I reported the OP and got no response.
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Wasted days and wasted nights?
- Thread starter Twizzler
- Start date
I reported the OP and got no response.
You can anonymously respond to a poll. That's been done here in the past and was what I based my statement on.
I seriously look forward to reading it, Alatide.
saturneptune
New Member
No, I am not part of the problem. Your posts are unclear and all over the map. First of all, no one said a thing about your faith as your first three lines express. The assumption is that everyone here believes that. The report that was made by me had nothing whatsoever to do with you. It was made for someone calling me an instrument of Satan, which you are probably right, nothing will be done about it.
As far as you getting tired of hearing various other viewpoints, then why are you here? Maybe you should do more hunting and fishing if this bothers you that much.
It's not a waste of time. Personally, I see debating these issues as "contending for the faith".
Yes, debates concerning abortion and the ancient divine institution of marriage are in my estimation elements in the ongoing duty of the saints to "contend for the faith".
In addition there are those who "lurk" (read but not comment) who need to see all scriptural facets of these issues of the murder of the innocent, the overthrow of God's ancient institutions which issues (abortion, etc) are antichrist in nature.
Also it is an unalienable right given us by our Creator, guaranteed to us by our founding fathers in our founding documents to speak our mind whether people listen or not.
Noah preached and no one listened, so what.
HankD
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As to the apparent failure of the Republican Party, I agree.
I am sorely disappointed in the Republican Party but I haven't given up on them yet.
I am officially an independent after first being a JFK Democrat (pre-Roe v. Wade).
Later I became a Ronald Reagan Republican (first term) then an independent during his second term and remained such.
At very least pro-life is the official position of the Republican Party while pro-death is the official position of the Democractic Party
HankD
I am sorely disappointed in the Republican Party but I haven't given up on them yet.
I am officially an independent after first being a JFK Democrat (pre-Roe v. Wade).
Later I became a Ronald Reagan Republican (first term) then an independent during his second term and remained such.
At very least pro-life is the official position of the Republican Party while pro-death is the official position of the Democractic Party
HankD
I can only think of 3.
alatide
Robert Snow
Magnetic Poles
They all say they oppose abortion and same sex marriage.
They are liars. We know them by their fruits. They are Obama supporters.
Funny...Obama says he opposes abortion as well.
Not with a troll like you.
You are not here to discuss, but to disrupt and subvert.
Translation: "I'll copy-paste content from various Lib blogs..."
without attribution
Actually, I'm serious about this. I'm currently reading a book called "UnChristian" by David Kinnaman which reinforces what I've believed for a long time. The author is president of The Barna Group, a Christian company which provides research and resources to denominations and churches to aid in evangelism (demographics, insights into what people think and believe, etc.). They can be found at:
http://www.barna.org/
Anyway, this book investigates why the Christian church is failing to reach the Busters (children of the Boomers) and the following generation (what they call the Mosaic generation. It focuses on people aged 16 to 29. There are about 24 million of them in the US compared to 21 M Baby Boomers. About 40% of this group is outside the faith compared to about 27% of Boomers.
This is what I've learned so far. (I've read about 1/3 of the book.)
Most of these outsiders have attended church in the past but have opted out. 38% of this group have a negative attitude towards Christians compared to 50% towards evangelical Christians. This unfavorable image is due to:
Anti-homosexual (against people not acts) - 66%
Judgmental - 57%
Hypocritical - 54%
Too much involved in politics - 46%
Out of touch with reality - 37%
Insensitive to Others - 27%
Others
They feel that Christians are not interested in forming a relationship with them but only notching up another "salvation." Interesting enough, many church goers feel about the same about the church but to a somewhat lesser degree. The outsiders don't have a negative view of Jesus but rather think that the church has distorted His message.
Because the Christian religion is so pervasive in the US, 84% of these outsiders say that they know Christians personally. Much of what they believe about the church is based on personal experience not the media, etc.
Looking at this a different way, the Barna Group presented several descriptors of a religious and asked this age group (16-29) which ones applied to present-day Christianity. They included the unchurched as well as those who attend church. This is the result.
Unchurched Church Goers
Anti-homosexual 91% 80%
Judgmental 87% 52%
Hypocritical 85% 47%
Old-Fashioned 78% 36%
Too involved in Politics 75% 50%
Out of Touch with Reality 72% 32%
Insensitive to Others 70% 29%
Boring 68% 27%
Not accepting of other Faiths 64% 39%
Confusing 61% 44%
The question might be why do we care? Of course as Christians we have different values than the unchurched. The reason we should care is that these are the people we’re trying to reach with the gospel. We don’t have to accept homosexual behavior to accept and care about homosexual people. Jesus was often criticized because he spent time with the worst of sinners (prostitutes, tax collectors, Samaritans, etc.). The Christian ideal is to love the sinner but not to accept the sin.
Appearing judgmental, hypocritical, too involved in (Republican) politics is not the way to reach out to a sinful world going to Hell. I myself have been told twice to my face that a Democrat cannot be a Christian. That one statement automatically reduces the “potential harvest” of souls by 50%. Of what value is it to "win" a political argument and cause someone to be forever estranged from Jesus?
If people are told the story about America being a Christian nation rather than a free nation where everyone can worship as they choose why wouldn’t they assume that they are automatically going to heaven since they are a citizen of that nation? Why do we have to put manger scenes on the court house lawn rather than on the church lawn or the lawns of believers? What do we gain by trying to force our religion on others? It doesn’t work as these statistics show. They only develop an animosity towards us which makes it impossible for us to reach them with the gospel.
Just what is the Christian Right’s real objective, winning souls or winning votes? I don’t believe they can do both and that’s why the SBC didn’t reach its goal of 1M baptisms. We are not reaching the lost because the church is increasingly becoming a club for insiders rather than a place of hope for the lost.
http://www.barna.org/
Anyway, this book investigates why the Christian church is failing to reach the Busters (children of the Boomers) and the following generation (what they call the Mosaic generation. It focuses on people aged 16 to 29. There are about 24 million of them in the US compared to 21 M Baby Boomers. About 40% of this group is outside the faith compared to about 27% of Boomers.
This is what I've learned so far. (I've read about 1/3 of the book.)
Most of these outsiders have attended church in the past but have opted out. 38% of this group have a negative attitude towards Christians compared to 50% towards evangelical Christians. This unfavorable image is due to:
Anti-homosexual (against people not acts) - 66%
Judgmental - 57%
Hypocritical - 54%
Too much involved in politics - 46%
Out of touch with reality - 37%
Insensitive to Others - 27%
Others
They feel that Christians are not interested in forming a relationship with them but only notching up another "salvation." Interesting enough, many church goers feel about the same about the church but to a somewhat lesser degree. The outsiders don't have a negative view of Jesus but rather think that the church has distorted His message.
Because the Christian religion is so pervasive in the US, 84% of these outsiders say that they know Christians personally. Much of what they believe about the church is based on personal experience not the media, etc.
Looking at this a different way, the Barna Group presented several descriptors of a religious and asked this age group (16-29) which ones applied to present-day Christianity. They included the unchurched as well as those who attend church. This is the result.
Unchurched Church Goers
Anti-homosexual 91% 80%
Judgmental 87% 52%
Hypocritical 85% 47%
Old-Fashioned 78% 36%
Too involved in Politics 75% 50%
Out of Touch with Reality 72% 32%
Insensitive to Others 70% 29%
Boring 68% 27%
Not accepting of other Faiths 64% 39%
Confusing 61% 44%
The question might be why do we care? Of course as Christians we have different values than the unchurched. The reason we should care is that these are the people we’re trying to reach with the gospel. We don’t have to accept homosexual behavior to accept and care about homosexual people. Jesus was often criticized because he spent time with the worst of sinners (prostitutes, tax collectors, Samaritans, etc.). The Christian ideal is to love the sinner but not to accept the sin.
Appearing judgmental, hypocritical, too involved in (Republican) politics is not the way to reach out to a sinful world going to Hell. I myself have been told twice to my face that a Democrat cannot be a Christian. That one statement automatically reduces the “potential harvest” of souls by 50%. Of what value is it to "win" a political argument and cause someone to be forever estranged from Jesus?
If people are told the story about America being a Christian nation rather than a free nation where everyone can worship as they choose why wouldn’t they assume that they are automatically going to heaven since they are a citizen of that nation? Why do we have to put manger scenes on the court house lawn rather than on the church lawn or the lawns of believers? What do we gain by trying to force our religion on others? It doesn’t work as these statistics show. They only develop an animosity towards us which makes it impossible for us to reach them with the gospel.
Just what is the Christian Right’s real objective, winning souls or winning votes? I don’t believe they can do both and that’s why the SBC didn’t reach its goal of 1M baptisms. We are not reaching the lost because the church is increasingly becoming a club for insiders rather than a place of hope for the lost.
saturneptune
New Member
I am serious too. Next time you call me an instrument of Satan, I will not stop until you are banned. (again)
Robert Snow
New Member
Look on the bright side, maybe he was saying you are as good as Peter. :laugh:
I've been called that and worse by the so-called Christians on this web site. you people thin you can insult those you disagree with ad infinitum buit if they respond you come back with empty threats.
saturneptune
New Member
There is no "you people" to it. I do not call others names that imply lost or no salvation, and do not expect it from anyone, I do not care what your political stance is. There is a long stretch between calling someone a political term and something like you do. Do it to others if you wish, I am just telling you, dont do it to me again.
What percentage of "boomers" does it say were "outside the faith" when they were between the ages of 16 and 29?
Alatide,
Thanks for taking the time to post your thoughts above, I took the time to really read what you said and do some soul-searching. The picky part of me has to jump out and correct some numbers that you used, no offense. I think your numbers you list for baby-boomers and busters is woefully low, according to the US Census bureau, there's around 60 million Busters and 71 million Boomers. The point is really moot, but I just thought I'd throw it out there anyway.
I truly FEEL what you're saying... I really do, and sometimes am drawn into the humanist thinking that maybe we really should be more understanding, more accepting of other's views of what is right and wrong, of what is moral and what is not. I also feel it would be so much easier in this life to be an athiest and lean on my prideful thinking that I, along with the rest of humanity, can figure out what is best for us.
I would be an awesome democrat I think as I look at the ideas about abortion, a woman's right to choose (pro-choice), federal healthcare and I see the sense in them from a purely human stand. It is so natural for me to WANT to join some socialist society where we all work for the betterment of humanity as a whole. It would be so simple for me to believe that we, as man, can come up with answers to our epic plight if I didn't believe in the Lord. If I could put Him aside, I could embrace the idea of Spaceship Earth, of evolution, of man's own greatness.
Alas I cannot embrace my own god-hood as I hold the Lord above all else, resting in the assurance that He is ALL that matters. I put my trust in Him and know that through His Son, Jesus Christ, my sins are forgiven and I am assured of an eternal salvation that I cannot gain by my own works.
As I accepted the fact that it was going to take you time to put together your post, I would ask you to show patience with me too. I am currently at work and my schedule over the next 5 days is quite hectic. I will be praying about this thread and putting together a post to show you why I cannot accept a lot of the humanist thinking in the democratic agenda and also why I am pondering an exodus to the Constitution Party, leaving the GOP in the dust, though I've not decided yet.
I'll likely be able to post this on Sunday or Monday. Until then, the rest of you be nice to Alatide in this thread instead of jumping on him for the slightest thing.
In Christ,
tw
Thanks for taking the time to post your thoughts above, I took the time to really read what you said and do some soul-searching. The picky part of me has to jump out and correct some numbers that you used, no offense.
I think your numbers you list for baby-boomers and busters is woefully low, according to the US Census bureau, there's around 60 million Busters and 71 million Boomers. The point is really moot, but I just thought I'd throw it out there anyway.I truly FEEL what you're saying... I really do, and sometimes am drawn into the humanist thinking that maybe we really should be more understanding, more accepting of other's views of what is right and wrong, of what is moral and what is not. I also feel it would be so much easier in this life to be an athiest and lean on my prideful thinking that I, along with the rest of humanity, can figure out what is best for us.
I would be an awesome democrat I think as I look at the ideas about abortion, a woman's right to choose (pro-choice), federal healthcare and I see the sense in them from a purely human stand. It is so natural for me to WANT to join some socialist society where we all work for the betterment of humanity as a whole. It would be so simple for me to believe that we, as man, can come up with answers to our epic plight if I didn't believe in the Lord. If I could put Him aside, I could embrace the idea of Spaceship Earth, of evolution, of man's own greatness.
Alas I cannot embrace my own god-hood as I hold the Lord above all else, resting in the assurance that He is ALL that matters. I put my trust in Him and know that through His Son, Jesus Christ, my sins are forgiven and I am assured of an eternal salvation that I cannot gain by my own works.
As I accepted the fact that it was going to take you time to put together your post, I would ask you to show patience with me too. I am currently at work and my schedule over the next 5 days is quite hectic. I will be praying about this thread and putting together a post to show you why I cannot accept a lot of the humanist thinking in the democratic agenda and also why I am pondering an exodus to the Constitution Party, leaving the GOP in the dust, though I've not decided yet.
I'll likely be able to post this on Sunday or Monday. Until then, the rest of you be nice to Alatide in this thread instead of jumping on him for the slightest thing.
In Christ,
tw
I disagree, IMO, the mindset that puts the stamp of approval upon the death of the innocent, helpless and defenseless hardens the heart of an individual far more than warning them to avoid blood-guilt.
IMO, a Christian should not be a Democrat because the official position of the Democrat Party is "pro-choice" (pro-death actually).
On the other hand, I personally cannot be a member of the Republican Party either as they have proven themselves powerless to win a reversal of the Roe v. Wade decision.
So I am an independent without affiliation.
I'm not even sure if I could vote for a strong pro-life Democrat.
I'll have to decide if and when the opportunity presents itslef.
Psalm 51:14 Deliver me from bloodguiltiness, O God, thou God of my salvation: and my tongue shall sing aloud of thy righteousness.
HankD
That's a good question. I posted a lot of information. Your turn.