Was it Wrong to Drop the Atom Bomb on Japan?

[Revmitchell]

It was wrong on several counts. But first I want to ask anyone here to give me a verse or passage that would show such a drastic action was right. Try to keep it in the New Testament,surely a clearer revelation of the heart of God on moral and spiritual matters.

Here is how it is wrong:
1. “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the great and first commandment. And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself."

Are the Japanese our neighbors?

There are many other verses that could be brought up but this passage is foremost.

2. The Japanese were at the point of surrender. In fact months before they had shown willingness to surrender to terms that were basically identical to the terms the US later accepted. But the US refused the earlier offer.

Was Hiroshima Necessary?
The War Was Won Before Hiroshima—And the Generals Who Dropped the Bomb Knew It

3. It is purely propaganda that the Japanese would "fight to the last man". It is a way for America - and Americans - to not feel the weight of the horrible atrocity they committed - and continue to justify. We rightly fault the Japanese for not acknowledging their criminal actions in the past, like their enslavement of enemy women for their own uses, but refuse to acknowledge our own misdeeds.

BTW, a visit to Hiroshima two years ago was very enlightening. Did you know that ground zero in Hiroshima was not near any major military target but was a high-density population area, including several schools? The nearest base, which we also visited was on a hillside a mile or so to the north (if memory serves). The second link above goes into more detail about the US rationale in targeting. It was not military.

We had this new invention and our military leadership were itching to use it in a "real life situation".

It is sad that Christians - of all people - go along with our country's propaganda in continuing to justify this most unChristian mass killing. A killing that has extended for decades and two or three generations in its outworking.

Or do we not believe that our government is capable of propaganda?

Number 1 is a misapplication of scripture. If someone comes into your house to rob and murder your family are you going to love them.

Number 2 is just flat out not true.

 

[HankD]

After the fact surmising - it will go on until the LORD returns (Sorry Tom A, He hasn't yet) .

 

[atpollard]

And how many Japanese Daddies (some of them Christian) died because of our hasty action?

105,000 killed in the Hiroshima and Nagasaki Bombings (so roughly 50,000 'daddies').

Here was the alternative:
"A study done for Secretary of War Henry Stimson's staff by William Shockley estimated that conquering Japan would cost 1.7–4 million American casualties, including 400,000–800,000 fatalities, and five to ten million Japanese fatalities."

Fun Fact, the 'Purple Hearts' manufactured and stockpiled in preparation for the invasion of Japan are still being awarded to US soldiers (with new ribbons added to 120,000 in stock in 1985).

Look at the Battle of Okinawa, the last battle before the invasion of Japan, for an example of what to expect. 14,000 US killed, 76,000 Japanese killed, 13,000 Okinawan conscripts killed, and 50% of the civilian population (about 150,000 people) killed.

Dropping the Bomb saved an estimated 0.4 to 0.8 million US lives and 4.9 to 9.9 million Japanese lives.

 

[Yeshua1]

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1730614303648085

It was bad in how many Japanese died as a result, but the alternative was much worse, as the best estimates were that the Allied Forced would have to go into house to house combat, and millions more would have died!

 

[JonC]

It was bad in how many Japanese died as a result, but the alternative was much worse, as the best estimates were that the Allied Forced would have to go into house to house combat, and millions more would have died!

6 August - Hiroshima bombed.
8 August - The Soviet Union declared war on Japan.
9 August - 1 minute past midnight - Soviet invasion.
9 August - Supreme Counsel meets to discuss unconditional surrender.
9 August - Around 11 Nagasaki is bombed.

Nagasaki probably had no consequence in terms of Japan's surrender. The determining factor could very well have been the Soviet invasion.

 

[Yeshua1]

6 August - Hiroshima bombed.
8 August - The Soviet Union declared war on Japan.
9 August - 1 minute past midnight - Soviet invasion.
9 August - Supreme Counsel meets to discuss unconditional surrender.
9 August - Around 11 Nagasaki is bombed.

Nagasaki probably had no consequence in terms of Japan's surrender. The determining factor could very well have been the Soviet invasion.

Could have been, but we could not control what Russia was going to do!

 

[JonC]

Could have been, but we could not control what Russia was going to do!

They invaded Japan before we bombed Nagasaki. The counsel was meeting before we bombed Nagasaki. The second bomb may not have been necessary (Japan stated it was not relevant to their surrender, it was just civilian lives lost).

 

[HankD]

The Japanese surrendered to The US

Google Image Result for https://cdn.history.com/sites/2/2014/02/douglas-macarthur-and-hsu-yungchang-P.jpeg

 

[HankD]

105,000 killed in the Hiroshima and Nagasaki Bombings (so roughly 50,000 'daddies').

Actually most of the the daddies were away at war so, sadly most of the deaths were "innocents" (The elderly, women and children).

Secondly, the death rate was much higher after the 1st year as many succumbed to radiation poisoning, burns, etc...

Sadly, It was "hell on earth"

But Hirohito brought it on for his people.

 

[atpollard]

Actually most of the the daddies were away at war so, sadly most of the deaths were "innocents" (The elderly, women and children).

Secondly, the death rate was much higher after the 1st year as many succumbed to radiation poisoning, burns, etc...

Sadly, It was "hell on earth"

But Hirohito brought it on for his people.

I read 50% died immediately and most of the rest over about 4 months. There were close to 200,000 caualties, but only about 105,000 total fatalities. You could be right about the number of Daddies, though. However both cities had major defense industries, so someone had to be making the airplanes and munitions in those factories. I only mention it because my Grandfather was denied enlistment when he tried to sign up for WW2 because his job as a chemist at the Bakelite Plant was vital to making those domes for the radar noses on night fighters ... so Japan might have had people whose war job was to work at the factories.

 

[HankD]

I read 50% died immediately and most of the rest over about 4 months. There were close to 200,000 caualties, but only about 105,000 total fatalities. You could be right about the number of Daddies, though. However both cities had major defense industries, so someone had to be making the airplanes and munitions in those factories. I only mention it because my Grandfather was denied enlistment when he tried to sign up for WW2 because his job as a chemist at the Bakelite Plant was vital to making those domes for the radar noses on night fighters ... so Japan might have had people whose war job was to work at the factories.

OK, my mother worked at a tank making factory because so many of the daddys were away at war, I believe the Japanese women did likewise.
My father was a chemical warfare officer in the Philippines, He was a pharmacist otherwise.

 

[Rob_BW]

Don't start nothin', won't be nothin'.

 

[asterisktom]

105,000 killed in the Hiroshima and Nagasaki Bombings (so roughly 50,000 'daddies').

Here was the alternative:
"A study done for Secretary of War Henry Stimson's staff by William Shockley estimated that conquering Japan would cost 1.7–4 million American casualties, including 400,000–800,000 fatalities, and five to ten million Japanese fatalities."

Fun Fact, the 'Purple Hearts' manufactured and stockpiled in preparation for the invasion of Japan are still being awarded to US soldiers (with new ribbons added to 120,000 in stock in 1985).

Look at the Battle of Okinawa, the last battle before the invasion of Japan, for an example of what to expect. 14,000 US killed, 76,000 Japanese killed, 13,000 Okinawan conscripts killed, and 50% of the civilian population (about 150,000 people) killed.

Dropping the Bomb saved an estimated 0.4 to 0.8 million US lives and 4.9 to 9.9 million Japanese lives.

You missed my points in my post. And you are just repeating the line we have been fed.

 

[asterisktom]

Number 1 is a misapplication of scripture. If someone comes into your house to rob and murder your family are you going to love them.

Number 2 is just flat out not true.

Oh, please. Did all of the population of Hiroshima and Nagasaki come into our "house and rob and murder"?

I will get to number 2 later.

And, once again, show me a passage justifying what we did.

 

[Salty]

Oh, please. Did all of the population of Hiroshima and Nagasaki come into our "house and rob and murder"? .

If an American GI for whatever reason was found to be walking the streets in Hiroshima or Nagasaki -
What action would a Japanese civilian do- either turn that GI in or kill the GI himself.

 

[thatbrian]

When Adam sinned, the entire world suffered the consequences. When leaders bring their counties into war, those countries will bear the consequences, good or bad.

If we had not dropped "the bomb" and if Japan had won the war, the very people who were killed, would have instead been taking my grandparents home, or working as guards in POW camps. . . You can't have both ways. If they would reap the "reward" of a Japan victory, they should suffer the pain of defeat.

The world is so designed that we do live individualistically. Our sins hurt others. Our lives well-lived help others. Leaders of countries or families make decisions that directly impact those under them.

 

[supersoldier71]

It was the correct political, military and moral thing.

What is more problematic for Christians is if we're happy about killing. We don't get to rejoice in the deaths of image-bearers of God.

If we can mourn the lives lost to abortion, we can mourn the lives lost to war, particularly non-combatants who had nothing to do with the Empire of Japan's decision making.

 

[asterisktom]

Number 2 is just flat out not true.

Your wanting #2 not to be true does not make it so. The Japanese, in fact, were at the end of their rope. Consider these quotes from the link that you probably didn't bother reading:

Henry H. ("Hap") Arnold, commanding General of the Army air forces, declared in his 1949 memoirs: "It always appeared to us, atomic bomb or no atomic bomb, the Japanese were already on the verge of collapse." This was confirmed by former Japanese prime minister Fumimaro Konoye, who said: "Fundamentally, the thing that brought about the determination to make peace was the prolonged bombing by the B-29s."

“The use of this barbarous weapon…was of no material assistance in our war against Japan.” —Adm. William Leahy, Truman's Chief of Staff

That bombing by the B-29s culminated in the air raids on Tokyo that, in the words of General Curtis LeMay, were to "bomb them back to the Stone Age". (Later LeMay tried to shift the blame on this quote to his overzealous ghost-writer. But Lemay also said, "(A)ll war is immoral and if you let that bother you, you're not a good soldier."

But we Christians, if we are good soldiers of Jesus Christ, should let it bother us.

Does 2 Timothy 3:16-17 on this topic? I think it does.
"All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works."

In other words, the Bible speaks to all spiritual and moral issues. (Whether or not we hear It is another issue). SO, is the bombing a moral issue? Of course. it is. So, once again, does any one have passages to justify what we did?

Edit: Here is the fuller quote from Admiral Lehy:

"Adm. William Leahy, President Truman’s Chief of Staff, wrote in his 1950 memoir I Was There that “the use of this barbarous weapon at Hiroshima and Nagasaki was of no material assistance in our war against Japan. The Japanese were already defeated and ready to surrender.… in being the first to use it, we…adopted an ethical standard common to the barbarians of the Dark Ages. I was not taught to make war in that fashion, and wars cannot be won by destroying women and children.”

The War Was Won Before Hiroshima—And the Generals Who Dropped the Bomb Knew It

 

[asterisktom]

It was the correct political, military and moral thing.

How is the killing of helpless civilians moral? Especially since it was no longer necessary to end the war (per the quotes I shared)? Many of these were Christians.Ever since the Meiji Restoration missionaries form all denominations were allowed to proselyte in Japan. When we were there we saw a number of churches that had a long lineage.

But, in order to justify our killing of these people, we need to not think of that but reduce these humans to "cancer cells" as Hank refers to them, or lump them all simplistically as robbers and murderers as Rev does.

 

[asterisktom]

When Adam sinned, the entire world suffered the consequences. When leaders bring their counties into war, those countries will bear the consequences, good or bad.

If we had not dropped "the bomb" and if Japan had won the war, the very people who were killed, would have instead been taking my grandparents home, or working as guards in POW camps. . . You can't have both ways. If they would reap the "reward" of a Japan victory, they should suffer the pain of defeat.

The world is so designed that we do live individualistically. Our sins hurt others. Our lives well-lived help others. Leaders of countries or families make decisions that directly impact those under them.

The real culpability of leaders, Japanese or Americans, does not exculpate individuals of those nations - especially those who say "Amen" to the actions of those leaders.