Featured What is 'natural revelation?'

Nonsense. The days of Noah were quite different. Man lived nearly 1000 years for example. Before Babel, man spoke the same language. In both the millennium and the days of Noah and Adam plants grow fast, not like today. In both the future and the far past on earth, spirits were much more a part of life and sons of gods even took wives here. Nothing was 'set' so that nature could not be changed. The future and past in Scripture are different than the present. You cannot claim the present is set! Anything BUT set actually since it is temporary. You did not offer either science or bible evidence. Zero.

 

False. I claim science does not know one way or the other what nature may have been or will be like in the past or future. The bible as I pointed out describes different basic facets of life for the past and future that are anything BUT natural here in the temporal present world and time and nature. Nothing in the verses you spam even relates to the issue. Be honest.

 

Having read through these posts I have to ask, what are you trying to prove? 1] That nature does not draw people to wonder about God 2] that science does not know everything about the past or the future etc. Where are you going with this?

I have to agree with 37818 Creation is Gods' natural revelation of who He is. You may disagree with myself and 37818 but doubt you would disagree with the bible. Rom 1:20

 

That is not an issue whatsoever. Of course nature shouts out the glory of God. The issue with the poster that raised the question of 'natural revelation' was that nature is different in the future and past than it is today according to descriptions in the bible. So I accept that nature of the past, the future and the present is shouting out God's glory! That does NOT mean nature will always be and always was the same as today. The poster in question seems to want to use the phrase natural revelation to try and show that the bible says nature was always the same. The reason it is relevant is because science uses the premise that nature was always the same (forces and laws on earth) to produce origin models and old ages and etc. My whole point is that the future and the far past on earth as described in the bible is quite different from today. There is nothing about 'natural revelation' that deals with or changes that.

 

My question for you would be, and why do you think it necessary that this point be made . As a Christian I understand what science wants to do but for me it really does not matter. Those that wish to believe science will and those that chose to believe the bible will. We could argue with them until the cows come home and it will not make any difference. That being said do you really care what science says about the age or method of creation. I don't. For me Gen 1:1 "In beginning GOD created" says it all.
I am just pleased to be able to take in this wonderful creation and praise God for it.

 

The reason it is important to point out that science does not know what nature existed in the past is because they use a belief that it was the same as the basis for the theory of evolution. It is important to know that God was right all along, and science as wrong and belief based.

Well, the kids they teach in school are not so well equipped to be able to know they are being taught a crock. Knowing there is a real God and the bible is true and there really was a creation matters!

And you would not sound like you know what you are talking about in the company of an educated group of people. You would probably come off as some guy who is ignorant of the facts, and science and wants to stick his head in a hole.

 

So you think you have all the answers, great now do something about it. Why spend your time preaching to the choir.

 

The poster that I was responding to is not the choir. How about you? Do you believe in a real creation in six days? That was the topic from which he diverted into talking about natural revelation, as if that helped support his non biblical from science. You see, in my choir, those that do not believe in the creator and bible do not sing.

 

Since the bible says God created in six days I would have to surmise that is what He did. Do you have a problem with that?
But the question remains, what are you going to do about it? Your the one that seems to be hot under the collar about this. Give us some idea of what you would like to see done. But keep it practical. Just huffing and puffing on here will accomplish nothing.

 

Not at all.

Not sure why you interject into a discussion about time in the far universe and the science claims of ages and distances? Then you mutter about huffing and puffing? I explained why the topic was raised by the poster and why he brought up the diversion issue of natural revelation. It is not about what 'I would like to see done'! It is about people making false claims and left field off base off topic responses.

 

If you do not understand science then just say so. If you do not understand what red shift is then you will not understand how time and distance is calculated. Which leads to not understanding how time since big bang was calculated. You seem to want to put God in a young earth box and that fine but some of us know that God can do what ever He wants so do not limit Him.

 

Don't blame me for what you think I don't understand. The trick is to demonstrate that you understand. Do you realize time in involved in red shifting light out there? If so, then prove time is the same out there? You seem to think that you can sit here in a little fishbowl of a solar system area, and see how things look here, and make all the universe comply to your little observation/experience/scope. You see if time is different then we cannot say light took a certain time to get here. If time is different out there maybe it could affect light and cause shifting? How would we know? You just assume that space and time that we have here must represent all the universe. For no particular reason! You do realize 'frequency' is the number of occurrences of repeated events per unit of time?

God cannot lie! He is not a man that He can lie. His word tells us how it was created. That is not a 'box', that is the truth. God limits Himself to His word. You cannot invent alternate realities of what 'really' happened, to suit your science religion.

 

You seem to be stuck in this science is wrong idea so be it. If you want to stand on the idea that the all powerful supreme God can not do whatever He wants then stand there. As for me I trust that God has given us a universe to explore and learn about. He has also given man the ability to seek and find answers.
If God flung everything out to it's place in heaven or if He used the big bang to create everything and allow for the expansion it does not matter to me as it all comes down to "In beginning God created"

 

Romans says the fallen are without excuse because God's attributes have been revealed by what He has made. Usually called "General Revelation."

See this link:
What is general revelation and special revelation? | GotQuestions.org

 

God did what He said He did. By the way, relax. You will not be exploring the universe. You are stuck here on earth and the area of this little solar system! Man has not been more than a few light seconds away from earth! The furthest probes are not even one single light day away yet! That is your range of expertise. If people want to believe the word of God they need to take it for what it says, not call God a liar and say well, 'He reeeaaalllly could have done it some other way if He wanted'. That is serpentine nonsense.

 

Just because you think you are arbiter of truth and biblical understanding does not make it so. You want to limit God in what He can do so be it , I can not limit Him and I accept this truth. Perhaps some day the light will come on for you?
It seems like you would like to be god but sorry the position is filled and they are not looking for a replacement.

I am surprised that you don't think God can do what ever he wants. Do you think He needs your permission?

But just go on in your world.

 

The Scripture is the source of truth, not you or I. God will not break His word, and as Jesus said every little jot and tittle will be fulfilled of the law. Jesus also referred to the beginning when He created man. Angels in Revelation pronounced the same thing, that God was the Creator. The New Testament and the Old agree. Do not call people names for believing what it says. He did not have a pack of foolish lies sent to us. The only thing you can be an 'arbiter' of is whether you chose to believe it or not! In modern English that means like it or lump it. Take it or leave it.