What is a carnal Christian?

[StraightAndNarrow]

Originally posted by npetreley:
There seem to be two conversations going on here, and neither side seems to acknowledge the other.

1. If a person is in the flesh, he is not saved
2. A Christian can be carnal

The two concepts are not mutually exclusive.

Romans 8 does describe the difference between the unsaved and saved. The comparison is between those who have the Spirit and those who do not.

1 Cor 3 does describe Christians who are carnal. They have the Spirit, but they live such that they let the flesh win in the war between the Spirit and the flesh.

I think the original post simply included an incorrect selection of text as the example for the question.

I believe that born again Christians will continue to sin. The important thing is who is the master in their life, sin or Christ. We can only choose one.

Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
Rom 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also [in the likeness] of [his] resurrection:
Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with [him], that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

Rom 6:12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.

 

[Hope of Glory]

Originally posted by gb93433:
The carnal man does not make disciples.

What makes you think that? John had disciples, Buddha had disciples, Shaolin priests had disciples... Why would you think that a carnal man could not make disciples? I see them all over the place.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Gang members follow their leaders all over the place and steal, kill and destroy for him.

I agree with Hope of Glory... a carnal man can have disciples just as much as a spiritual man can.

 

[Johnv]

Originally posted by Hope of Glory:
... Shaolin priests had disciples...

Not to mention, a really cool show back in the 70's. I agree with HoG and SFiC. The ability to have disciples does not preclude one from being a carnal Christian. On the flip side, the lack of disciples does not preclude one from being free of carnality.

 

[PastorMark]

To me this has always been very plain, and several other people have laid out the scriptures very well, but here is a repeat in case it might help someone:

Natural = lost (1 Corinthians 2:14 "But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.")

Carnal = saved but not growing, or maybe backslid. Those who must be treated as babies. They've heard the truth of Bible doctrine, but still haven't digested it. (1 Corinthians 3:1-2 "And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ. I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.")

Spiritual = saved and growing. (1 Corinthians 2:12-13 "Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.")

Pastor Mark.

 

[StraightAndNarrow]

I think we're talking about terminology. Do you agree with my previous post?

**********************************************
I believe that born again Christians will continue to sin. The important thing is who is the master in their life, sin or Christ. We can only choose one.

Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
Rom 6:2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also [in the likeness] of [his] resurrection:
Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with [him], that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

Rom 6:12 Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.

 

[MRCoon]

Too many discussions get passed over and sort of just fade away. So I'm making it my goal to read everything in this thread and make a response accordingly

I remember someone telling me that to study the Bible you must look at 3 areas when studying context...1) the immediate area of the verse 2) the surrounding context in the other chapters and tone of the book 3) the writers other comments on the subject matter. If you don't and just try to explain one verse you can get into trouble (the Fool says there is no God Ps 14:1).

So with this in mind I respond by saying I think Paul was refering to a 'carnal' (read worldly minded) Christian. In Chapter 6 we see Christians that used God's grace and forgiveness as an excuse to do more sin. Chapter 7 we see Paul's struggles over his sinful nature. So Chapter 8 is following this same theme and I believe that the "life and death" we are refering to is on the Spiritual level (victory or defeat) not on a physical level (heaven or hell). I see that Paul refers to "death" more in the Christian life struggles vice an eternal damnation from God's presence. I also see that he refers to dying as a 'selling out'...whether to Christ or to sin. So if we are carnal Christians we will not have a victorius Christian Life...in fact we will be as "dead Christians" but if we live in the Holy Spirit adn are guided by Him we will have a victorious Christian life producing fruit (dead things don't reproduce) and a life of peace (God's peace not a trouble free lifestyle).

 

[genesis12]

Wul, shucks, MRCoon. That's plumb good. I can take that talkin' ta th bank.

 

[MRCoon]

Originally posted by genesis12:
Wul, shucks, MRCoon. That's plumb good. I can take that talkin' ta th bank.

Ok but if you take it to the bank and it "bounces" I'm not paying any fees

uh...that's a joke