CBTS,
now, for the rest of the story...
Matt 27:50 tells us the Jesus cried with a loud voice and “yielded up the ghost”. Three times we read that Jesus “gave up the ghost” (Mark 15:37,39; Luke 23:46) in the sense that “He died”. These words are a translation of the word “ekpnew” - “to breathe out” or in context to breathe his last. The word for “spirit” comes from the Greek “pneuma” which has “pnew” “breath” or “wind” as its cognate. Many times we read in the Bible that someone “gave up the ghost” (Gen 25:8,17; 35:29; et al). Yet Jesus did not simply “breathe out his last”. The primary meaning of “aphia(h)mi” is “to send away”. It was used by a master to his servant when all the tasks had been completed, “I do not need you right now, you are dismissed”. This is the sense in which Jesus “yielded up the ghost”. N
NE BUT JESUS EVER HAS OR EVER WILL “yield up the ghost” by a voluntary act of the will. Why not? Because as sinners, death has a full claim on our lives.
Apart from this, all die because all are sinners. That is why babies die, too. They are sinners. So, how then can I maintain that babies go to heaven when they die?
After his child died, King David said, “ wherefore should I fast? can I bring him back again? I shall go to him, but he shall not return to me” (2Sam 12:23). David elsewhere clearly expressed his faith that he would in his flesh stand in the presence of his Redeemer. The fact that he finds some comfort in the knowledge that he would “go to him” suggests that David had confidence that the child was secure in the comfort of God’s love. Is there an explicit statement to that effect? No.
I know that we cannot determine theological truth by what seems right to our sin cursed hearts and minds, but the patriarch asked the pre-incarnate LORD, “Shall not the judge of all the earth do right?” (Gen 18:25). We may fully rest assured that He will indeed do right.
The only answer to the fact that they are sinners and may somehow be in heaven with the Lord is that somehow they are covered by His grace on the basis of the blood shed on Calvary. The death of the Savior is fully efficacious to cover all who are the objects of His grace. When the people brought the “infants that He would touch them” Jesus announced, “Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child shall in no wise enter therein”. Again, not an explicit statement, but a very clear indication of God’s heart for the little ones. For me, it is enough, for now.
So to answer your question. No, babies did not “sin in Adam”. Mentally deficient people did not “sin in Adam”. No one sinned “in Adam”. But, being “in Adam” we all sin. It is the fallen nature and we are all guilty for our own sin. Small children are responsible for their actions. The question is, are they accountable if they are not morally capable of discerning right from wrong? I believe that as long as children do not have any conscience of right and wrong, they are somehow covered by the sacrifice of Jesus on the cross. One of the key elements in the condemnation of guilty sinners is the fact that they were warned or otherwise should have known better. In Romans 1 the whole world is seen as being made aware of the creator through the glory of creation. It would seem to me that childhood innocence is somehow covered in the grace of God for the reasons I have shared. Again, not any kind of explicit statement, but rather subtle statements and implications from the overall tenor of the Word of God.
To respond to your post (I wrote from “later...” on while at the hospital, just got home, have another appt in 34 minutes!)... No one else participated in Adam’s sin. The text just will not support that view, especially when comparing with the rest of Scripture. Alternate translations are as follows:
Rom 5:12
(ALT) For this reason, even as through one man sin entered into the world, and through sin death; and thus death passed through [or, extended] to all people, for that [or, because] all sinned;
(ASV) Therefore, as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin; and so death passed unto all men, for that all sinned:--
(BBE) For this reason, as through one man sin came into the world, and death because of sin, and so death came to all men, because all have done evil:
(CEV) Adam sinned, and that sin brought death into the world. Now everyone has sinned, and so everyone must die.
(Darby) For this cause , even as by one man sin entered into the world, and by sin death; and thus death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
(EMTV) Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death passed to all men, because all sinned--
(ESV) Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned--
(GB) Wherefore, as by one man sinne entred into ye world, and death by sinne, and so death went ouer all men: in who all men haue sinned.
(GNB) Sin came into the world through one man, and his sin brought death with it. As a result, death has spread to the whole human race because everyone has sinned.
(GW) Sin came into the world through one person, and death came through sin. So death spread to everyone, because everyone sinned.
(ISV) Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, so death spread to everyone, because all have sinned.
(KJV) Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
(LITV) Because of this, even as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, so also death passed to all men, inasmuch as all sinned.
(MKJV) Therefore, even as through one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin, and so death passed on all men inasmuch as all sinned:
(MSG) You know the story of how Adam landed us in the dilemma we're in--first sin, then death, and no one exempt from either sin or death.
(NASB) Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned--
(YLT) because of this, even as through one man the sin did enter into the world, and through the sin the death; and thus to all men the death did pass through, for that all did sin;
None of these translations say that “all sinned in Adam”, they all say that all have sinned. This is another way of restating 3:10 and 3:23, there is nothing in the text to say that all of us are RESPONSIBLE for Adam’s sin. We all suffer consequences of Adam’s sin but we are responsible for our own sin. We sin because of the sin nature we inherit from Adam. Therefore “in Adam we are all sinners” and therefore we all die.
Gen 2:16 and 17 states ADAM'S responsibility for his sin. Later God will explain a little about how wide-ranging the consequences will be, but God never holds us accountable for Adam's sin.
Consequences of sin pass on to the third and forth generation (Exod 20:5; 34:7; Num 14:18; Deut 5:9) , and sometimes much longer as in Adam's case.
BUT, GOD DOES NOT HOLD FUTURE GENERATIONS ACCOUNTABLE FOR THE SINS OF PREVIOUS GENERATIONS (Deut 24:16; Ezek 18:20)
Will I be dogmatic on the infant salvation issue? Not me. Am I none-the-less settled in my position and convinced that it is right? Absolutely. Col 3:15 - “...Let the peace of God rule in your hearts...”
now, for the rest of the story...
Matt 27:50 tells us the Jesus cried with a loud voice and “yielded up the ghost”. Three times we read that Jesus “gave up the ghost” (Mark 15:37,39; Luke 23:46) in the sense that “He died”. These words are a translation of the word “ekpnew” - “to breathe out” or in context to breathe his last. The word for “spirit” comes from the Greek “pneuma” which has “pnew” “breath” or “wind” as its cognate. Many times we read in the Bible that someone “gave up the ghost” (Gen 25:8,17; 35:29; et al). Yet Jesus did not simply “breathe out his last”. The primary meaning of “aphia(h)mi” is “to send away”. It was used by a master to his servant when all the tasks had been completed, “I do not need you right now, you are dismissed”. This is the sense in which Jesus “yielded up the ghost”. N
NE BUT JESUS EVER HAS OR EVER WILL “yield up the ghost” by a voluntary act of the will. Why not? Because as sinners, death has a full claim on our lives. Apart from this, all die because all are sinners. That is why babies die, too. They are sinners. So, how then can I maintain that babies go to heaven when they die?
After his child died, King David said, “ wherefore should I fast? can I bring him back again? I shall go to him, but he shall not return to me” (2Sam 12:23). David elsewhere clearly expressed his faith that he would in his flesh stand in the presence of his Redeemer. The fact that he finds some comfort in the knowledge that he would “go to him” suggests that David had confidence that the child was secure in the comfort of God’s love. Is there an explicit statement to that effect? No.
I know that we cannot determine theological truth by what seems right to our sin cursed hearts and minds, but the patriarch asked the pre-incarnate LORD, “Shall not the judge of all the earth do right?” (Gen 18:25). We may fully rest assured that He will indeed do right.
The only answer to the fact that they are sinners and may somehow be in heaven with the Lord is that somehow they are covered by His grace on the basis of the blood shed on Calvary. The death of the Savior is fully efficacious to cover all who are the objects of His grace. When the people brought the “infants that He would touch them” Jesus announced, “Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child shall in no wise enter therein”. Again, not an explicit statement, but a very clear indication of God’s heart for the little ones. For me, it is enough, for now.
So to answer your question. No, babies did not “sin in Adam”. Mentally deficient people did not “sin in Adam”. No one sinned “in Adam”. But, being “in Adam” we all sin. It is the fallen nature and we are all guilty for our own sin. Small children are responsible for their actions. The question is, are they accountable if they are not morally capable of discerning right from wrong? I believe that as long as children do not have any conscience of right and wrong, they are somehow covered by the sacrifice of Jesus on the cross. One of the key elements in the condemnation of guilty sinners is the fact that they were warned or otherwise should have known better. In Romans 1 the whole world is seen as being made aware of the creator through the glory of creation. It would seem to me that childhood innocence is somehow covered in the grace of God for the reasons I have shared. Again, not any kind of explicit statement, but rather subtle statements and implications from the overall tenor of the Word of God.
To respond to your post (I wrote from “later...” on while at the hospital, just got home, have another appt in 34 minutes!)... No one else participated in Adam’s sin. The text just will not support that view, especially when comparing with the rest of Scripture. Alternate translations are as follows:
Rom 5:12
(ALT) For this reason, even as through one man sin entered into the world, and through sin death; and thus death passed through [or, extended] to all people, for that [or, because] all sinned;
(ASV) Therefore, as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin; and so death passed unto all men, for that all sinned:--
(BBE) For this reason, as through one man sin came into the world, and death because of sin, and so death came to all men, because all have done evil:
(CEV) Adam sinned, and that sin brought death into the world. Now everyone has sinned, and so everyone must die.
(Darby) For this cause , even as by one man sin entered into the world, and by sin death; and thus death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
(EMTV) Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death passed to all men, because all sinned--
(ESV) Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned--
(GB) Wherefore, as by one man sinne entred into ye world, and death by sinne, and so death went ouer all men: in who all men haue sinned.
(GNB) Sin came into the world through one man, and his sin brought death with it. As a result, death has spread to the whole human race because everyone has sinned.
(GW) Sin came into the world through one person, and death came through sin. So death spread to everyone, because everyone sinned.
(ISV) Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, so death spread to everyone, because all have sinned.
(KJV) Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:
(LITV) Because of this, even as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, so also death passed to all men, inasmuch as all sinned.
(MKJV) Therefore, even as through one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin, and so death passed on all men inasmuch as all sinned:
(MSG) You know the story of how Adam landed us in the dilemma we're in--first sin, then death, and no one exempt from either sin or death.
(NASB) Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned--
(YLT) because of this, even as through one man the sin did enter into the world, and through the sin the death; and thus to all men the death did pass through, for that all did sin;
None of these translations say that “all sinned in Adam”, they all say that all have sinned. This is another way of restating 3:10 and 3:23, there is nothing in the text to say that all of us are RESPONSIBLE for Adam’s sin. We all suffer consequences of Adam’s sin but we are responsible for our own sin. We sin because of the sin nature we inherit from Adam. Therefore “in Adam we are all sinners” and therefore we all die.
Gen 2:16 and 17 states ADAM'S responsibility for his sin. Later God will explain a little about how wide-ranging the consequences will be, but God never holds us accountable for Adam's sin.
Consequences of sin pass on to the third and forth generation (Exod 20:5; 34:7; Num 14:18; Deut 5:9) , and sometimes much longer as in Adam's case.
BUT, GOD DOES NOT HOLD FUTURE GENERATIONS ACCOUNTABLE FOR THE SINS OF PREVIOUS GENERATIONS (Deut 24:16; Ezek 18:20)
Will I be dogmatic on the infant salvation issue? Not me. Am I none-the-less settled in my position and convinced that it is right? Absolutely. Col 3:15 - “...Let the peace of God rule in your hearts...”
