What about coffee?

Care for a cup of Okinawan Bukubuku coffee? Had a cup week before last during our trip down there. Great stuff! "Bukubuku" means "bubbly," so they add a bunch of milk to some real strong coffee, then whip it up so it's bubbly. Kind of an Asian cappacino! :tongue3:

 

- Please Delete -

 

Mmm mm ... bring it on, JOJ!

 

This statement below. This is where we disagree.

The drugs you listed do not make you drunk, in my opinion. They alter your mind, they do damage to your body and are very similar to drunkness, but when they are used, you are not drunk. You are high, stoned, wasted, or any other many words that describe someone that is high on drugs other than alcohol.

When you are drunk, the way I have always understood it, you are drunk from wine or beer or other strong drink.

Again, I don't disagree with you in the notion that we shouldn't use drugs, but I do disagree with you that I believe you are mis-using the term drunk when describing someone high on drugs.

Jamie

 

I haven't had any caffeinated coffee for years, but I do occassionally drink a cup of decaf (which FYI has 2 to 3% of caffeine in it).

I just found that out last month when I had to take a test. Doctor said no coffee for 24 hours before the test and that included DECAF...

I can do without coffee - but DON'T TOUCH MY CHOCOLATE!

 

I usually have 2 cups of coffee per week. I like the flavor but I can live w/o it. On the other hand ... dark chocolate is my favorite, Sue.

 

But doesn't chocolate have caffeine in it, hmmmmm??:saint: :smilewinkgrin:

 

Tinytim said,

Warning: the following is NOT a defense of drugs. Plenty of prohibitions--legal, moral, and scriptural principles--exist to cover the use and abuse of illicit drugs.

"Drugs" is a man-made definition. Any ingested substance acts on the body in some way. Eat a teaspoon of sugar--it has an effect--even in the brain. At the most basic level, ingestion and the breaking down of substances alters the body. Obviously, the body handles breaking down a doughnut differently than a crack rock. And the latter much more profoundly effects the body, thought processes, and actions.

Caffeine is not an illicit drug. "Illicit drugs" have little or no medical use--or their potential for misuse makes usage impractical. Caffeine does have medicinal uses. Anyone ever take "Excedrin?" Caffeine with asprin (or barbituates such as butalbital) greatly increases its effectiveness at combatting headaches and other pain.

The "drug" issue is usually this: does the substance create a real or perceived need for more? (Often called "addictive.") Caffeine carries a mild addictive risk...but so do other things we tend to eat/drink (some studies have shown chocolate to be mildly addicting--even more for women than men (I'll find that study somewhere in my computer); it's unknown if this is due to caffeine content or another reason). Or does the substance become less effective over time unless doses are increased? ("Tolerance"). Of course, crack, meth, nicotine and other stuff does. Thus, there is a high risk that we, by taking them, create a strong "need" for the drug that will override morals, priorities, logic, and even our conscience. (our choice to do so)

People will often develop tolerance (and probably a mild addiction) to caffeine. But nowhere near the illicit drugs. Most folks, even without their "fix," will function just fine. "Users" of caffeine in general aren't willing to commit crimes, or go to unsafe measures to get caffeine. This in itself should tell us that the "addiction" is more of a nuisance and not destructive.

There are some folks that should lay off caffeine--those with dangerously high blood pressure, certain heart problems such as mitral valve prolapse, and some folks with proclivity towards certain types of kidneystones. If you know caffeine in any amount causes problems for your body, it would be wrong for you to take it. If caffeine is so important to you that you're unable to show God's love because of your focus on your morning coffee, then it's too important. If one ingests so much caffeine that going without causes headaches, or one finds their heart racing and experiences jitters or nervousness, it's time to cut back or quit.

Wow. I just wrote a whole page about a stupid cup of coffee.

 

I see where you are coming from now Jamie;
I guess we need to start all over searching. If the Law picks you up the offense is the same.
DUI= Driving under the influence, could be one of those drugs listed or could be acohol. I think we agree on that. Sorry it took me so long to see what you were saying.

Drunk Driving
Due to the efforts of advocacy groups like MADD, the penalties and consequences of driving under the influence of alcohol and drugs have gotten much stiffer.

 

DC appears to be stiffest. They can arrest you for a .01 BAC.

 

tinytim, do you drink coffee? I can't remember if you said in the last 10 pages ...

 

Caffeine is a stimulant. That's why it makes you feel more awake. When it leaves your system, you feel more tired than you would have if you hadn't had the caffeine.

It can throw off your heartbeat. (overdose and it can be deadly)

Benign breast lumps can result.

Increases acid production when the body tried to digest it. This can lead to heartburn and ulcers and increase bleeding in those who already have ulcers.

http://www.xs4all.nl/~4david/caffeine.html There's some more information, although this looks like it isn't a very inclusive list.

Here's more: http://stress.about.com/od/stresshealth/a/caffeine.htm

 

Isn't that gluttony? :laugh: Just playin' with ya "santa" :laugh:

 

My Grandmother used to have a snort with her coffee.

 

It's better with a mouth full of ice cream!

 

Actualy its just coffee. There are a very few that will drink caffeine free coke but most have no problem with coke/pepsi. It is actually not the caffeine but hot drink they are against. I know alot of Mormons that take caffeine supliments, nodoze, etc.

I have never heard of a Mormon who avoids chocolate.

 

I sure miss my ECA stack (ephedrine / caffeine / asprin combined) for weight loss. The fat would melt off, and the appetite would become non existent. The whole ephedra ordeal was overblown because the deaths of a couple overweight pro athletes who abused it (more than the recommended dose). There are only like 100 documented deaths since 1996 linked directly to ephedra, while there are over 10,000 deaths linked to tylenol. The FDA really went off the deep end, and that's why the supreme court overruled the decision in '05. The down side is the fact that companies are afraid to produce it again, so it's almost impossible to find, except overseas.

 

True story:

I was in advanced inorganic quantitative analysis lab (a chemistry class) in college. We had to extract caffeine from tea leaves. There were about 60 in the class--paired up; so the result was about 30 test tubes nearly full of a creamy off-white, fluffy powder.

That night, about half the tubes were stolen. We estimated there was 2-3x an adult lethal dose of caffeine stolen.

For weeks, we looked for someone wide-eyed and jumpy on campus...never saw 'em. I think the authorities finally decided that it was either:
-pranksters,
-students who didn't do well and destroyed the evidence,
-some idiot trying to pass this stuff off as cocaine on the drug market.

If they were "users" they either died of a heart attack, or went insane from weeks of insomnia.