, at least I tried, right ?

Maybe they might listen one day, repent and be saved

 

[pinoybaptist]

world [/U]- to the farm animals, to the fish, to the wild animals, to the birds that ANY of them whom put their trust in Jesus can be saved!! That's how some of you are rendering world in Rom 5:12.

Darren

You forgot to add the insects. You know, termites, ants, cockroaches, flies, mosquitoes.

We don't really have to go far to preach the gospel, if that's the case, right ?

But the problem would be hornets, fire ants. Then there are the big creatures like the jaguars, the pumas, the cheetahs. Can almost see this preacher, he's been trained to sprint, and for good reason too, cheetahs can't seem to get rid of him, either they're running away from him, or he's running away from them.

But seriously now, this is beyond ridiculous.

 

[Marcia]

The other thread was different, did death exist in the earth before Adam and Eve sinned?? The key word here in this thread is "for man". Different context. Of course Adam and Eve's sin caused both spiritual and physical death for mankind from that day forward, not one poster denied that. However the death of Adam and Eve did coincide with the fruit of the Tree of life as God said that they could, after they sinned, eat of the fruit and live forever. So being cut off from the fruit of the tree of life mankind would not live forever.

But some on the other thread speculated that death for Adam and Eve might have been spiritual, not physical. Hence, this thread. Just look at posts 6, 44, 46, 64 on the other thread speculating on this. And so far, 1 here has voted "yes" to the question and 2 "not sure."

A better question would be, was Adam and Eve created immortal that they could not die before the fall and therefore their children would be likewise born immortal as well??

Yes, that would be a good but slightly different question, though related. You could start a thread on that.

 

[Marcia]

OK so world in Rom 5:12 suddenly means everything,, all life and animals, reptiles, marine life, every thing walks the earth, is the world. THAN Paul said "AND SO" death passed upon ALL men for ALL the World (that is, those in the world that COULD sin) have sinned AND THAT is the world Paul is talking about!! God so loved the world, that God loved all the cats and dogs and cows and sheep and goats and fish and wild life, birds and MANKIND that GOD gave HIS only begotten SON to save ALL life on earth (the WORLD)??

The gospel is to be preached in the whole world - to the farm animals, to the fish, to the wild animals, to the birds that ANY of them whom put their trust in Jesus can be saved!! That's how some of you are rendering world in Rom 5:12.

Darren

I think because "creation is groaning for redemption," we need to see that as meaning something, especially with the ground and animals being cursed in Gen. 3.
4The LORD God said to the serpent,
"Because you have done this,
Cursed are you more than all cattle,
And more than every beast of the field;

So the animals were cursed; the serpent cursed more -- because of sin. The animals were not cursed before sin; everything was good.

Cursed is the ground because of you;

The land is cursed. So creation (land and animals) are cursed after sin.

Also, Is. 11 gives us a picture that has to do with animals.

6And the wolf will dwell with the lamb,
And the leopard will lie down with the young goat,
And the calf and the young lion and the fatling together;
And a little boy will lead them.
7Also the cow and the bear will graze,
Their young will lie down together,
And the lion will eat straw like the ox.

What is this depicting? Does it not seem that redemption (not salvation from hell) from corruption and death is for creation as well?

 

[OldRegular]

OK so world in Rom 5:12 suddenly means everything,, all life and animals, reptiles, marine life, every thing walks the earth, is the world. THAN Paul said "AND SO" death passed upon ALL men for ALL the World (that is, those in the world that COULD sin) have sinned AND THAT is the world Paul is talking about!! God so loved the world, that God loved all the cats and dogs and cows and sheep and goats and fish and wild life, birds and MANKIND that GOD gave HIS only begotten SON to save ALL life on earth (the WORLD)??

The gospel is to be preached in the whole world - to the farm animals, to the fish, to the wild animals, to the birds that ANY of them whom put their trust in Jesus can be saved!! That's how some of you are rendering world in Rom 5:12.

Darren

Sport! You are way in over your head. You obviously have no idea what Paul was talking about or what I was talking about. Come up for air before you drown, mature substantially, and then have another try!

 

[OldRegular]

You forgot to add the insects. You know, termites, ants, cockroaches, flies, mosquitoes.

We don't really have to go far to preach the gospel, if that's the case, right ?

But the problem would be hornets, fire ants. Then there are the big creatures like the jaguars, the pumas, the cheetahs. Can almost see this preacher, he's been trained to sprint, and for good reason too, cheetahs can't seem to get rid of him, either they're running away from him, or he's running away from them.

But seriously now, this is beyond ridiculous.

OK pinoy! Leave the fire ants alone. That is just going too far with this preaching stuff.