What Does It mean "Those GOD Foreknew He Predestined?"

[mandym]

Those who deny calvinistic teaching generally do not understand effectual calling, or the other 4 pts either. If they did, they would embrace it as it is the truth of God.

This is the problematic attitude of Calvinists and why they are so brazen. Whether you intended it to be or not it is arrogant and in fact not true. The problem with it is the instance that God refuses to offer grace to some people. It just cannot be back up with scripture as hard as you might try. And the false doctrine of "effectual calling" is not layed out in scripture but imposed on a few choice passages.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

This is the problematic attitude of Calvinists and why they are so brazen. Whether you intended it to be or not it is arrogant and in fact not true. The problem with it is the instance that God refuses to offer grace to some people. It just cannot be back up with scripture as hard as you might try. And the false doctrine of "effectual calling" is not layed out in scripture but imposed on a few choice passages.

Oh Really?!? How about John 6:44 " no one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him"

 

[mandym]

Oh Really?!? How about John 6:44 " no one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him"

Nothing about that says that God does not offer grace to some people.

 

[psalms109:31]

Oh Really?!? How about John 6:44 " no one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him"

I agree with this and following a crowd doesn't mean you were drawn by the Father either.

After Jesus is lifted up then all men will be drawn to Jesus and He brings before all men life and death to believe trust in Him and be saved or not and be condemned. So choose life. God has made us the messenger of this.

So many see it the way it was before the cross and can't see it the way it is now and visa-versa.

All authority has been given to Christ Jesus.

 

[ReformedBaptist]

Obviously God can look into the future and know what someone will do, but that isn't the same as causing that event to happen.

I would certainly say 8:28 is not to be interpreted on an individual basis though.

For instance, when Stephen was stoned to death--it takes an act of perversion to say that was in his best interest individually. However it was in the best interest of the corporate body of believers, it furthered the spread of Christianity. When the other apostles in Jerusalem fled the city to escape persecution they spread Christianity where ever they went. By attempting to stomp out Christianity the Jewish leaders in effect help to spread it.

8:28 should be viewed from the whole body of believers or Christianity not on an individual basis.

How does what you wrote interact with the text?