"We wear Black"

[Salty]

And it is how info is presented:
For example - many of us were taught that
1) the Emancipation Proclamation, freed all the slaves. Well, that just isnt true. - It only freed the slaves in the Rebellious States.

2) West Virginia became a state over the slavery issue - but lets take a look at history. Yes, slavery was PART of the reason - but those in western Virginia were talking about leaving in the 1820's. One issue was "Taxation without Representation...."
Check this link about WV history

Anotherwords - we need to have the full story

For example - we are told we must wear our seatbelts to save our life
The recent stat is that 57% of all traffic deaths - the individual was not wearing a seat belt. Or we could say that 43% of all traffic deaths - the individual WAS wearing a seat belt - With about 40,000 deaths a year that meant that some 17,000 people died while wearing a seat belt.
Are your chances better - of course - they are! - One other thing - there are several reasons (or should I say excuses) that a person dies in a car crash.
A) DWI
B) Speed
C) Tailgating
D) Distraction
E-other

So whoever is trying to prove their point will only use the stats to prove their point - ie - MADD normally only talks about the danger of booze -yet disregard the other factors.

Bottom line -same thing with the War of Southern Independence - many only look at their own side of the issue - when there are many factors.

 

[Baptist Believer]

“We” means “Americans, whites and blacks”.

Then, respectfully, we were not doing very well before the Obamas. We are definitely not doing well since the MAGA movement began.

If you truly want to see a mistreated ethnic group, look at the American Indians.

Of course. If you didn't notice, I pointed out previously in this discussion that we need an emphasis on First Nations history. The only First Nations history I learned in school was the history and culture of the people groups living in Texas prior to the conquests of the European peoples -- and that was in Texas History class in seventh grade.

People who love America would have despised obama if he were lily-white.

I strongly disagree. I strongly disagreed with Obama's policies and his lack of experience back when he was running, but I didn't despise him. I used to defend white Republicans all the time from allegations of racism toward Obama, but I finally gave it up since it became clear that the contempt for the Obamas was deeply primal, personal, and irrational. It seemed to come from exactly the same place as the overt racism that was all around me when I was growing up -- and that included knowing some Klansmen and their families.

Moreover, disciples of Jesus are not supposed to despise others. It is antichrist.

His race/color meant nothing.

Maybe to you and me, but for many it was and is still an issue. I know this because I have extended family members who have specifically stated such a thing (we are lily white).

It was his rhetoric, policies, and actions—same as biden...

...except white supremacist biden...

By definition, a white supremacist would not be a Vice President to a non-white President. You need to think about the terminology you use before throwing out ridiculous insults/allegations.

...is worse and more despised than obama.

Persons who despise Biden, Obama, Clinton, and Trump are not faithful disciples of Jesus. They need to repent.

...It’s not color—it’s character, rather the lack of it.

Sure. But your talk about "character" rings completely false when you claim that Donald Trump is a "great man." Since Donald Trump's character is the antithesis of the teachings of Jesus (for instance, the Sermon on the Mount passage), Trump's character is literally antichrist. If you condemn Biden and Obama's alleged lack of character while embracing Trump's antichrist character, you are seriously deluded.

 

[Baptist Believer]

And it is how info is presented:
For example - many of us were taught that
1) the Emancipation Proclamation, freed all the slaves. Well, that just isnt true. - It only freed the slaves in the Rebellious States.

Specifically, the areas under Union Army control at the time of its issue. For instance, New Orleans was exempt from the Proclamation.

2) West Virginia became a state over the slavery issue - but lets take a look at history. Yes, slavery was PART of the reason - but those in western Virginia were talking about leaving in the 1820's. One issue was "Taxation without Representation...."
Check this link about WV history

Yes.

Anotherwords - we need to have the full story

Sure.

So whoever is trying to prove their point will only use the stats to prove their point...

Those who are trying to argue/debate a point will pare down their argument to the essentials for the side they advocate -- which is one of the reasons a debate format is a terrible choice for a Christian site and for determining theological truth. Those who try to present all sides fairly will get crushed by those who only care about their point of view. That's one of the reasons I don't debate much around here. Too many Christians don't actually care about knowing what is true. They only want their own viewpoint confirmed with nice snappy comebacks and memes.

Bottom line -same thing with the War of Southern Independence - many only look at their own side of the issue - when there are many factors.

Yes, that's part of the fallen nature. I would hope that disciples of Jesus would be better than that. There are some around here who display that kind of spiritual maturity, but not nearly as many as one would hope.

 

[MrW]

Then, respectfully, we were not doing very well before the Obamas. We are definitely not doing well since the MAGA movement began.


Of course. If you didn't notice, I pointed out previously in this discussion that we need an emphasis on First Nations history. The only First Nations history I learned in school was the history and culture of the people groups living in Texas prior to the conquests of the European peoples -- and that was in Texas History class in seventh grade.


I strongly disagree. I strongly disagreed with Obama's policies and his lack of experience back when he was running, but I didn't despise him. I used to defend white Republicans all the time from allegations of racism toward Obama, but I finally gave it up since it became clear that the contempt for the Obamas was deeply primal, personal, and irrational. It seemed to come from exactly the same place as the overt racism that was all around me when I was growing up -- and that included knowing some Klansmen and their families.

Moreover, disciples of Jesus are not supposed to despise others. It is antichrist.


Maybe to you and me, but for many it was and is still an issue. I know this because I have extended family members who have specifically stated such a thing (we are lily white).




By definition, a white supremacist would not be a Vice President to a non-white President. You need to think about the terminology you use before throwing out ridiculous insults/allegations.


Persons who despise Biden, Obama, Clinton, and Trump are not faithful disciples of Jesus. They need to repent.


Sure. But your talk about "character" rings completely false when you claim that Donald Trump is a "great man." Since Donald Trump's character is the antithesis of the teachings of Jesus (for instance, the Sermon on the Mount passage), Trump's character is literally antichrist. If you condemn Biden and Obama's alleged lack of character while embracing Trump's antichrist character, you are seriously deluded.

Don't you know all white people are white supremacists? Even black people who are conservative are white supremacists. You figure it out.

Now if you had problem with white people before obama, then maybe you're the reason why. The blacks and whites that I have known for decades never had racial problems. I worked with blacks (and whites) my whole life--never a problem. Until obama started stirring up racial division. It was NOT obama's color--we despise the policies of biden WORSE than we did obama's--does depersonalizing it make it sound better? I don't want either one of them to go to hell but I can't stand them because they are both wicked, biden even worse, so if it's color-motivated, how do you explain that?

Tim Scott is blacker than obama but I could support Tim Scott as president if he had more fire, more determination. He's a good man, but I think he's weak.

Donald Trump is a great man because he loves America, he hates the deep state--the swamp--and he gets behind issues that benefit America and he's tough as nails and fights to win. And he didn't even take a salary. Yes, he is a great President. That doesn't get him into Heaven, of course, but I'm not asking President Trump to be my pastor, but to be my president. He is NOT anti-Christ, nor does the job call for a person to Christlike--it calls for them to be tough--the job calls for a person to be "Caesar", not to be "God". Render unto Caesar...remember? Do YOU THINK obama or biden have any kind of decent character whatsoever? Please reply, because if you do, you and I have nothing to say to each other further.

 

[Baptist Believer]

Don't you know all white people are white supremacists?

Of course not.

Even black people who are conservative are white supremacists. You figure it out.

Wow. You are quite irrational.

Now if you had problem with white people before obama, then maybe you're the reason why.

Since I have never had a problem with white people, it is clear I am not the problem.

I am so white people thought I was an albino when I was a kid.

The blacks and whites that I have known for decades never had racial problems.

That’s good to hear. Your world is a lot different than the world in which I have existed.

I grew up in a heavily segregated region, with lots of ethnic tension. As I mentioned earlier, a few of my classmates in public school were junior members of the KKK. In the early 1970s, the local KKK had a rally (complete with cross burning) in a vacant field a block from my childhood home.

I worked with blacks (and whites) my whole life--never a problem.

Personally, I’ve never had any issues, but other white people did.

Until obama started stirring up racial division.

It already existed. Apparently you were not aware of it until Obama had to address it.

It was NOT obama's color--we despise the policies of biden WORSE than we did obama's--does depersonalizing it make it sound better?

I might believe you, but you said previously that it was an issue of character. Now you seem to be changing your tune since I called you out on it.

I don't want either one of them to go to hell but I can't stand them because they are both wicked, biden even worse, so if it's color-motivated, how do you explain that?

I can’t explain your beliefs since you have been quite irrational. You come across as someone who is trying to muddy the waters and evade my previous points.

Donald Trump is a great man because he loves America, he hates the deep state--the swamp--and he gets behind issues that benefit America and he's tough as nails and fights to win.

So why did you make an issue of the character of Obama and Biden, but don’t seem to have the same critique of Trump’s character?

And he didn't even take a salary.

Sure he did. And since some of his tax returns have been released, we know that he didn’t always donate his salary like he claimed.

Yes, he is a great President.

He is no longer President, nor will he likely be President again.

That doesn't get him into Heaven, of course, but I'm not asking President Trump to be my pastor, but to be my president.

If he is a person of bad character, how can you trust him to do the right thing?

He is NOT anti-Christ…

Sure he is. Compare his character to what Jesus describes in the Sermon on the Mount. Trump is the exact opposite. Moreover, according to President Trump, his favorite Bible verse is, allegedly, “an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth,” which is a view that Jesus explicitly repudiated.

…nor does the job call for a person to Christlike…

It calls for a person to be of good character.

…it calls for them to be tough…

It’s interesting that you don’t think that Jesus is “tough,” whatever that means to you.

…the job calls for a person to be "Caesar", not to be "God".

You realize that “Caesar” literally means “dictator” or “autocrat,” right? In the United States, the President is not supposed to be a dictator, but a servant of the people. He or she is the Chief Executive, not a Caesar.

Render unto Caesar...remember?

Sure. That’s why the confession, “Jesus is Lord,” was such a provocative political statement that brought persecution upon Christians. Subjects of the Roman Empire were supposed to say that “Caesar is Lord,” and worship him. Christians are supposed to pay taxes and be good citizens, but they are not to cede their worship to any human authority, and be willing to call out the evil of the authorities over them without regard to favors they might bestow. It is telling that so many Christians acknowledge that Trump is a person of bad character, but they will defend the evil things he does either because of political expediency (moral compromise) or cowardice.

Do YOU THINK obama or biden have any kind of decent character whatsoever?

I think Obama is a person of decent character. My opinion of him now is higher than when he was in office. I find Biden to be a pure politician, given to falsehoods when it is expedient.

Please reply, because if you do, you and I have nothing to say to each other further.

Wow, you really get triggered by people who hold different opinions than you.

I guess you should run away and sulk now.

 

[MrW]

Same principle for President Donald Trump, best President in a hundred years. obama and obiden the worst two ever, but a leftist is willfully blind to both facts.

 

[Baptist Believer]

(1) It's astounding how quickly and completely you have abandoned your assertion that Obama's character, not his ethnic heritage, was the reason you disliked him ("It’s not color—it’s character, rather the lack of it."). And with this meme and post, you are even abandoning the concept that character in a Presidential candidate should be an issue at all. Amazing!
(2) While I don't agree with your assertions at all, the statement in the meme is true. God can use both good and evil people for His own purposes and glory. The longer I watch the mainstream "conservative" Christian movement follow Donald Trump away from the teachings of Jesus, the more I believe God is using Donald Trump to judge and cleanse His church. Judgment begins in the house of God, and there are many charlatans and power-hungry pastors who need to be disciplined. As Trump faces the consequences of his actions, professed Christians will be forced to repent or be forever marked by the broader culture as something other than a disciple of Jesus.

 

[MrW]

I have NOT abandoned it. He has no character that I can see, none that is good. I merely acquiesced to the way YOU want to look at it, your approach and I STILL can't stand him. But I never stated his ethnic heritage was the problem--never--that was your argument, not mine because it isn't about his ethnic heritage at all. It is his lack of character, and his hatred of America, and his socialism--his policies. If it was his ethnic heritage, then the whites would think biden to be ok, but they don't--he is worse than obama, because his character, his policies, his decisions, are all worse.

As for presidents, and all other people, every human, they should be people of good character--I simply disagree with you that President Trump is of low character, but I won't bother to argue about it--I look at his Presidency, and it was great.

President Trump is not the Second Coming of Christ and I never expected him to be. But he's America's best President in the last 100 years. And obiden is the worst, and obama is the second worst, and Jimmy Carter has been bumped back to third, and I suppose he was happy about that.