Was There Alcohol in the Wine...

[webdog]

If only they would produce the Scripture to show beyond the shadow of a doubt that the wine was alcoholic all the time, then we would not be having this discussion.

But they cannot produce it, because it is not there

We'll produce that...when you produce the ones stating the blessings from wine are non alcoholic wine. I won't hold my breath...

 

[dan e.]

A little lesson on fact and fiction...

FACT: The wine in Scripture is rightly interpreted as alcoholic

FICTION: Alcohol is inherently evil, espoused only by a drunk Satan.

FACT: Baseball is the greatest sport ever.

FICTION: The Atlanta Braves will win the World Series this year (Oh how I wish it were fact....but I can be realistic).

 

[npetreley]

I CANNOT BELIEVE THIS IS STARTING AGAIN.

:tonofbricks:

Let's just copy and paste the entire previous thread.

Amen.

Also, 10-day suspensions don't seem to work very well.

 

[dan e.]

Rather than copy and paste the entire previous thread, post the scriptures that show that all wine in Bible days was alcoholic in content.

That will be sufficient enough.

naah....just re-read the previous thread. You'll get the gist.

 

[GLipscomb48]

You are referring to the falacies stated by Josephus. That's pure urban legend. There has been no documented occurances of fruit and / or fruit juice not fermenting for 100 years. That's almost comical. There was no air tight containers able to preserve fruit juice for that period of time. There was no refrigeration...but this has been exhausted enough already. There is such a thing as fact, and there is fiction. You espouse fiction, my friend.

Josephus lived in the first century and recorded all these accounts. It is not urban legend. Your local library referrence section should have encyclopedia's that show that Josephus did indeed live during that era and was in fact a historian.

As far as no historical evidence, his writings, Columella's, Pliny's, Aristotle's, and others have recorded the ability to preserve fresh grape juice.

So it is not urban legend as you suppose.

 

[dan e.]

As to the original question of the post....I'm not sure what the wine represented. Would it be the same as wine in the Lord's Supper?

 

[dan e.]

Josephus lived in the first century and recorded all these accounts. It is not urban legend. Your local library referrence section should have encyclopedia's that show that Josephus did indeed live during that era and was in fact a historian.

As far as no historical evidence, his writings, Columella's, Pliny's, Aristotle's, and others have recorded the ability to preserve fresh grape juice.

So it is not urban legend as you suppose.

Seriously glipscomb....just read the previous thread. We have an encyclopedia of our own on this issue. Both sides are represented. Anything said can be replied to from a post on the previous thread.

 

[GLipscomb48]

We'll produce that...when you produce the ones stating the blessings from wine are non alcoholic wine. I won't hold my breath...

You would not hear HBSMN, you would not hear standingfirminChrist, you would not hear Diggin in da Word, you would not hear Linda64, I have no doubt that you have turned your ears from me as well.

 

[webdog]

As to the original question of the post....I'm not sure what the wine represented. Would it be the same as wine in the Lord's Supper?

Yes...back to the thread. Wine is pure, not having yeast (alcoholic wine has no yeast...non alcoholic "wine", or grape juice HAS yeast). Pouring it out is symbolic of Christ's pure blood being poured out for us.

 

[webdog]

You would not hear HBSMN, you would not hear standingfirminChrist, you would not hear Diggin in da Word, you would not hear Linda64, I have no doubt that you have turned your ears from me as well.

...did you say something?

 

[dan e.]

Yes...back to the thread. Wine is pure, not having yeast (alcoholic wine has no yeast...non alcoholic "wine", or grape juice HAS yeast). Pouring it out is symbolic of Christ's pure blood being poured out for us.

interesting. There always seems to be something new to learn from the tabernacle and its rituals. Honestly...I find it to be amazing.

 

[npetreley]

You would not hear HBSMN, you would not hear standingfirminChrist, you would not hear Diggin in da Word, you would not hear Linda64, I have no doubt that you have turned your ears from me as well.

Wow, you know a lot about the previous threads for someone who just "joined" BB. You been lurking around for years just waiting until someone got suspended for 10 days, after which you decided you'd join and chime in?

 

[GLipscomb48]

Yes...back to the thread. Wine is pure, not having yeast (alcoholic wine has no yeast...non alcoholic "wine", or grape juice HAS yeast). Pouring it out is symbolic of Christ's pure blood being poured out for us.

Boiling the grape juice kills the yeast. Yeast is killed once it reaches above 115 degrees farenheit.

So there goes the yeast in grape juice theory...wanna try another?

 

[richard n koustas]

Boy, i turn my back for a couple hours and look what happens! 3 pages of, well, no discussion of the OP! I guess i'm really not too suprised...

Well, what did the wine in the drink offering represent? Personally, I think it represents JOY...but I really want to find out what others think. I think i'll hit the commentaries tonite and do my own digging ...

 

[GLipscomb48]

Wow, you know a lot about the previous threads for someone who just "joined" BB. You been lurking around for years just waiting until someone got suspended for 10 days, after which you decided you'd join and chime in?

No, I take time to read before input on a matter...which many could benefit from.

 

[webdog]

Wow, you know a lot about the previous threads for someone who just "joined" BB. You been lurking around for years just waiting until someone got suspended for 10 days, after which you decided you'd join and chime in?

Kind of odd, no? I would hope a banned BB member is not trying to circumvent the rules...

 

[GLipscomb48]

Kind of odd, no? I would hope a banned BB member is not trying to circumvent the rules...

I am not a banned member if that is what you are implying, webdog.

 

[webdog]

Boiling the grape juice kills the yeast. Yeast is killed once it reaches above 115 degrees farenheit.

So there goes the yeast in grape juice theory...wanna try another?

Boiled grape juice is not wine...it's boiled grape juice. It would also have the consistancy of jelly, and even mixed with water (which would have contaminants in it) would not be pure.

Wanna try again?

 

[npetreley]

Kind of odd, no? I would hope a banned BB member is not trying to circumvent the rules...

Yeah. Funny astronomical coincidence how two grape-juicers are suspended, after which two brand new members suddenly appear and state the same arguments.

 

[richard n koustas]

I think i found my answer, in post #29 of this thread by webdog.

thanks.:wavey: