Was James Written to Believers?

[Havensdad]

Please show me where this was written to the universal church. It was written to the Jews.

Most of the OT was written to the Jews as well. This does not mean we cannot read it, nor does it mean we cannot apply truths found there. No one has rejected any book. But we must be aware of the context and setting of each book to understand it.

Good post.

For example, what does this mean:

Jas 2:14 What good is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can that faith save him?

Well, the OBVIOUS meaning, is that "faith" that does not produce works, does not produce salvation. I believe this is the correct interpretation.

However, if you place artificial limitations on the text, and say "This text is ONLY addressing saved Christians!", it Changes the interpretation. The problem is, nowhere in the text of James, is the statement "This letter is only to the saved". That being the case, normal rules of writing to a group would be applicable, and it would be necessary that it was written to groups of Jews, both saved, and unsaved.

 

[Jarthur001]

Good post.

For example, what does this mean:

Jas 2:14 What good is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can that faith save him?

Well, the OBVIOUS meaning, is that "faith" that does not produce works, does not produce salvation. I believe this is the correct interpretation.

However, if you place artificial limitations on the text, and say "This text is ONLY addressing saved Christians!", it Changes the interpretation. The problem is, nowhere in the text of James, is the statement "This letter is only to the saved". That being the case, normal rules of writing to a group would be applicable, and it would be necessary that it was written to groups of Jews, both saved, and unsaved.

Most of the book of james can be summarized to this statement...

"Show me your love"

Just as when we walk into a persons house for the 1st time we can see many of their loves by what we see hanging on the walls, we should be able to see the faith that we love.

If I say I love Basketball and never watch a game on TV, never go to a game, never read the sports pages, and you see no basketballs, or basketball posters, or basketball cards...or anything that has something to do with basketball, then where is the love that I say I have for basketball?

 

[donnA]

James is a part of the word of God, written to all beleivers through all times. Otherwise we could make excuses about which books or parts of the NT that did not apply to us because it wasn't written to us.

 

[EdSutton]

And so, you eliminate anything that could disprove your own skewed theology. By limiting the writings to addressing ONLY truly saved individuals, instead of the entire assemblies made up of believers and unbelievers, which they are actually written to, you take the teeth out of the difficult passages, and you are able to make yourself feel better, by placing everyone in heaven in your mind.

Verse 2:14 is CLEARLY saying, that a faith that does not produce works, is not a saving faith. An individual that has this dead (or "nothing")faith, is bound for Hell.

James is addressed to the twelve tribes scattered abroad, as another noted. (Jas. 1:1)

However, this would appear to be adressing believers among the twelve tribes, as opposed to unbelieving of the twelve tribes, because He calls them "brethren" (1:2 plus 14 other instances); brother (or sister) (2:15) five additional times; speaks of our Lord Jesus Christ (2:1); and seemingly speaks of a church family, (5: 13-16) with a specific reference to the elders of the church (5:14).

None of this seems consistent with referring to unbelievers, I would offer.

Regardless of whether or not my own theology is 'skewed'.

And, similar to what another asked, I would ask if Jas. 2:14 speaks any more "CLEARLY" than does Rom. 4:1-8? Also where exactly does Scripture make the declaration that "an individual that has this dead (or "nothing") faith, is bound for Hell."? I simply don't recall reading that anywhere, although I do recall reading that eternal condemnation is based on "believing not" (Jn. 3:18), and that eternal damnation is for those who blaspheme the Holy Spirit (Mk. 3:29).

Ed

 

[Lou Martuneac]

In reading James, I do not for the life of me see how it's written to unbelievers.

Marcia:

The text shows it was NOT written to unbelievers, but when LS, as defined by John MacArthur, comes to James 4:7-10, they view and redefine that as the plan of salvation FOR unbelievers, the lost.

MacArthur looks at the passage and writes,

“One of the most comprehensive invitations to salvation in all the epistles comes in James 4:7-10... The invitation in 4:7-10 is directed at those who are not saved...”

This is the passage Dr. MacArthur refers to as an “invitation to salvation.”

“Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you. Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded. Be afflicted, and mourn, and weep: let your laughter be turned to mourning, and your joy to heaviness. Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up,” (James 4:7-10).

At this point I want to remind readers that the crux of the Lordship Salvation controversy is with the requirement FOR salvation, NOT what should be the natural results of a genuine conversion. In this section on the James passage MacArthur is making his application to, “those who are not saved.”

Is the epistle of James, “directed at those who are not saved?” The epistle begins, “James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting. My brethren, count it all joy…,” (James 1:1-2). “Brethren” appears approximately 190 times in the New Testament, and when does appear it is used almost exclusively in reference to born again Christians.

Regardless of who we think James was writing to- MacArthur's LS views the instructions in 4:7-10 as instruction "those who are not saved," to unbelievers on what they must DO to become believers.


LM

 

[webdog]

Please show me where this was written to the universal church. It was written to the Jews.

Most of the OT was written to the Jews as well. This does not mean we cannot read it, nor does it mean we cannot apply truths found there. No one has rejected any book. But we must be aware of the context and setting of each book to understand it.

No, it was written to the 12 tribes of the dispersion...the early persecuted church. There is no way you can apply James to unbelievers. By doing that, you have added another gospel...one of works. That's a healthy dose of reality

 

[Havensdad]

James is addressed to the twelve tribes scattered abroad, as another noted. (Jas. 1:1)

However, this would appear to be adressing believers among the twelve tribes, as opposed to unbelieving of the twelve tribes, because He calls them "brethren" (1:2 plus 14 other instances); brother (or sister) (2:15) five additional times; speaks of our Lord Jesus Christ (2:1); and seemingly speaks of a church family, (5: 13-16) with a specific reference to the elders of the church (5:14).

None of this seems consistent with referring to unbelievers, I would offer.

It was a common practice for Jews to call one another "brother".

Also where exactly does Scripture make the declaration that "an individual that has this dead (or "nothing") faith, is bound for Hell."? I simply don't recall reading that anywhere, although I do recall reading that eternal condemnation is based on "believing not" (Jn. 3:18), and that eternal damnation is for those who blaspheme the Holy Spirit (Mk. 3:29).

Ed

Uh, right within the verse. The person who has "dead" faith, is not saved. Therefore they are bound for eternal damnation. What do you think they are not "saved" from, rabid polar bears?

The word "believe" in Jn 3:18, is the same word as the word "faith" in 2:14. John 2:14 COULD just as easily read in English "can that 'belief' save him"?

ALSO> the word "sodezo", for "save" is the same word used throughout the New Testament, to refer to salvation.

People who "skew" this verse, have an unbelievably obvious agenda.

In regards to Romans: keep reading.

Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
Rom 6:2 God forbid. We who died to sin, how shall we any longer live therein?


Romans 4:1-8 simply states that we are justified apart from works of the LAW> it does not state that you can act against your stated belief.

If you believe a train is coming, you get off the track. Those who say they believe, but do not act in accordance with that belief, are called "hypocrites" in the NT, and are condemned.

 

[Havensdad]

No, it was written to the 12 tribes of the dispersion...the early persecuted church. There is no way you can apply James to unbelievers. By doing that, you have added another gospel...one of works. That's a healthy dose of reality

Again, why would the rules of writing and speaking be different than they are today?

If I am preaching at my church, and only members are present, and yet I give an invitation and tell them to come to the Lord Jesus, does that mean they must interpret it to mean some kind of second stage of Christianity? Or does it simply mean that I know scripture talks about tares among the wheat, and I am aware that there are unsaved in our midst?

What does it mean when James states that a faith that does not produce works cannot save anyone? Are we to reach and get some completely new meaning for "sodezo"? "Saving faith" is faith that produces works.

 

[donnA]

Why would anyone write instructuions for christians on living a christian life, to unbelievers?

 

[webdog]

Why would anyone write instructuions for christians on living a christian life, to unbelievers?

It really makes no sense.

 

[Havensdad]

Why would anyone write instructuions for christians on living a christian life, to unbelievers?

Evangelists do it all the time. When your writing to an assembly, a gathering of Christians/Jews in a local area, you have to address the saved and the unsaved. Just as books such as Jude address, many false believers had gotten into the churches.

What doesn't make sense, is to just say "Everything in James is addressing Christian living", when some of it specifically says it is addressing matters of salvation. James says that Faith that doesn't produce works cannot save, not...

"What good is it if someone says they have faith, but does not have works? Can that faith bring him "fullfillment in their Christian life"?

That is not what it says. It says a faith(belief) that does not bring works, cannot SAVE.

 

[EdSutton]

It was a common practice for Jews to call one another "brother".

Uh, right within the verse. The person who has "dead" faith, is not saved. Therefore they are bound for eternal damnation. What do you think they are not "saved" from, rabid polar bears?

The word "believe" in Jn 3:18, is the same word as the word "faith" in 2:14. John 2:14 COULD just as easily read in English "can that 'belief' save him"?

ALSO> the word "sodezo", for "save" is the same word used throughout the New Testament, to refer to salvation.

People who "skew" this verse, have an unbelievably obvious agenda.

In regards to Romans: keep reading.

Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
Rom 6:2 God forbid. We who died to sin, how shall we any longer live therein?


Romans 4:1-8 simply states that we are justified apart from works of the LAW> it does not state that you can act against your stated belief.

If you believe a train is coming, you get off the track. Those who say they believe, but do not act in accordance with that belief, are called "hypocrites" in the NT, and are condemned.

Thanks for the 'Greek' lesion, 'er I mean lesson.

I believe if you were to re-check, you would find that the word for save is "σῶζω" or "sOzO" (to use my 'system' of transliterating) or as others have done, "swzw", which is a word used in Jas. 2:14. Yes, the word "sOzO" certainly is the one rendered as 'save', however, the word in Jn. 3:18, in all three instances is a verb, "pisteuO", while the other referred word in Jas. 2:14 is the noun, "pistis", which is, I grant, 'derived' from "pisteuO', but is not exactly the same word.

I do, however, believe that you are placing undue emphasis on "save" and "dead faith", in your reading of Jas. 2, while 'downplaying', as it were, the idea of "profit" (or one's rewards.) I do not believe eternal salvation is ever spoken of as "profit" but rather it is "the 'free gift' of God." "Justified" and "you see", in the context, as well as the concept of practical service, found in the verses immediately preceding this, but seem to get 'short shrift', as well. Not to mention, a question of "before whom" ("one of you..."; "Someone will say...". and "You see, then") There is a mention of Abraham, in the context, as well.

"When", Biblically, was Abraham justified? When he offered up his son, Isaac, as referenced here?

Or 25 years prior to this, when 'Abraham believed in the Lord, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness?'

The answer is both; Abraham was justified, i.e, declared righteous, before God, by his faith, and that only, and that by God, before he was even known as Abraham, there and before God even re-confirmed His covenant with Abraham. Did you notice that God, alone, walked "through the pieces" binding Himself (but not Abraham) to the conditions of that covenant?? (Gen. 15:6, 9-18; Rom. 4:3; Gal. 3:6; Jas. 2:23) Abraham was justifed before man, by his 'works', when he offered up Isaac, as this 'faith' (and the declaration of him as righteous) was fulfilled at this time. "You see then, that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only." But God sees not as a man sees, but God looks on the heart (I Sma. 16:7), something that is impossible for man, hence this is said, and here (not 25 years before) Abraham is now called 'the Friend of God.'

Saved? From what? The physical suffering in the Tribulation that occurs and no one would physically be 'saved' unless the days be shortened (Mk. 13:20?; "a soul from death" (Jas. 5:20)?; the sick (Jas. 5:15)?; from wrath (Rom. 5:9)?; "the fire" at the judgment seat of works for a Christian (I Cor. 3:11-15)?; "from our/their sins" (Mt. 1:21)?; physically from the Sea (Ac. 27: 20,31,43)?; "Hell"?

Incidentally. one can never find these words "save" and "Hell" in a single verse of Scripture together, that I found. I suggest that "salvation to eternal life" on the basis of works is not what is in view, (nor "saved from eternal damnation") here, not is it "saved from polar bears".

Rom. 4:1-8 says nothing about "the LAW", at all, it merely says "works". And in the near context, "the Law" refes to the Mosaic Law as given by God at Sinai, and following, something of which Abraham was never subjected to, for it did not yet exist. Incidentally, I am (and have always been) exactly as subject to any of the precepts of the Mosaic law, as was Abraham - ZERO!!

As a Gentile, before I was saved, I never had it; As a Christian, after I was saved, I was not under it.

I want to get back later to this "dead" bit, but have to go for now.

Ed

 

[webdog]

Again, why would the rules of writing and speaking be different than they are today?

If I am preaching at my church, and only members are present, and yet I give an invitation and tell them to come to the Lord Jesus, does that mean they must interpret it to mean some kind of second stage of Christianity? Or does it simply mean that I know scripture talks about tares among the wheat, and I am aware that there are unsaved in our midst?

What does it mean when James states that a faith that does not produce works cannot save anyone? Are we to reach and get some completely new meaning for "sodezo"? "Saving faith" is faith that produces works.

We are told in James to resist the devil, and he will flee from us. Can unbelievers resist the devil?

 

[Marcia]

Thanks to all who commented; it was very instructive.

So far, I still think James was written to believers; the evidence from James itself seems to point primarily that it was for believers about how to live out their faith, and how good works justifies them before men, giving evidence of their faith.

James is an important book to know because (among other reasons) Mormon missionaries always use it to try to show we are justified by works.

But as Ed Sutton explained in his post above:

The answer is both; Abraham was justified, i.e, declared righteous, before God, by his faith, and that only, and that by God, before he was even known as Abraham, there and before God even re-confirmed His covenant with Abraham. Did you notice that God, alone, walked "through the pieces" binding Himself (but not Abraham) to the conditions of that covenant?? (Gen. 15:6, 9-18; Rom. 4:3; Gal. 3:6; Jas. 2:23) Abraham was justifed before man, by his 'works', when he offered up Isaac, as this 'faith' (and the declaration of him as righteous) was fulfilled at this time.

 

[Havensdad]

We are told in James to resist the devil, and he will flee from us. Can unbelievers resist the devil?

Jas 5:1 Come now, you rich, weep and howl for the miseries that are coming upon you.
Jas 5:2 Your riches have rotted and your garments are moth-eaten.
Jas 5:3 Your gold and silver have corroded, and their corrosion will be evidence against you and will eat your flesh like fire. You have laid up treasure in the last days.
Jas 5:4 Behold, the wages of the laborers who mowed your fields, which you kept back by fraud, are crying out against you, and the cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord of hosts.
Jas 5:5 You have lived on the earth in luxury and in self-indulgence. You have fattened your hearts in a day of slaughter.
Jas 5:6 You have condemned and murdered the righteous person. He does not resist you.

That is written to believers?!

Like I said, the book of James was written for the benefit of local congregations. It includes addresses to believers, and unbelievers. A "faith" that cannot "save", is obviously addressed as a warning to those who are not truly saved. The saved need no warning about being saved.

 

[Amy.G]

Jas 5:1 Come now, you rich, weep and howl for the miseries that are coming upon you.
Jas 5:2 Your riches have rotted and your garments are moth-eaten.
Jas 5:3 Your gold and silver have corroded, and their corrosion will be evidence against you and will eat your flesh like fire. You have laid up treasure in the last days.
Jas 5:4 Behold, the wages of the laborers who mowed your fields, which you kept back by fraud, are crying out against you, and the cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord of hosts.
Jas 5:5 You have lived on the earth in luxury and in self-indulgence. You have fattened your hearts in a day of slaughter.
Jas 5:6 You have condemned and murdered the righteous person. He does not resist you.

That is written to believers?!

Evidently. You stopped too soon.


Jam 5:7 Therefore be patient, brethren, until the coming of the Lord. See how the farmer waits for the precious fruit of the earth, waiting patiently for it until it receives the early and latter rain.
Jam 5:8 You also be patient. Establish your hearts, for the coming of the Lord is at hand.
Jam 5:9 Do not grumble against one another, brethren, lest you be condemned. Behold, the Judge is standing at the door!
Jam 5:10 My brethren, take the prophets, who spoke in the name of the Lord, as an example of suffering and patience.



Surely James doesn't refer to unbelievers as his brethren.

 

[Havensdad]

Thanks for the 'Greek' lesion, 'er I mean lesson.

I believe if you were to re-check, you would find that the word for save is "σῶζω" or "sOzO" (to use my 'system' of transliterating) or as others have done, "swzw", which is a word used in Jas. 2:14.

It is a phonetic spelling, Ed, straight from the digital edition of Strong's.

Yes, the word "sOzO" certainly is the one rendered as 'save', however, the word in Jn. 3:18, in all three instances is a verb, "pisteuO", while the other referred word in Jas. 2:14 is the noun, "pistis", which is, I grant, 'derived' from "pisteuO', but is not exactly the same word.

The root is the same. You are talking semantics. It is speaking of the same thing. "Pistis"(Faith) is what someone has if they are "pisteou" (faithful, believing).

I do, however, believe that you are placing undue emphasis on "save" and "dead faith", in your reading of Jas. 2, while 'downplaying', as it were, the idea of "profit" (or one's rewards.) I do not believe eternal salvation is ever spoken of as "profit" but rather it is "the 'free gift' of God."

Wow. So your saying because the gift is free, it is worthless? The word means "benefit"...so their is no "benefit" in salvation? That reasoning does not stand.

"Justified" and "you see", in the context, as well as the concept of practical service, found in the verses immediately preceding this, but seem to get 'short shrift', as well. Not to mention, a question of "before whom" ("one of you..."; "Someone will say...". and "You see, then") There is a mention of Abraham, in the context, as well.

His faith was made "complete" by his works. If He would have said "I believe", and yet not have done what He was told, He would not have been "justified". Faith was completed by works.

"When", Biblically, was Abraham justified? When he offered up his son, Isaac, as referenced here?

Or 25 years prior to this, when 'Abraham believed in the Lord, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness?'

25 years earlier...when he had had the kind of faith that produced works> his faith is completed here, because his belief is shown to be the kind of faith that produces works. His faith is "completed".

The answer is both; Abraham was justified, i.e, declared righteous, before God, by his faith, and that only, and that by God, before he was even known as Abraham, there and before God even re-confirmed His covenant with Abraham. Did you notice that God, alone, walked "through the pieces" binding Himself (but not Abraham) to the conditions of that covenant?? (Gen. 15:6, 9-18; Rom. 4:3; Gal. 3:6; Jas. 2:23) Abraham was justifed before man, by his 'works', when he offered up Isaac, as this 'faith' (and the declaration of him as righteous) was fulfilled at this time. "You see then, that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only." But God sees not as a man sees, but God looks on the heart (I Sma. 16:7), something that is impossible for man, hence this is said, and here (not 25 years before) Abraham is now called 'the Friend of God.'

I agree. So if He would NOT have done as instructed, He would not have been justified. For He would not have had the kind of faith that resulted in works.

Saved? From what? The physical suffering in the Tribulation that occurs and no one would physically be 'saved' unless the days be shortened (Mk. 13:20?; "a soul from death" (Jas. 5:20)?; the sick (Jas. 5:15)?; from wrath (Rom. 5:9)?; "the fire" at the judgment seat of works for a Christian (I Cor. 3:11-15)?; "from our/their sins" (Mt. 1:21)?; physically from the Sea (Ac. 27: 20,31,43)?; "Hell"?

Incidentally. one can never find these words "save" and "Hell" in a single verse of Scripture together, that I found. I suggest that "salvation to eternal life" on the basis of works is not what is in view, (nor "saved from eternal damnation") here, not is it "saved from polar bears".

The only thing that makes sense, is "Saved" in the traditional sense, which is saved from eternal damnation.

 

[Marcia]

Jas 5:1 Come now, you rich, weep and howl for the miseries that are coming upon you.
Jas 5:2 Your riches have rotted and your garments are moth-eaten.
Jas 5:3 Your gold and silver have corroded, and their corrosion will be evidence against you and will eat your flesh like fire. You have laid up treasure in the last days.
Jas 5:4 Behold, the wages of the laborers who mowed your fields, which you kept back by fraud, are crying out against you, and the cries of the harvesters have reached the ears of the Lord of hosts.
Jas 5:5 You have lived on the earth in luxury and in self-indulgence. You have fattened your hearts in a day of slaughter.
Jas 5:6 You have condemned and murdered the righteous person. He does not resist you.

That is written to believers?!

Like I said, the book of James was written for the benefit of local congregations. It includes addresses to believers, and unbelievers. A "faith" that cannot "save", is obviously addressed as a warning to those who are not truly saved. The saved need no warning about being saved.

I think if it were to warn the unsaved, it would emphasize the Gospel, but I don't see that in James.

The above are like the admonishments of Proverbs - Christians can live like unbelievers and they are being warned here. For example, James 2.1 is saying "do not hold the faith of Jesus Christ with partiality," so there must have been problems with how the believers were treating people; maybe they were hoarding money and the above verses address that.

Then there's the long message about not bridling the tongue. And there's this:

19My brethren, if any among you strays from the truth and one turns him back,
20let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins.
James 5.19, 20

So I see James as addressing issues among believers who were not living out their faith well or behaving poorly.

 

[Havensdad]

I think if it were to warn the unsaved, it would emphasize the Gospel, but I don't see that in James.

The above are like the admonishments of Proverbs - Christians can live like unbelievers and they are being warned here. For example, James 2.1 is saying "do not hold the faith of Jesus Christ with partiality," so there must have been problems with how the believers were treating people; maybe they were hoarding money and the above verses address that.

Then there's the long message about not bridling the tongue. And there's this:


So I see James as addressing issues among believers who were not living out their faith well or behaving poorly.

Marcia,

James 2:14 does not say "Can that faith give Him a fulfilled Christian Walk". It says that faith can't "save" you. Would you please explain what "save" is referring to here?

 

[webdog]

Evidently. You stopped too soon.


Jam 5:7 Therefore be patient, brethren, until the coming of the Lord. See how the farmer waits for the precious fruit of the earth, waiting patiently for it until it receives the early and latter rain.
Jam 5:8 You also be patient. Establish your hearts, for the coming of the Lord is at hand.
Jam 5:9 Do not grumble against one another, brethren, lest you be condemned. Behold, the Judge is standing at the door!
Jam 5:10 My brethren, take the prophets, who spoke in the name of the Lord, as an example of suffering and patience.



Surely James doesn't refer to unbelievers as his brethren.

Very good. Even if it were only written to jewish believers, by definition they are the church also. In Christ there is no jew or greek (gentile).