What do we believe about “hell?”

[Alcott]

Following up on another thread, this is a poll to see what we believe about hell. We will say up front that “hell” is a Germanic word and therefore it inevitably has connections to the ancient pre-Christian beliefs of people who are, for many (probably most) of us, our distant ancestors. So, while the word hell is used for many concepts of the dead in the Bible-- sheol, gehenna, hades, the lake of fire-- we will confine its meaning here to the place to which the souls of those who died physically without the blood of Jesus “go” upon physical death; thus, differentiating it from the grave which holds the remains of those without breath, and from the Lake of Fire, the eternal situation of the unsaved and of hell itself. So please do not argue the semantics in this thread so we can really compare what we believe about the concepts, not the terms..

 

[Baptist Believer]

None of the above.

 

[TCassidy]

I would have liked to agree with "The real torment of hell is the absence of God" but could not due to the way it is worded.

I would agree that one of the torments of hell is the absence of God.

 

[evangelist6589]

None of the above.

Whats your position on the matter?

 

[evangelist6589]

It would appear based on the other thread that MOST on this board hold to the traditional view on Hell (which is good). For disagreement one can visit christianforums.com or some other website.

 

[ReformedBaptist]

When I tried to vote it said I gave an unspecified error...hahaha!

I believe hell is real, literal, and quite horrible beyond our wildest imagination. It is conscious and brings immense suffering. I believe everything the Bible teaches about it.

 

[Internet Theologian]

When I tried to vote it said I gave an unspecified error...hahaha!

I believe hell is real, literal, and quite horrible beyond our wildest imagination. It is conscious and brings immense suffering. I believe everything the Bible teaches about it.

Yes, I believe it is beyond our comprehension.

There are some who hold to annihilation, so I take it this must mean those suffering in hell now, for 'thousands of years' cannot wait for the consummation of the age so they can get relief from their torment. This is only one reason I reject the theory of non eternal suffering and punishment.

 

[ReformedBaptist]

Yes, I believe it is beyond our comprehension.

There are some who hold to annihilation, so I take it this must mean those suffering in hell now, for 'thousands of years' cannot wait for the consummation of the age so they can get relief from their torment. This is only one reason I reject the theory of non eternal suffering and punishment.

It seems many want to reject this vital truth. The only reason I can imagine is they allow their own feelings and sentiments to be their guide. It is a matter of measuring the yardstick by the cloth. When we look at Scripture and see that this is, indeed, how God punishes sin, then we must take a lesson on the severity of sin. I have often heard men criticize saying, 'Are you saying that I will suffer forever and ever for a lie or getting drunk, et.' You see what they do? They depreciate their sin and the severity of it rather than to acknowledge that its heinous nature is seen in the punishment an all holy God whose judgement are altogether righteous gives to sin.

Then without thinking, those who call Jesus their Lord and Savior profane His sacrifice by denying this truth because Jesus bore in Himself the sins of His people and drank to the full the cup of the wrath of God against sin. They also make themselves wiser than God who has shown these things by plain illustration. If there are any reading this board who have a contrary opinion consider the following:

Mark 9
43 And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:

44 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

45 And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:

46 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

47 And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of God with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:

48 Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

The worm here are maggots and if we can all understand fire. Here is a hideous illustration of a worm that is everlastingly consuming an unconsummable body. Here is a fire that everlasting burns that fuel that can never be burned up. Isaiah spoke this also as we see in Isaiah 66:24

And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcasses of the men that transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.

To imagine any supposed annihilation is an invention of the minds of men. See what the prophets have said and moreover our Lord Jesus Christ. And take the lesson well. Cast sin away from you and turn from it.

 

[Alcott]

It seems to be true that there is not much variation of beliefs on this board in regard to topics such as the afterlife, so many of these poll answers are lonely.

So how about this question: do we retain any form of our own will in heaven/paradise? In common human interactions it is said, "nobody's perfect." In scripture it is put "all have sinned and come short..." So our own wills are not acceptable (perfect). So if we still have any such, might we be kicked out? Did anybody ever sing a silly song that starts "Found a peanut'...in which that idea is presented? The idea May not be as silly as the song if we do indeed still have our own will, for no matter how many centuries we're "there," we would do something less than perfect.

 

[Internet Theologian]

It seems to be true that there is not much variation of beliefs on this board in regard to topics such as the afterlife, so many of these poll answers are lonely.

There are some who have varying beliefs and question the biblical fact of eternal torment. Sais may not have chimed in on this thread.

So how about this question: do we retain any form of our own will in heaven/paradise? In common human interactions it is said, "nobody's perfect." In scripture it is put "all have sinned and come short..." So our own wills are not acceptable (perfect). So if we still have any such, might we be kicked out? Did anybody ever sing a silly song that starts "Found a peanut'...in which that idea is presented? The idea May not be as silly as the song if we do indeed still have our own will, for no matter how many centuries we're "there," we would do something less than perfect.

It is probable that each of us have bizarre questions as to 'what is next', or, as to what happens to all our logical and seemingly reasoned questions regarding what takes place among the converted in the so-called 'after life'.

I appreciate your candor and honesty.

 

[JamesL]

It seems to be true that there is not much variation of beliefs on this board in regard to topics such as the afterlife, so many of these poll answers are lonely.

So how about this question: do we retain any form of our own will in heaven/paradise? In common human interactions it is said, "nobody's perfect." In scripture it is put "all have sinned and come short..." So our own wills are not acceptable (perfect). So if we still have any such, might we be kicked out? Did anybody ever sing a silly song that starts "Found a peanut'...in which that idea is presented? The idea May not be as silly as the song if we do indeed still have our own will, for no matter how many centuries we're "there," we would do something less than perfect.

One of the greatest failures of Protestant doctrine is the notion that our righteousness goes absolutely no further thsn being "credited"

This notion that nobody's perfect is as anti-Christian as can be. Jesus "be perfect, as you Father in heaven is perfect"

Now, He didn't say ACT perfect, He said BE perfect. In the same context, He told them about seeming the kingdom of God and HIS righteousness.

Funny, Paul said the kingdom of God is righteousness in the Holy Spirit (Romans 14:22) and that in becoming a new creation we BECOME the righteousness (2Cor 5:21)

He saved us - by the washing of regeneration (Titus 3:5)

If a man's righteousness goes no further than "credited" then he simply is not born again.

In regeneration, our spirit is cleansed of sin
In resurrection, our body will be.

In heaven, we will have no influence other than perfection

 

[TCassidy]

Jesus "be perfect, as you Father in heaven is perfect"

Be ye therefore perfect, as your Father,.... This perfection is to be restrained to the subject Christ is upon, love to men, and not to be referred to any, or every other thing; wherefore, in Luk_6:36 it is, "be ye merciful, as your Father also is merciful"; and regards not a perfection of degree in that, but objects and quality: that is to say, not that men may, or can, or ought to be as perfect in love, as to the degree of it, as God is; that is impossible: the "as" here, is not a note of equality, but of likeness: such, who profess God to be their Father, ought to imitate him, particularly in their love to men, which ought to be extended to the same objects, as the divine goodness is; that, as he shows regard in a providential way to all men, good and bad, just and unjust, and his tender mercies are over all his works; so ought they to love all men with a natural affection, and hate no man, no, not their enemies: for he that loves only his friends, and not his enemies, loves imperfectly; he does not take in the whole compass of objects his love is to extend unto; and as God loves sincerely, and without dissimulation, so should they.

This is the exact opposite of condemning those who you think are of less spiritual worth than you think you are.

 

[Alcott]

This notion that nobody's perfect is as anti-Christian as can be. Jesus "be perfect, as you Father in heaven is perfect"

My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous [I John 2:1].

Either Jesus is an advocate for non-Christians, or Christians are not perfect.

In heaven, we will have no influence other than perfection

Do you have a scripture on that? Where did Satan's influence come from?

Euclid wrote out the axioms of geometry, which have been followed for centuries. But the beginning of non-Euclidean geometry was based on one of his axioms which stated:

In a plane, given a line and a point not on it, at most one line parallel to the given line can be drawn through the point.

This has been argued, because 'point,' 'line,' and 'plane' are themselves presumptions, and any point can be considered infinitely small. That being the case, how can there be only one parallel line to another line through that one (other) point? There can be many, or else, when thinking infinitely small, then all lines must eventually meet somewhere, and therefore parallel is only an imaginary concept. That, to me, is a mathematical equivalent to the question, "Can we go to infinity [eternity] never changing from perfection? Not, as far as I can see, if we still have a will of our own, and anything in the infinitesimally small difference between God's will and our will is imperfection-- sin.

 

[JamesL]

My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous [I John 2:1].

Either Jesus is an advocate for non-Christians, or Christians are not perfect....

I wrote...
Now, He didn't say ACT perfect, He said BE perfect.


God isn't righteous because He acts righteous. And neirher is a Christian.

[Edited]

 

[evangelist6589]

When I tried to vote it said I gave an unspecified error...hahaha!

I believe hell is real, literal, and quite horrible beyond our wildest imagination. It is conscious and brings immense suffering. I believe everything the Bible teaches about it.

Are the flames literal or metaphorical?

 

[Internet Theologian]

One of the greatest failures of Protestant doctrine is the notion that our righteousness goes absolutely no further thsn being "credited"

This notion that nobody's perfect is as anti-Christian as can be. Jesus "be perfect, as you Father in heaven is perfect"

Oh, so all who don't subscribe to your error are antichrist?

Nope. In all actuality your philosophy is what is antichrist. It is exactly what 1 John refers to. You're in grave error.

 

[ReformedBaptist]

Are the flames literal or metaphorical?

I believe they are quite real, literal, and unquenchable. I don't see anything in the text of Scripture regarding hell that suggests a metaphor.

 

[ReformedBaptist]

It seems to be true that there is not much variation of beliefs on this board in regard to topics such as the afterlife, so many of these poll answers are lonely.

So how about this question: do we retain any form of our own will in heaven/paradise? In common human interactions it is said, "nobody's perfect." In scripture it is put "all have sinned and come short..." So our own wills are not acceptable (perfect). So if we still have any such, might we be kicked out? Did anybody ever sing a silly song that starts "Found a peanut'...in which that idea is presented? The idea May not be as silly as the song if we do indeed still have our own will, for no matter how many centuries we're "there," we would do something less than perfect.

This is a good question. My answer is that Adam was created with a will that was mutable, so that he could change. In glory, the perfection of the saints is such that we will be made to be immutable. We will never be able to fall after we have been changed.

 

[JamesL]

Oh, so all who don't subscribe to your error are antichrist?

Nope. In all actuality your philosophy is what is antichrist. It is exactly what 1 John refers to. You're in grave error.

I guess it's always easier to accuse and dismiss rather than to study and show yourself approved, isn't it?

If it were such grave error, it would be easy to demonstrate from scripture. But I see that part was lacking

Good job. I'm sure somewhere there is a Roman Catholic priest whose awful proud of you

 

[Alcott]

7

I wrote...
Now, He didn't say ACT perfect, He said BE perfect.

Yet, you go off on a behavioral tangent...??

If there is anything further to discuss on this, you're going to have to explain how someone can be perfect while the same's actions are not perfect. Jesus said a good tree produces good fruit, while the converse also is true.