What validates the offer of salvation?

[webdog]

And yet, all sin. And since all sin, all are slaves to sin (not servants.. the word is "doulos" and it means "slave")

The slave obeys the master. The slave does the will of the master.

And Paul's point is Romans 6 is that since your will has been freed from the power of sin by Jesus Christ, don't yeild yourself to sin anymore. You have died to sin, live to Christ.

peace to youraying:

You are using a 21st century understanding of slavery, not a 1st century understanding. A slave when that text was written CHOSE to be a slave unless they were part of the plunder in battle. It is clear the context supports one choosing to become a slave to sin.

 

[canadyjd]

You are using a 21st century understanding of slavery, not a 1st century understanding. A slave when that text was written CHOSE to be a slave unless they were part of the plunder in battle. It is clear the context supports one choosing to become a slave to sin.

Perhaps you can show me some sources to support your assertion of a widespread voluntary slavery (not as a result of conquering a people) in 1st century Roman Empire.

My understanding is the opposite. The overwhelming majority of slaves were made slaves due to conquering various peoples.

peace to youraying:

 

[webdog]

Perhaps you can show me some sources to support your assertion of a widespread voluntary slavery (not as a result of conquering a people) in 1st century Roman Empire.

My understanding is the opposite. The overwhelming majority of slaves were made slaves due to conquering various peoples.

peace to youraying:

Read Leviticus. Since the early church was composed of mainly jews (the reason for chapters 9-11), they would have understood Paul's intention as a jew himself.

 

[canadyjd]

Read Leviticus. Since the early church was composed or mainly jews (the reason for chapters 9-11), they would have understood Paul's intention as a jew himself.

The Hebrews volunteered to be slaves to the Eygptians? I don't think that is true.

If you are speaking of that part of the law which spoke of a slave deciding to remain with his master after his freedom, then it doesn't apply since it doesn't speak to how the man became a slave in the first place, only that he wished to remain a slave after earning his freedom.

And we are talking about the context of 1st century A.D. slavery in the Roman Empire, not 15th century B.C. Ancient Near East slavery.

You made the statment that Jesus was referring to slaves that chose to be slaves, which (according to you) was the 1st century Roman Empire context.

I'm just asking for some proof of your assertions. If you don't have any proof, just say so.

peace to youraying:

 

[Winman]

There are actually several times people voluntarily offered to become servants in the scriptures. I am a little rushed, but I will show one for now.

1 Sam 11:1 Then Nahash the Ammonite came up, and encamped against Jabeshgilead: and all the men of Jabesh said unto Nahash, Make a covenant with us, and we will serve thee.

More later.

 

[canadyjd]

There are actually several times people voluntarily offered to become servants in the scriptures. I am a little rushed, but I will show one for now.....

We're not talking about "several times" in the O.T.

We are speaking of the 1st Century Roman Empire norm concerning slavery.

peace to youraying:

 

[webdog]

We're not talking about "several times" in the O.T.

We are speaking of the 1st Century Roman Empire norm concerning slavery.

peace to youraying:

No, we are speaking of the understanding of jewish believers in understanding a jewish Paul speak of slavery. That entails their law and how they understood slavery. If one sins they become a slave to sin.

 

[canadyjd]

No, we are speaking of the understanding of jewish believers in understanding a jewish Paul speak of slavery. That entails their law and how they understood slavery. If one sins they become a slave to sin.

Which doesn't change a thing I said, since their understanding of slavery was 1st century Roman Empire.

You made the statement that Jews would have understood it as a "voluntary" slavery. I asked you to back the claim up with sources.

If you don't have anything other than your opinion, then just say so.

peace to youraying:

 

[RAdam]

Paul is writing to a church of both Jews and Gentiles, and thus uses the 1st Century Roman idea of slavery which all would be knowledgable about.