What do you think of Billy Graham, and WHY?

[gb93433]

A hearty AMEN to this post of the U-man! A thread now closed is called :"Sally Quinn On Rick Warren". A guy with the handle of gb93433 said that I was spreading gossip and lies about Billy Graham.According to Gb he knows that I am wrong and that I haven't a clue as to what I'm talking about.I am filled with lies and gossip.I fabricate lies.And so on and so-forth per gb93433.

So I thought I would reprise what Ulsterman has said here about Billy Graham.Perhaps gb would like to try to dispute clear realities.

Prov. 17:10, "A rebuke goes deeper into one who has understanding than a hundred blows into a fool. "

At least you could have the integrity to make quotes or document the source of your opinions from primary sources. Your documentation is zero. If a paper showed up like that in any college or high school class it would be rejected due to plagiarism (stealing another person's work which is not yours).

People get expelled from secular universities and failed in classes because they plagiarize. At least you could have some integrity and rise above plagiarism.

 

[Steven2006]

I have always held Billy Graham in high regards.

 

[Rippon]

Prov. 17:10, "A rebuke goes deeper into one who has understanding than a hundred blows into a fool. "

At least you could have the integrity to make quotes or document the source of your opinions from primary sources. Your documentation is zero. If a paper showed up like that in any college or high school class it would be rejected due to plagiarism (stealing another person's work which is not yours).

People get expelled from secular universities and failed in classes because they plagiarize. At least you could have some integrity and rise above plagiarism.

The info I shared is common knowledge -- or at least it should be except for those who have had their heads buried in the sand for the last 50 years.

If I recall correctly he said some of the same old stuff about pagans not knowing about Christ but still being saved in a 1978 McCall's magazine article too.

For a supposed knowledgeable Christian you don't evidence basic fundamentals or rudimentary discernment.You're trying to tell me that you are completely unaware of his interviews with Larry King over the years?That program has given him a platform to spread misinformation [understatement]about the Christian faith.

Gb,you are one hate-filled individual with no sense of shame.The things I related about Billy Graham have nothing to do with personal animosity for the man.He's a nice,personable,upright fellow.He's very sincere and humble.But theologically he has been dead-wrong for half a century on core Biblical doctrines.I am not referring to C vs. A.The things he has stood for are against the Word of God.As a world famous "Evangelist" he has not been delivering the message of Christ with fidelity.The singularity of Christ has not been evidenced.He has taken the "many ways to God approach."

How can you deny his affiliation with Roman Catholicism?
How can you deny that he has not given tacit endorsement to out-and-out theological liberals over the decades?
How can you deny that in his "Crusades" people are just led back to their old churches -- whether Mormon,Roman Catholic etc?
How can you sit there and deny anything that I have said about the man?

Futhermore,how can you have the nerve to call me such nasty names when I am the one who has not lied? But consider yourself and your state.It's a sobering thing to face up to the "every idle word which is spoken" charge when you face the Almighty .

 

[gb93433]

The info I shared is common knowledge -- or at least it should be except for those who have had their heads buried in the sand for the last 50 years.

If it were so “common” then you should be able to find the information easily because it is so "common." You have not provided one shred of evidence in any primary sources to back up what you wrote. How could you expect anyone to believe you with nothing other than opinion.

If I recall correctly he said some of the same old stuff about pagans not knowing about Christ but still being saved in a 1978 McCall's magazine article too.

Recall? That is simply gossip. You do not even know for sure. Again not one source of your information.

For a supposed knowledgeable Christian you don't evidence basic fundamentals or rudimentary discernment.You're trying to tell me that you are completely unaware of his interviews with Larry King over the years?That program has given him a platform to spread misinformation [understatement]about the Christian faith.

I really do not spend much time listening to juicy junk on TV. Again it is nothing more than gossip without any primary sources. By asking the right questions I could make you look like you are not even a Christian. I could also make you look very disobedient too. I did see a one hour interview about 1997 by David Frost and it was much different than anything you suggest. The BGEA website seems to be quite clear too. Some of the men I know who have worked for the BGEA are very sound. They were men who made disciples not just pew warmers and preachers. Some of them were involved in the Navigators prior to that time. Dawson Trotman started the follow up. Charlie Riggs followed later on. Where are the evangelists who are Grahams critics? With their "perfect theology" at least they could put it to work and reach the world. Why haven't they

Gb,you are one hate-filled individual with no sense of shame.

Why should I be shameful of doing right? God hates a lying tongue and gossip. Too many churches today are a cesspool of gossip and someone needs to take a stand against that trash. The last time I took a stand I found who the gossip in the church was. He came out and nearly hit me.

But theologically he has been dead-wrong for half a century on core Biblical doctrines.I am not referring to C vs. A.The things he has stood for are against the Word of God.As a world famous "Evangelist" he has not been delivering the message of Christ with fidelity.The singularity of Christ has not been evidenced.He has taken the "many ways to God approach."

If you really believe that then go back in Baptist history just about 200 or 300 years and you will find some rather strange things. Yet God used those men and women. There are things I do not agree with him about but it is my responsibility to not gossip about him. We can debate scripture, but to gossip about a man is different. I have not even always agreed with myself over the years. I am surrounded by so many people that I could literally spend 24 hours each day sharing my faith. I do not have time to engage in such gossip about God's servant. Do you realize who reads this board? It is a public board for all to read.

How can you deny his affiliation with Roman Catholicism?

Isn't it better to have a relationship with Catholics and have them hear the gospel than shun them and turn them away. When I was in high school the first person I knew who was a Christian was a lady who was a Catholic. One of my friends was the son of a Baptist pastor and went to DBU. Another student was rather strange and carried his Bible to class and everywhere he went, but never said anything about Christ that I knew about. When I came to Christ one of the first men I met was a young man who told me that he became a Christian through a Catholic priest who had just become a Christian. Do not doubt the power of God to work. What did Jesus say about who should have a millstone around their neck? The only people Jesus condemned in scripture were the religionists.

How can you deny that in his "Crusades" people are just led back to their old churches -- whether Mormon,Roman Catholic etc?

Think about how many were around Jesus and were not obedient. Judas was around Jesus who is God and went out and hung himself. Was Jesus a failure?
When you start reaching the masses with the gospel then let us know how many you have followed up on. If you do not like what is going on then get out and win them yourself. I was given a card of a Mormon who made a decision for Christ. I was pastoring a Baptist church at the time. The BGEA folks made regular calls to me.

How can you sit there and deny anything that I have said about the man?

You have mixed truth and lies without an understanding why the decisions were made. Evangelists are not an “us four and no more” people. They are evangelists. Why have you not followed up on the decisions that were made at each of the crusades? Isn’t that the role of the church? Where are they? Your comments remind me of the time a pastor I knew led several hundred Mormons to Christ and the church was full of them. He was accused of accommodating Mormons. So the dead wood deacons told him to leave because the new Christians were not Baptist enough and the church was changing. I heard the same thing too from the dead wood. The church today is back to where it was years ago--dead and just a few people.

Futhermore,how can you have the nerve to call me such nasty names when I am the one who has not lied? But consider yourself and your state.It's a sobering thing to face up to the "every idle word which is spoken" charge when you face the Almighty .

Apparently you have not gotten the message and continue to justify your gossip. Even "if" everything you mentioned were true it does not edify and it is gossip. Why did you write something that is not verifiable? If you had one of your students write an English paper and told them to use MLA format, but did not see one in text citation or any references or bibliography what would you think? Stole information and made it his own? Copy and paste? Plagiarism?
Tell me how your theology has never changed.

I want to see your sources so I can verify what you write. Do you really think I am not so gullible to believe everything you write? When I look the BGEA website I am unable to verify anything you write about Graham. So where is your evidence?

 

[Jim1999]

For Dr. Billy Graham, the man, I have nothing but high regard. I would never attend nor support any of his missions. I am not saying that he didn't preach the gospel, but one doesn't hold hands with the devil to preach the gospel. This is virtually what he did over the years because it was the only way his association could all churches in a city to come together for a huge crowd of people.

Many people are co-erced to come forward at the appropriate time..Say a quick prayer and one is saved. They are then sent back to their own churches. That was part of the conditions laid down by the liberal churches to participate.

I don't associate with the World Council of Churches and certainly couldn't co-operate with its evangelistic organization.

Again, I can't deny that people haven't been saved at those meetings, I am not denying the man,,,,,,I am denying the organization.

Cheers,

Jim

 

[gb93433]

Many people are coerced to come forward at the appropriate time..Say a quick prayer and one is saved. They are then sent back to their own churches. That was part of the conditions laid down by the liberal churches to participate.

What would you suggest one do instead? That is the thing I have always wrestled with. The reason I ask is that I have thought about doing something through churches to make disciples and train people but I have always struggled with the logistics.

Graham writes in his book that in past years some of the fundamentalists fabricated lies about him. So it is easy to see why he wanted nothing to do with them. So I do not see that he had a lot of choice. I suppose he could have gone the route of Bible believing Bible churches instead. I really do not know. I do think he sought to reach more people. I know that when I lived in Hosuton that people told me there that it was Graham who made quite a difference regarding the segregation issue when none of the church did anything.

At one time I was in a great church that sought to reach the city. Many came to know Christ and the churches that participated grew well. Every church that participated was evangelical and were good solid churches. I was surprised to find that the SBC and GARB churches would not participate. Today the SBC church hardly exists and will not let the local SBC Korean church plant use the premises to conduct its services in Korean. The Korean church is larger than the English speaking church too. The GARB church has weeds growing in the parking lot and has just a handful of people attending. The building is all run down. At one time both of those churches were doing well but it seems since the time they were asked to participate in a city wide oureach that is the same time they began to die.

I am of the opinion that if a church will not work, will not try to live the Christian life and reach people then it does not need a pastor but a mortician. We know what Jesus did with people who would not follow Him.

I think if the churches would be doing their work then there would be no need for outside things. I think the BGEA is a result of the failure of churches to do their work.

I don't associate with the World Council of Churches and certainly couldn't co-operate with its evangelistic organization.

How does that work if you are an Anglican?

 

[Jim1999]

Anglicans would go along with the crusades...........I grew up and was saved in the Church of England, but I am an ordained Baptist...Canadian Baptist.

Cheers,

Jim