What's With All These Clueless Christians?

[poncho]

http://www.chuckbaldwinlive.com/c2008/cbarchive_20080212.html

Hmmm. I've been asking this same question for years now.

The only thing I can come up with is that an old familiar comfortable lie is preferable to the truth because when one recognizes the truth it pretty much demands action.

I believe most Christians today are scared to death of standing up for anything if it may effect their personal comfort level even a little. Anyway that's my thoughts on this subject. I'm sure most of you have your own how about sharing them?

Why is there so many clueless Christians today?

 

[Crabtownboy]

Clueless

I like just about everything mentioned in the article that you linked to your post. I find it interesting that most who call themselves fundamentalists quote Paul when trying to prove their point and seldom quote Christ. Paul's writings must always be tempered by what Christ said. Christ is the authority by which all scripture must be seen. And we, I speak in the general sense here, argue and make litmus test over issues that are of no real importance ... i.e. inerrancy for one. The devil has used this issue greatly to divide Christians. :tonofbricks:

 

[windcatcher]

The devil will use any divisive issue at his disposal:
Abortion.
Social Programs.
Popular opinion.
Fear.
Greed.
Laziness.
Our willingness to cover our sin.....and pleasure in those that do the same rather than exercise repentance, and abhor the sin which does easily beset us.
To find truth, in the Bible or in life, one had to start asking questions and be searching for it.

I think I need a drink




............of water!

Make us thirsty, oh God, thirsty to know the truth in these evil times, and thirsty for YOU. And lead all who thirst to the wells of living water!

 

[Hardsheller]

Looks like Chuckie is getting ready for his run at becoming Constitution Party Candidate. Talk about clueless!

 

[annsni]

I like just about everything mentioned in the article that you linked to your post. I find it interesting that most who call themselves fundamentalists quote Paul when trying to prove their point and seldom quote Christ. Paul's writings must always be tempered by what Christ said. Christ is the authority by which all scripture must be seen. And we, I speak in the general sense here, argue and make litmus test over issues that are of no real importance ... i.e. inerrancy for one. The devil has used this issue greatly to divide Christians. :tonofbricks:

Are you saying that Paul's writings are less inspired than what Christ said (and that He didn't write while He was on earth, by the way - someone else did)? So some of Scripture is more important than others?

 

[Crabtownboy]

Cluless

Can a human be as "inspired" as God? ... and Jesus was God in physical form on earth. What I am saying, and I guess poorly, is that all scripture must be interpreted in light of Christ's life and teachings. So anything we read, especially in the NT must be interpreted so that it does not in any way contridict or lesson the hard lessons that Christ taught. Christ was much more interested in what people did ... and in what we do ... than he was in our being correct in every jot and tiddle or our theology. We modern Christians seem to want to dwell and argue on what we believe and ignore or play down the importance of doing [works for him.]

Works may not save, but show me your works and your attitude toward others and I will show you your real faith ... or lack thereof. :tonofbricks:

I'll duck now.

 

[PastorSBC1303]

Aren't we glad we have folks like poncho to tell us all how "clueless" we are...

 

[annsni]

Can a human be as "inspired" as God? ... and Jesus was God in physical form on earth. What I am saying, and I guess poorly, is that all scripture must be interpreted in light of Christ's life and teachings. So anything we read, especially in the NT must be interpreted so that it does not in any way contridict or lesson the hard lessons that Christ taught. Christ was much more interested in what people did ... and in what we do ... than he was in our being correct in every jot and tiddle or our theology. We modern Christians seem to want to dwell and argue on what we believe and ignore or play down the importance of doing [works for him.]

Works may not save, but show me your works and your attitude toward others and I will show you your real faith ... or lack thereof. :tonofbricks:

I'll duck now.

Well, I've not seen any of Paul's writings contradict any of Christ's words. I also know that 2 Timothy 3:16 says "All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness," (ESV), so there is not one word in Scripture that is more important than the other.

 

[Revmitchell]

Since Paul's words as given in scripture came from the same place Christ's words did they are equal in every way. Liberals today do not like much of Pauls writings so they down play them. And if they were to hold to the inerrancy of scripture then of course they could not twist scripture as they do. If there is an issue to divide over inerrancy is certainly a worth while issue. The nature of scripture is a dire concern.

 

[Crabtownboy]

Cluless

It is not scripture that gives us trouble, but our interpretations and I have seen/heard/read some interpretations that, to me at least, contridict my understanding of what Christ was teaching. I figure none of us have it all correctly down pat with nothing else to learn ... we are all still babies in our understanding with much to learn.

Thou shalt not make an idol of scripture for Jesus is the authority by which all scripture is to be understood.

 

[windcatcher]

Since Paul's words as given in scripture came from the same place Christ's words did they are equal in every way. Liberals today do not like much of Pauls writigs so they down play them. And if they were to hold to the inerrancy of scripture then of course they could not twist scripture as they do. If there is an issue to divide over inerrancy is certainly a worth while issue. The nature of scripture is a dire concern.
__________________
The gospel is relevant to sinners. J.D.

When you separate good works from the preaching of the Gospel, you are left with nothing but religious or secular morality. J.D.

^^^^^^^indeed!

 

[poncho]

Aren't we glad we have folks like poncho to tell us all how "clueless" we are...

It's a thankless job but I do the best I can to clue you in. Honestly I haven't got a clue why you guys are so clueless even after four years of my best efforts to clue you in...nothing, zip, nada. I'm totally amazed at just how much you folks don't know...seriously.

I came here hoping to have a battle of wits with knowledgable people and all I get is canned responses and idiotic childish stuff like you just posted. You people can't even come up with anything original. Just jingoistic propaganda cliches you've got off the tube. It's really starting to bum me out.

 

[poncho]

This is just wierd...it's like I accidentally stepped into the twilight zone. Automatons "R" us episode 2008.

 

[rbell]

It's a thankless job but I do the best I can to clue you in. Honestly I haven't got a clue why you guys are so clueless even after four years of my best efforts to clue you in...nothing, zip, nada. I'm totally amazed at just how much you folks don't know...seriously.

I came here hoping to have a battle of wits with knowledgable people and all I get is canned responses and idiotic childish stuff like you just posted. You people can't even come up with anything original. Just jingoistic propaganda cliches you've got off the tube. It's really starting to bum me out.

You could always start a patronization forum. Seems like you've practiced!

 

[JustChristian]

Since Paul's words as given in scripture came from the same place Christ's words did they are equal in every way. Liberals today do not like much of Pauls writings so they down play them. And if they were to hold to the inerrancy of scripture then of course they could not twist scripture as they do. If there is an issue to divide over inerrancy is certainly a worth while issue. The nature of scripture is a dire concern.

Do conservatives fully support the words of Jesus?

 

[Crabtownboy]

Original post: Since Paul's words as given in scripture came from the same place Christ's words did they are equal in every way. Liberals today do not like much of Pauls writings so they down play them. And if they were to hold to the inerrancy of scripture then of course they could not twist scripture as they do. If there is an issue to divide over inerrancy is certainly a worth while issue. The nature of scripture is a dire concern.

Paul would disagree with you in that several times he said, "This is me speaking, not God.

Also inerrance was not a concept either considered. Inerrance is a concept that began developing in the 19th century and the Evil One has used it greatly to divide Christians.:tonofbricks:

 

[pinoybaptist]

Also inerrance was not a concept either considered. Inerrance is a concept that began developing in the 19th century and the Evil One has used it greatly to divide Christians.:tonofbricks:

So, you're saying that the Scriptures are not inerrant ?
Please elaborate.

 

[steaver]

Also inerrance was not a concept either considered. Inerrance is a concept that began developing in the 19th century and the Evil One has used it greatly to divide Christians.

Either you have been douped by rhetorical words, chosen to just embrace a subtle lie of satans or just did not study to show thyself approved.

Because Jesus began the "concept" of inerrancy.....

Jhn 15:20Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also.

Eze 3:7But the house of Israel will not hearken unto thee; for they will not hearken unto me: for all the house of Israel [are] impudent and hardhearted.

Paul would disagree with you in that several times he said, "This is me speaking, not God.

Excellent point that further proves that Paul was speaking for Christ and ONLY when he wasn't he made it perfectly clear that he wasn't.

Act 2:42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.

Act 2:43 And fear came upon every soul: and many wonders and signs were done by the apostles.

Act 5:12 And by the hands of the apostles were many signs and wonders wrought among the people; (and they were all with one accord in Solomon's porch.

1Cr 12:28 And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues.

Gal 1:15But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called [me] by his grace,

Gal 1:16To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:

Gal 1:20Now the things which I write unto you, behold, before God, I lie not.



Are you calling Paul a liar?

I could go on and on and on with scripture tht supports the truth that Paul and the other apostles penned the very words that Christ wanted them to pen for our edifying and learning as to how we are to live in Christ and even for us to know things which are to come.

For one to choose to ignore this and go on believing otherwise is to do so in order to satisfy their own appathy in some way.

God Bless! :thumbs:

 

[steaver]

Paul's writings must always be tempered by what Christ said. Christ is the authority by which all scripture must be seen.

You have a HUGE problem in your belief Crabtownboy!

Jesus never wrote down anything! In fact what was written down as pertaining to what Jesus Christ said was written 20 to 50 years after He had already left this earth. And it was written by APOSTLES! Apostles are chosen by Christ Himself ( 1 Cor 12:28 ) .

You have no argument with the Christ verses Paul belief. If you believe what the apostles wrote in Mattew, Mark, Luke, and John then why wouldn't you believe what the apostles wrote in the other letters?

The apostles, unlike us, had Christ's voice speaking directly into their conscience as they wrote so there would be no human error. (2 Tim 3:16)

You cannot cherry pick the parts you like to believe and reject the others.

God Bless! :thumbs:

 

[steaver]

Paul would disagree with you in that several times he said, "This is me speaking, not God.

Not "several times". Paul said this ONCE in 1 Cor 7 and even then it was "by permission". It was not an "opinion" Paul had to say, it was "by permission". Another evidence that Paul was speaking the very words he heard from God as they were written down.

1Cr 7:6But I speak this by permission, [and] not of commandment.

This shows that the normal for Paul is to speak what God is commanding him to speak for he must say to be honest that in this case what he is saying is not of commandment of the Lord but of permission of the Lord to add his own mercy just as Moses did with divorce in the OT writings.

God Bless! :thumbs: