What happens if you die while you're sinning?

gekko,

Ooops.

I went back and checked. It was Heavenly Pilgrim that said that, not you. Sorry.

I went to find it and found the quote in one of DHK's posts, and I assumed it was you because you have been the main one responding, and defending, the view about "repenting of all our sins"

Sorry bout that!

Mike

 

haha. no problem...

 

again - do you believe that we are only supposed to repent of some of our sin?

im going to bed now - and will respond later today... considering it is wednesday already... eek!

good night.
God bless.

 

gekko,

Nooooo, thats NOT what I believe.

I believe just what I posted, namely...

Thats what I believe.

And certainly part of what I posted up there will involve turning from sin to rightiousness.

But when people say things like "We have to repent of all our sins!", they are taking repentance and turning into such a small thing, and such a legalistic thing, and such a prideful thing. The sin in a human heart is so great that we cant even identify them all, much less name them all to repent of them all.

Repentance is so much BIGGER than just naming some piddly little sin and telling God "I promise to never do it again".

Mike

 

gekko,

I'm getting sleepy too.

Look forward to more tomorrow.

God bless,

Mike

 

Then why did you say THIS earlier...

You are speaking out of both sides of your mouth.

When you say this...

And this...

...you are admitting that you DO NOT keep the Law.

You are a failure at keeping the Law, just like me and everyone else on here.

But then you turn right around and say that you are "keeping the Law"

What God wants you to do, since you acknowledge that you are not keeping the Law, is to die to it, and start living in the freedom and liberty God desires for you, and live in the goodness of resurrection life...referred to in the scriptures as walking in the goodness of the Holy Spirit...

And...

And...

And you have no reason to believe that being free from the Law, and walking in the goodness of the Holy Spirit, will not be effective, because...

Grace and peace,

Mike </font>[/QUOTE]Mike,

at this point it seems like you are just trying to PRETEND that you dont understand what I am saying.

Yes I keep the commandments, no I dont keep them perfectly.

You get that part right?


sometimes I wonder if some of you are just playing games..


Lk:1:6: And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.

They apparently kept the commandments... why dont you go ask THEM if they kept them perfectly? Is the Bible talking out of both sides of Its mouth?

Do you steal Mike? I hope not... in the minute details of life technically could one say that you steal?

Of course they could because there must be things you havent done which could be robbing someone of time, money, etc

Thus I am saying I keep the commandments... perfectly? NO

God desires the heart..

Now I KNOW you know what Im saying Mike so please stop playing games.

are you saying God is talking out of both sides of HIS MOUTH HERE??

Rv:12:17: And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Rv:14:12: Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Rv:22:14: Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.


as far as me ever saying I RELY on keeping the commandments for salvation, I NEVER HAVE AND NEVER WILL say that.


Now just stop it.

If that wasnt a good enough explanation for you, sorry because thats all Im going to try.

Im really disappointed in how people will do this, act like they dont understand what you are saying.

Claudia

[ May 17, 2006, 09:05 AM: Message edited by: Claudia_T ]

 

DEAR EVERYBODY


Do any of you think God is LYING about people here keeping the commandments?

It seems like every time someone mentions it, the liberals will say 'WELL DO YOUUUUUUUU keep the commandments???"

How irrelevant can you get? apparently SOMEBODY must be able to! you calling God a LIAR???

Rv:12:17: And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Rv:14:12: Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Rv:22:14: Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

 

I still havent seen a thing about this "Kingdom" you keep talking about.

Look, either you are saved or you arent.


Period.


This attempt to divide up the Word of God and every time you see that it says you must DO something, you claim well thats talking about the "Kingdom" and not salvation... this is NONSENSE!

..and you somehow have to work your way into this "Kingdom" but salvation isnt of works.


NOTHING is of works, thats what my Bible says!

You do good works because you have ceased your rebellion against God and because you LOVE HIM.

If you DONT love God, and if you DONT cease your rebellion against His rulership then you are unfit for heaven. PERIOD!


1Cor:2:9: But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.

Notice it says heaven is prepared for those that LOVE GOD.


Jn:14:15: If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Jn:14:23: Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

 

The rich man in hell advocated a better doctrine than you all.

Luke, chapter 16
"30": And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.


Luke, chapter 13
"3": I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

"4": Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and slew them, think ye that they were sinners above all men that dwelt in Jerusalem?

"5": I tell you, Nay: but, except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish.

I guess Jezebel must of had some with the same doctrine that you all have.

Revelation, chapter 2
"21": And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.

Acts, chapter 17
"30": And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

It is foolish to try to defend "repentance is required in order to receive Salvation".

 

Brother Bob: It is foolish to try to defend "repentance is required in order to receive Salvation".

HP: Is this really what you desire to say? Are you saying repentance is or is not required for salvation? I believe I understand you but I thought someone might misunderstand it the way you said it. It is obvious the other side of this debate believes it is 'foolishness to try and defend repetance' as well, but from an opposite perspective.
Thanks.

[ May 17, 2006, 11:08 AM: Message edited by: Heavenly Pilgrim ]

 

Claudia just because you don't see the kingdom or are choosing not to see the kingdom does not make it nonsense.

Again Ephesians chapter 2 tells us that salvation by grace through faith has no tie to works. Again why can't this be understood. NO WORKS. It's plain and simple.

That means when we read other parts of the Scripture that speaks of works we can know that it has nothing to do with grace through faith, becuase we are plainly told that has nothing to do with works. So works obviously mean something else.

I believe it is Matthew that tells us that a man who puts his hand to the plow and looks back is not fit for the kingdom. That means if someone starts doing the work, but then stops and returns to the former life he is not fit for the kingdom. It doesn't say he's no longer saved for eternity.

Now if you look up that verse it will say kingdom of heaven. And automatically your going to say see it's talking about heaven. That's not what it is talking about. The actual Greek shows that heaven is plural not singular so the text should read kingdom of the heavens.

We all know that God does not reside in the heavens. He resides in heaven signular. So what is this kingdom of the heavens that Matthew talks about, because every reference given in Matthew that says kingdom of heaven, should actually read kingdom of the heavens.

The heavens are where Satan and his angels, demons rule the earth.

Qualified Christians, who become the bride of Christ, will join with Christ as He takes over the reigns of this earth from Satan in that coming day and the bride will rule as queen with her King.

You have to rightly divide the Word to get a complete understanding.

 

JJ

The bride is all of us who are saved. I am thinking that you have all your doctrine about the Millennium all messed up which is the root of your problem are referring to when you talk about "the kingdom"? ..The Millennium? I cant remember but it seems like thats what you have said.

Just out of curiosity, do you think this "Bride" is the same as the 144,000 ???


The "voice of the Bride" are God's people who are CALLING to people to come to Christ. We are suposed to be "lighting the way" for the Bridegroom, Jesus at the second coming... by having our lamps lit... and we are supposed to be calling out for people to get ready for the second coming of Christ


Rv:18:23: And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived.


Rv:22:17: And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

We are ALL supposed to be the Bride... but there are foolish virgins who are not preparing themselves or others for heaven, not lighting the way in the darkness for the Bride to come.

 

there arent going to be any Christians in heaven except for "qualified" Christians... you are either wise or foolish and the foolish will have the door shut in their face, Jesus say "depart from Me, I DONT KNOW YOU!"

 

Claudia the misconception of the Church is that the entire church is going to be the bride. That is not supported in the Bible. Actually quite the opposite is given.

Because people have drawn the misconception that all the church will be the bride, they then go further in error saying that church is filled with worthy servants.

Then because the church only consists of worthy servants the unworthy servants have to be unsaved.

Well that is just plain incorrect.

The servants in the parable of the pounds and talents the wise and foolish are all saved individuals.

But here is Scripture that shows the bride is only part of the church and not the entire thing.

You can go back to Adam and Eve to see this conclusion even before we get to the servants or the virgins.

Eve is Adam's bride. Eve was taken out of Adam's body. But Eve didn't consist of all of Adam's body, only a part of his body.

Adam is a type of Christ, which means that Christ has a bride. We all know that is going to be the case. So like Eve Christ's bride will come out of His body. We know the church is the body of Christ. So will His bride be all of the church or just part of the body?

It will only be part of the body just like Eve was part of Adam.

You can also see this picture in the story of Isaac and Rebekah. Abraham (God) sent his servant (Holy Spirit) to his family (Church) to obtain a bride. The servant was instructed to only go to his family.

But did the entire family become Isaac's bride? No only a part of the family (Rebekah). Rebekah is a type of the church. The church is made up of family members, but not all family members.

The bride is not the 144,000. The 144,000 are tribulational witnesses having nothing to do with the bride.

So we carry our OT picture into the NT and the parables of the pounds, talents and virgins give us detail as to who and who will not be part of the bride.

Only servants that are found faithful and wise. The others are still servants, but they are unworthy and unwise and therefore not fit for positions of rulership in the coming kingdom.

It has nothing to do with heaven. It has everything to do with the coming kingdom.

 

J.Jump said "Claudia the misconception of the Church is that the entire church is going to be the bride. That is not supported in the Bible. Actually quite the opposite is given."

wow. we actually agree on something - cause Jesus said after the parable of the 10 virgins - "nevertheless, when the Son of Man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?"

 

JJ

No the church isnt filled with worthy servants,, the saved who go to heaven with all be worthy servants...

Jesus said those who are not ... the unfaithful servnts will be cast out into outer darkness where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth


here on earth there are tares and wheat in the church. Not all who profess to be Christians will be saved

 

See again here is a misconception that is being taught in the church. When the church is talked about in the Bible it is always talking about true believers. It's never talking about true believers mixed with fake believers.

Again your wheat and tare example is not supported by Scripture. The wheat and the tare parable is given in Matthew 13 which is a chapter that deals with the kingdom of the heavens and not eternity.

So the wheat and the tares have nothing to do with eternity. It has everything to do with the kingdom.

 

JJ

what you ae trying to advocate is just plain nuts anyway beause in Matthew 25:46 the goats "shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal"

so to claim it has nothing to do with eternal salvation but with "the kingdom" is crazy


Matthew 25:
38: When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?
39: Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?
40: And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
41: Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
42: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
43: I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
44: Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
45: Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.

46: And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

 

I think Claudia is talking about the brick and mortar church, the visible building but the true church is true believers and is the Lamb's wife and she is without sin or blemish.

 

Yet again, that is crazy:

Mt:13:30: Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles TO BURN THEM : but gather the wheat into my barn.

Mt:13:38: The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;

Mt:13:40: As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.