Was Jesus human like us or a different kind of human?

[Yeshua1]

Yes, but that's not how we know He was divine. Peter walked on water for a short time, he was not divine. The Twelve, and then later, the Seventy disciples all healed people and cast out demons, and they were not divine. A number of other people in the New Testament also engaged in works of power by the Holy Spirit, and they were not divine.


Actually, I am convinced that He did not have the power in Himself to do those things. He did them by working in coordination with the Father and the Spirit.

I posted scripture references in an earlier post, but I am discovering that people apparently don't actually look up the scriptures that I post. The Gospel of John records some very revealing things about how Jesus did His works of power. Nothing these verses and then go back and study them in context so you can see what I'm talking about:

John 5:19
Therefore Jesus answered and was saying to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, the Son can do nothing of Himself, unless it is something He sees the Father doing; for whatever the Father does, these things the Son also does in like manner."

John 5:30
“I can do nothing on My own initiative. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is just, because I do not seek My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me."

John 8:28
So Jesus said, “When you lift up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am He, and I do nothing on My own initiative, but I speak these things as the Father taught Me."

I could give you more examples, but I think this makes the point.

Jesus was still able to do things only God can do, correct?

 

[HankD]

The "kenosis" is pure fabrication. God Cannot Change. Because he is perfect, and any change would be to imperfection.

"kenosis" is a scripture word (Philippians 2:7) and NOT a "fabrication" and is also linked to the incarnation (John 1:14).

Jesus is the Second person of the Trinity (the Logos) come in the flesh.

i agree that he is perfect in every way both in his deity and humanity.

He IS a human being as well as almighty God.

Philippians 2
5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

 

[Yeshua1]

"kenosis" is a scripture word (Philippians 2:7) and NOT a "fabrication" and is also linked to the incarnation (John 1:14).

Jesus is the Second person of the Trinity (the Logos) come in the flesh.

i agree that he is perfect in every way both in his deity and humanity.

He IS a human being as well as almighty God.

Philippians 2
5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

Where the theory goes wrong is when some authors who hold to it have stated that jesus ceased being God while here upon the earth, and reassumed that in the ascension.

 

[JonC]

The Cross was already a done thing, as the Father predestined it to come to pass, and so would come to pass!

That's psychobabble.

It was not done until it was done, hence Christ's words on the cross "it is finished".

 

[HankD]

Where the theory goes wrong is when some authors who hold to it have stated that jesus ceased being God while here upon the earth, and reassumed that in the ascension.

Yes, some do, but I showed that all do not believe that.
Chafer's Systematic Theology that I quoted plainly states that Jesus lost nothing in the incarnation.
ALSO "kenosis" is a word used in the inspired text describing part of Jesus persona.

 

[Yeshua1]

That's psychobabble.

It was not done until it was done, hence Christ's words on the cross "it is finished".

From the sense of history and having it actually occur, yes, but to God, already had been accomplished, for he sees in Eternity, correct? He knows jesus would come and do the task, correct?

 

[Yeshua1]

I agree that not all who hold to it do, but that there are indeed some who do , wrongly!

 

[JonC]

From the sense of history and having it actually occur, yes, but to God, already had been accomplished, for he sees in Eternity, correct? He knows jesus would come and do the task, correct?

No. While God accomplishes His purposes He is not ignorant of time. The Old Covenant looked to the New. Christ humbled Himself. He was given the glory He once had. "That day" is yet to come. And God knows this. He is not bound by nature but He is also not blind to progression or His plans unfolding in Creation.

 

[Yeshua1]

No. While God accomplishes His purposes He is not ignorant of time. The Old Covenant looked to the New. Christ humbled Himself. He was given the glory He once had. "That day" is yet to come. And God knows this. He is not bound by nature but He is also not blind to progression or His plans unfolding in Creation.

The end has already been foreordained by God, as on that day, Jesus shall return, He shall set up His kingdom, that is all done deals yet to happen, correct?

 

[Baptist Believer]

Jesus was still able to do things only God can do, correct?

If you are talking about acts of power, such as healing, walking on water, etc., then no. He was able to do those things as a human, according to the scriptures that I referenced.

If you are talking about things like forgiving sins, then yes, He was able to do that.

 

[Baptist Believer]

Where the theory goes wrong is when some authors who hold to it have stated that jesus ceased being God while here upon the earth, and reassumed that in the ascension.

Who has written that heresy?

 

[Yeshua1]

If you are talking about acts of power, such as healing, walking on water, etc., then no. He was able to do those things as a human, according to the scriptures that I referenced.

If you are talking about things like forgiving sins, then yes, He was able to do that.

Peter could only walk on water because Jesus being God affected reality, and any healings Apostles did were by His power, not by theirs!

 

[Yeshua1]

Who has written that heresy?

The Empty God

 

[JonC]

Peter could only walk on water because Jesus being God affected reality, and any healings Apostles did were by His power, not by theirs!

Jesus said it was a matter of faith - not altering reality. Scripture also states that Jesus worked by the Spirit, what He did was God testifying He was sent by the Father, affirming Jesus' own claim that He was accomplishing the Father's will rather than His own. In this way we should have the mind of Christ.

 

[Yeshua1]

Jesus said it was a matter of faith - not altering reality. Scripture also states that Jesus worked by the Spirit, what He did was God testifying He was sent by the Father, affirming Jesus' own claim that He was accomplishing the Father's will rather than His own. In this way we should have the mind of Christ.

Jesus could have exercised his own power, but he chose not to, correct?
And what was the basis of peter walking on water was the power of God, correct?

 

[JonC]

Jesus could have exercised his own power, but he chose not to, correct?
And what was the basis of peter walking on water was the power of God, correct?

Yes, Jesus could have exercised His power and sought His will, but we would call this "sin". He chose not to, but to instead submit to the will of the Father in obedience. If we would only do the same.

 

[Baptist Believer]

Peter could only walk on water because Jesus being God affected reality, and any healings Apostles did were by His power, not by theirs!

Jesus disagrees with you.

Please look at this text:

John 5:6-23
6 When Jesus saw him lying there, and knew that he had already been a long time in that condition, He *said to him, “Do you wish to get well?” 7 The sick man answered Him, “Sir, I have no man to put me into the pool when the water is stirred up, but while I am coming, another steps down before me.” 8 Jesus said to him, “Get up, pick up your pallet and walk.” 9 Immediately the man became well, and picked up his pallet and began to walk.

Now it was the Sabbath on that day. 10 So the Jews were saying to the man who was cured, “It is the Sabbath, and it is not permissible for you to carry your pallet.” 11 But he answered them, “He who made me well was the one who said to me, ‘Pick up your pallet and walk.’” 12 They asked him, “Who is the man who said to you, ‘Pick up your pallet and walk’?” 13 But the man who was healed did not know who it was, for Jesus had slipped away while there was a crowd in that place. 14 Afterward Jesus *found him in the temple and said to him, “Behold, you have become well; do not sin anymore, so that nothing worse happens to you.” 15 The man went away, and told the Jews that it was Jesus who had made him well. 16 For this reason the Jews were persecuting Jesus, because He was doing these things on the Sabbath. 17 But He answered them, “My Father is working until now, and I Myself am working.”


18 For this reason therefore the Jews were seeking all the more to kill Him, because He not only was breaking the Sabbath, but also was calling God His own Father, making Himself equal with God.


19 Therefore Jesus answered and was saying to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, the Son can do nothing of Himself, unless it is something He sees the Father doing; for whatever the Father does, these things the Son also does in like manner. 20 For the Father loves the Son, and shows Him all things that He Himself is doing; and the Father will show Him greater works than these, so that you will marvel. 21 For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so the Son also gives life to whom He wishes. 22 For not even the Father judges anyone, but He has given all judgment to the Son, 23 so that all will honor the Son even as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father who sent Him."

 

[Baptist Believer]

The Empty God

The writer of the piece misunderstands the doctrine he is criticizing. He is making the same error that some in this thread are making, that God is only God because of certain attributes of power, not as a Person.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

Six Hour Warning
This thread will be closed sometime after 5:15 AM Pacific.

 

[Aaron]

Of course not

Titus 1:2 In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

Then Jesus could not sin.

(I know you believe Jesus could not sin. Was just posting for the benefit of those who are confused.)