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Was William Tyndale a Baptist?

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Martin Marprelate

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I bought myself the complete works of William Tyndale for Christmas.
I have a theory that Tyndale came out of the Lollards. He doesn't seem to have been an associate of the other very early English reformers like Bilney, Latimer and Cranmer; his N.T. doesn't have 'bishops' and he translates ekklesia as 'congregation.'
I was also looking to see where Tyndale came down on baptism. I've read quite a lot of Lollard stuff and they don't seem ever to mention it. But in three months of reading, nor did Tyndale. His great subject is Justification by Faith alone, and on this he is very good indeed. He is also very much a Calvinist at a time when Calvin was still in short pants!

But recently I was reading his Pathway into the Holy Scriptures, an introduction to His New Testament, written as early as 1525, and toward the end I read:

'And to know how contrary this law is unto our nature, and how it is damnation not to have this law written on our hearts, though we never commit the deeds; and how there is no other means to be saved from this damnation, than through repentance toward the law, and faith in Christ's blood; which are the very inward baptism of our souls, and the washing and the dipping of our bodies in the water is the outward sign. The plunging of the body under the water signifieth that we repent and profess to fight against sin and lusts, and to kill them every day more and more, with the help of God, and our diligence in following the doctrine of Christ and the leading of his Spirit; and that we believe to be washed from our natural damnation in which we are born, and from all the wrath of the law........and from all actual sin which shall chance upon us, while we enforce the contrary and ever fight there against, and hope to sin no more. And thus repentance and faith begin at our baptism, and first professing the laws of God; and continue to our lives' end, and grow as we grow in the Spirit: for the perfecter [sic] we be, the greater is our repentance, and the stronger our faith......'

So what do you think? It's clear that he believes in baptism by immersion, but surely he also teaches Believers' baptism here so can we write him down as a Particular Baptist?
 
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Logos1560

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KJV-only advocate Phil Stringer claimed that Tyndale "took many Baptist positions" in doctrine such as "teaching the independence of local churches, priesthood of all believers, only two offices for the church--pastor and deacon, baptism by immersion of believers only, and sole authority of Scripture" (Faithful Baptist Witness, pp. 106-107).

William Tyndale pointed out that Christ "ordained in his kingdom and congregation two officers" (Expositions, p. 253). In one of his books, Tyndale described baptism as "the plunging into the water" (Doctrinal Treatises, p. 253). Tyndale also clearly stated that the work of baptism "justifieth us not" (Expositions, p. 90).

A few have even claimed that Tyndale was a Baptist (Ford, Origin of the Baptists, p. 32; Davis, History of the Welsh Baptists, p. 21), but most church historians would probably dispute that claim as being unproven and unlikely. He does not seem to have been identified as a Baptist in his day by his friends nor by his enemies. Those closely associated with Tyndale do not seem to have been identified as being Baptists.

William Tyndale was also accused of holding Lutheran views, especially because he translated and used some of the notes in Luther's Bible. For example, the Bishop of London Tonstal accused him of being a "maintainer of Luther's sect" (Doctrinal Treatises, p. xxxii). John Eadie noted that "Sir Thomas More, King Henry, Lee, and Cochlaeus regarded Tyndale as a promoter of Lutheranism, and his Testament was loosely spoken of as a translation of Luther's German version" (English Bible, p. 122). Eberhardt also claimed that "Tyndale would edit the Lutheran version of the English Bible" (Summary of Catholic History, II, p. 182). MacCulloch described Tyndale as the Lutherans’ “most celebrated English-born sympathizer” (Thomas Cranmer, p. 68).

In contrast, John Eadie concluded that "it is against all evidence to call Tyndale Lutheran" (English Bible, p. 122). Richard Lovett wrote: “Only ignorance or willful prejudice can affirm that Tyndale’s text is merely a translation of Luther” (Printed English Bible, p. 32). Tyndale himself noted: “When he (Thomas More) saith, ‘Tyndale was confederate with Luther,’ that is not truth” (Answer, p. 147).
 
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Martin Marprelate

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Logos1560 said:
KJV-only advocate Phil Stringer claimed that Tyndale "took many Baptist positions" in doctrine such as "teaching the independence of local churches, priesthood of all believers, only two offices for the church--pastor and deacon, baptism by immersion of believers only, and sole authority of Scripture" (Faithful Baptist Witness, pp. 106-107).

William Tyndale pointed out that Christ "ordained in his kingdom and congregation two officers" (Expositions, p. 253). In one of his books, Tyndale described baptism as "the plunging into the water" (Doctrinal Treatises, p. 253). Tyndale also clearly stated that the work of baptism "justifieth us not" (Expositions, p. 90).

A few have even claimed that Tyndale was a Baptist (Ford, Origin of the Baptists, p. 32; Davis, History of the Welsh Baptists, p. 21), but most church historians would probably dispute that claim as being unproven and unlikely. He does not seem to have been identified as a Baptist in his day by his friends nor by his enemies. Those closely associated with Tyndale do not seem to have been identified as being Baptists.

William Tyndale was also accused of holding Lutheran views, especially because he translated and used some of the notes in Luther's Bible. For example, the Bishop of London Tonstal accused him of being a "maintainer of Luther's sect" (Doctrinal Treatises, p. xxxii). John Eadie noted that "Sir Thomas More, King Henry, Lee, and Cochlaeus regarded Tyndale as a promoter of Lutheranism, and his Testament was loosely spoken of as a translation of Luther's German version" (English Bible, p. 122). Eberhardt also claimed that "Tyndale would edit the Lutheran version of the English Bible" (Summary of Catholic History, II, p. 182). MacCulloch described Tyndale as the Lutherans’ “most celebrated English-born sympathizer” (Thomas Cranmer, p. 68).

In contrast, John Eadie concluded that "it is against all evidence to call Tyndale Lutheran" (English Bible, p. 122). Richard Lovett wrote: “Only ignorance or willful prejudice can affirm that Tyndale’s text is merely a translation of Luther” (Printed English Bible, p. 32). Tyndale himself noted: “When he (Thomas More) saith, ‘Tyndale was confederate with Luther,’ that is not truth” (Answer, p. 147).
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Tyndale was writing only a few years after Luther posted his 95 theses, so it is natural that people might have called him a Lutheran, and indeed, as you point out, he did make use of some of Luther's writings and he appears to have spent some time with him. But neither his Bible translation nor his other writings appear to owe much to Luther.

But if he held openly to Believers' Baptism, one might have expected him to be accused of being an Anabaptist, but although I haven't yet read all of his dialogues with Sir Thomas More, I don't believe he was.
 
Earth Wind and Fire

Earth Wind and Fire

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Martin Marprelate said:
Tyndale was writing only a few years after Luther posted his 95 theses, so it is natural that people might have called him a Lutheran, and indeed, as you point out, he did make use of some of Luther's writings and he appears to have spent some time with him. But neither his Bible translation nor his other writings appear to owe much to Luther.

But if he held openly to Believers' Baptism, one might have expected him to be accused of being an Anabaptist, but although I haven't yet read all of his dialogues with Sir Thomas More, I don't believe he was.
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That’s interesting, I’m hunting through manuscripts attempting to see if Roger Williams was really a Baptist... but that’s a subject for another time. :Thumbsup​
 
37818

37818

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Earth Wind and Fire said:
Did he now.....do you have anything to substantiate that claim? I could not find anything that clearly stated that.
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What I understand he is credited for founding a Baptist Church of Providence, Rhode Island in 1638. He left the Baptists to become a "Seeker."
 
robycop3

robycop3

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Baptists weren't invented til C. 1609, while Tyndale was murdered in 1536. So, no, Tyndale couldn'ta been a Baptist.
 
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Marooncat79

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Tyndale had a lot of Doctrine that was very Baptistic especially for his day, and the fact that he lived before what many think as th beginning of the Baptist movement
 
37818

37818

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robycop3 said:
Baptists weren't invented til C. 1609, while Tyndale was murdered in 1536. So, no, Tyndale couldn'ta been a Baptist.
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Baptist as a label. New Testament Christianity is the teachings of the New Testament beginning in the first century.
 
robycop3

robycop3

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There have been people practicing what's now Baptist doctrines from the beginning of Christianity, such as recognizing Jesus as Head of the Church & the Bible as the highest earthly authority in all matters of faith/worship.
 
Baptist Believer

Baptist Believer

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Earth Wind and Fire said:
Did he now.....do you have anything to substantiate that claim? I could not find anything that clearly stated that.
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Any good biography of Roger Williams will point that out. The church still exists today.

Edwin Gausted's biography (well footnoted to original sources) of Roger Williams was an outstanding read 30 years ago when I read it in seminary. They have repacked it a few different times (possibly some updates), but it is widely available.
 
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