What is your stance on abortion? Which statement best fits your belief?

[LeBuick]

No, I'm saying that both lives are of the same importance and that we should place our trust in God that he will work things for his good. In the case of a person making a choice to kill the baby, they are workings things for their good and making the life of the baby less imprortant than of the mother.

Ok, I never thought of it that way. So basically you let God decide?

 

[annsni]

I don't know what an ectopic pregnancy is.

An ectopic pregnancy is where, rather than the fertilized egg implanting in the uterus, it implants in another area of the abdomen. 98% of the times it implants in the very narrow fallopian tubes, and when the baby gets too big for the tube, the tube will rupture and cause internal bleeding, risking the life of the mother if nothing is done. I've heard of only 1 case of an ectopic pregnancy in a fallopian tube progressing to birth. The other 2% of cases will have the egg implanting elsewhere such as in or on the ovary, on the bowel, or on other internal organs. In this case, a regular birth cannot occur since the child is not in the womb and natural labor will not birth the child. An abdominal surger is required and often times, there is damage to the organ that the placenta has implanted on. In the case of implanting on the bowel, they usually need to remove that section of the bowel to restrict hemmorage as the baby is born. It's a very, very dangerous sort of pregnancy and in the vast majority of cases (like 99.9% of the cases), it is fatal to the child and potentially fatal to the mother unless there is a huge amount of medical intervention.

 

[BigBossman]

If it is so risky to have a child that way, why is it even allowed?

 

[annsni]

If it is so risky to have a child that way, why is it even allowed?

There's not much that you can do to prevent it and unfortunately, in this age of rampant STDs, it's much more common due to scarring from PID. Once it's confirmed, it's still the patient's choice as to what to do with treatment. They can choose to let it go and quite possibly die a very painful death - or give the pregnancy a chance to resolve itself. With the risk of death very real for mom and the absolute tiny chance of the baby making it, I would choose the surgery although I would be heartbroken to do so. It's a tough decision especially for those of us who are staunchly pro-life.

 

[Jim1999]

Then, according to another post that mother would go to hell for killing that child..so says a moderator to me....I could be doomed to hell for murdering a fetus if I supported abortion.

Jesus lied about the gospel according to this Board.............I give up.........People are deciding what to approve and what not to approve on abortion, but they are always right.

Cheers,

Jim

 

[matt wade]

Then, according to another post that mother would go to hell for killing that child..so says a moderator to me....I could be doomed to hell for murdering a fetus if I supported abortion.

Jim...can you point out where a moderator said that someone goes to hell for abortion? I'd be interested to see it.

 

[Jim1999]

I forget..I guess the BB will tell me when they expell me

I think it was under General Baptist Discussion.

Sorry,

Jim

 

[Jim1999]

Matt , Here it is under Try a New Country

http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?p=1367456#post1367456

Cheers,

Jim

 

[annsni]

In the case of ectopic pregnancy - and the VERY rare other cases where a pregnancy will kill the mother, I do choose to say save the mom.

It's a choice of 2 dead or 1 dead. There is no "no dead". Of course, I think a lot of the "mother's life is at stake" is a bunch of hooey nowadays because you can say that it's going to make me depressed and that counts. I'm speaking of a woman who will with almost 100% certainty die if the pregnancy is continued and there is no way to deliver the baby and allow them to live. I don't believe in tearing apart the baby or burning it in the womb with saline but a delivery of the child is the best choice. If it's possible to get to 25+ weeks, then deliver the baby and fight for their life but there are those very rare occurances outside of ectopic pregnancy where the mother's life is truly at stake - and then the instances of ectopic pregnancy too where I feel that the life of the child must be sacrificed. Murder? Maybe but I do not think that murder will make you lose your salvation nor do I feel making a very difficult decision like this will send you to hell. As I said, it's not an easy choice or one made lightly. I'm eternally grateful I never had to make that choice as the loss of my 2 pregnancies that resulted in miscarriages were taken care of for me - in both cases the child was dead.

To chose to allow a woman to die because "that's what God wanted" is wrong. I do not agree with that whatsoever.

 

[Jim1999]

Most anti-abortionists are NOT making exceptions...They are also NOT offering alternatives to society.

According to the rants of anti-abortionists then D&C's must come under the same penalty and a host of other conditions. I will let a doctor decide whether a mother's life is at peril.

I am not in favour of abortion. I just want fairness in this battlecry. A little understanding.

Some people who have gone through abortion, for whatever reason, have and are suffering enough..I have counselled a few and know the guilt they carry with them.

Cheers,

Jim

 

[Marcia]

If in a medical procedure to save the life of the mother the unborn baby dies, is that truly an abortion? I consider an abortion to be when the intent of the procedure is to kill the unborn baby.

I agree with you.

 

[matt wade]

If in a medical procedure to save the life of the mother the unborn baby dies, is that truly an abortion? I consider an abortion to be when the intent of the procedure is to kill the unborn baby.

But yet you consider it murder when a civilian dies in a war? It was not the intent of war to kill the civilian either.

 

[Marcia]

Most anti-abortionists are NOT making exceptions...They are also NOT offering alternatives to society.

Pregnancy centers have been started all over the U.S. funded by pro-life churches and individual Christians. They are started to help pregnant women who feel they are in trouble with their pregnancy or can't have or keep the baby. Our church supports such a pregnancy center.

Some people who have gone through abortion, for whatever reason, have and are suffering enough..I have counselled a few and know the guilt they carry with them.

Yes, and this guilt is what the pro-choicers do not like to address or even admit! Women should know that abortion is not an easy or quick solution but brings lifelong repercussions including sorrow and guilt, and often deep regret.

 

[Jim1999]

They are not going to ge it from the attitude and loudmouthing in here, I assure you.

Cheers,

Jim

 

[LeBuick]

Yes, and this guilt is what the pro-choicers do not like to address or even admit! Women should know that abortion is not an easy or quick solution but brings lifelong repercussions including sorrow and guilt, and often deep regret.

I think a good AMEN goes there... AMEN!!! :thumbsup:

In many ways I believe this is where the Church fails. We try and scare, judge etc... but don't spend much time educating or even offering a voice of experience if you have one in the flock.

 

[Jim1999]

quote: Yes, and this guilt is what the pro-choicers ...
---------------------------------

I would include the anti-abortionists also,,,,and loudly!

Cheers,

Jim

 

[FriendofSpurgeon]

It's interesting to note that if R v W is overturned tomorrow (which it won't be), then abortions would still be legal in the USA. The issue would simply be returned to the states (where it should be from a constitutional standpoint IMHO). Given that fact, the battle for life is really won on a day to day basis, with the preganancy centers that Marcia mentioned on the front lines.

 

[BigBossman]

Ordinarily, I prefer things to be left up to the states to decide. However, abortion is one thing that needs to be legislated from the federal level. If the federal government takes action on it, the states are bound by it.

If the states are allowed to legislate on abortion, then you'll have some states that allow it & others that don't.

 

[FriendofSpurgeon]

Ordinarily, I prefer things to be left up to the states to decide. However, abortion is one thing that needs to be legislated from the federal level. If the federal government takes action on it, the states are bound by it.

If the states are allowed to legislate on abortion, then you'll have some states that allow it & others that don't.

Exactly. That is what you had before R v W. Some states had very liberal abortion laws, others were very conservative. From a constitutional standpoint, there is no rationale to have this codified at the federal level.

 

[Trotter]

Pardon me if my comments don't match the conversation, as they are to the general topic.

Why should an innocent child be held guilty for the sin of its father? Why should this child be butchered for the crime committed against its mother? What has the baby done?

The same can be said about incest. What heinous crime is the baby found guilty of that demands its life?

As for the life of the mother argument, it is full of holes. Roe v Wade defined it as anything[ /I] that would alter the life of the mother... which is what having a child does. Today's medical advances can detect and circumvent almost all life-threatening conditions. My cousin carried her child to term even though she was diagnosed with cancer in her womb and had it removed during the pregnancy.

The bottom line, for me anyway... Abortion is murder of the most brutal kind. It is the wholesale slaughter of the most innocent of us all here upon the earth. It is an affront to God and no different than the sacrifices to Moloch and the idols of Canaan. It is the shedding of innocent blood... blood that drips from our hands because we have allowed it.