Where are the Fossilized Remains of Millions of Humans?

[InTheLight]

Another discussion on the board about dinosaurs leads me to ask this question.

YECers maintain that the Great Flood is responsible for the formation of fossils, as well as other geological constructs. If dinosaur fossils are the result of the Flood and we have found dinosaur fossils all over the world, where are the fossilized remains of the hundreds of millions of humans that would have perished in the Flood?

 

[Scarlett O.]

Another discussion on the board about dinosaurs leads me to ask this question.

YECers maintain that the Great Flood is responsible for the formation of fossils, as well as other geological constructs. If dinosaur fossils are the result of the Flood and we have found dinosaur fossils all over the world, where are the fossilized remains of the hundreds of millions of humans that would have perished in the Flood?

You ask a great question that deserves discussion.

To me, it's not that we haven't found fossilized remains of humans perished in the Flood, but it's that - in addition to that - we have found VERY few dinosaur fossils in those same strata.

According to secular paleontologists Tim Rowe, Bill Hammer, and expert Don Lessem, there are only about 2,100 dinosaur skeletons world-wide that have been found and NONE of them are complete. A skull here, a leg and partial spine there - the dinosaur record is very limited. These guys state that most dinosaurs are known only from a single tooth or bone.

Why such a limitation on dinosaurs and no evidence at all of human remains of the Flood era?

I don't know. I have my thoughts and I don't hold any of this hard and fast. As I already said, I don't know how old the earth is.

A global flood of that magnitude would have absolutely demolished any dead carcass - tearing it limb from limb and pulverizing it - it's gross to say, but floating, swelling, and coming apart. Personally, I think that's why there are so many dinosaur "graveyards" with jumbled up mixtures of several different species - impossible to distinguish into specific total organisms. An animal weighing from 500 pounds to 25 tons might have a portion of its body preserved more readily as opposed to a human weighing only 120 pounds.

I can't give a definitive answer to why no human remains are found with dinosaurs.

But if the Flood was that catastrophic as the Bible claims - its' a wonder that we have any Pre-Flood fossils at all.

 

[HeirofSalvation]

Another discussion on the board about dinosaurs leads me to ask this question.

YECers maintain that the Great Flood is responsible for the formation of fossils, as well as other geological constructs. If dinosaur fossils are the result of the Flood and we have found dinosaur fossils all over the world, where are the fossilized remains of the hundreds of millions of humans that would have perished in the Flood?

Fossilization isn't natural...even in a flood.
The animals which would "fossilize" are those who meet these criterion:
1 MASSIVE density/weight/bone matter: (that's why, say a Dinosaur might "fossilize" and a bird may not...Lizards have solid bones...so do mammals ...so do a lot of creatures often found in lower Strata..They are heavier A Bird will float upon the surface with it's hollow bone structure and subsequently "rot"....unlike a heavier animal which might sink to the bottom, and be covered in silt and "fossilize"
2.) Intelligence: For all of their amazingness, ridiculously large lizards are not universally renowned for their intelligence...
a 200-ton Lizard, is, in fact...stupid enough to drown in a flood....they are just THAT dumb. Humans have the benefit of intelligence..birds the power of flight...

A FLOOD dude...FLOOD.

 

[Winman]

Most fossils were buried rapidly or else the body and bones decay.

As was noted, men would seek higher ground in a flood and drown.

That said, there have been fossilized human skeletons found many times.

http://humanorigins.si.edu/evidence/human-fossils

 

[InTheLight]

Body mass does not affect the formation of fossils much. The most common fossils are shelled invertebrate sea creatures--snails, clams, etc. Fossils are formed when organisms are killed and then rapidly covered by sedimentary material--practically the definition of the Great Flood.

All land creatures would seek higher ground in a flood, not just humans.

We know that at the time of the flood humanity was centered in the middle east. Life expectancy was hundreds of years and since this era was so close to the creation week disease was not widespread meaning there would be a population explosion. There could have been 50 or 100 million people alive at the time of the Flood. There isn't enough high ground for them all to occupy.

I might as well ask why there are no fossils of current modern day animals found, like birds, sheep, cattle, horses, etc.?

 

[preachinjesus]

I think we can still postulate a global flood and that does a good job explaining a lot of the missing evidences. However, being someone who advocates for an old earth view, there are some difficulties with it.

There are difficulties with other views though. Though I find too many to reconcile in YEC belief, even evolutionary humanism has its pitfalls and potholes.

Your point about the missing human fossils goes both ways too, against the extremes I just mentioned. It is a good starting point for conversation.

 

[webdog]

OE'ers have the same problem, no? Shouldn't there be more skeletal remains of both animals and humans in the OE model?

 

[InTheLight]

OE'ers have the same problem, no? Shouldn't there be more skeletal remains of both animals and humans in the OE model?

Perhaps animals, but certainly not humans. Don't OE's hold to humans being sparsely populated and nomadic until roughly 10,000 years ago?

 

[webdog]

I'm guessing most humans would have probably treaded water and moved to higher elevations while less intelligent animals didn't

 

[Winman]

OE'ers have the same problem, no? Shouldn't there be more skeletal remains of both animals and humans in the OE model?

OEs need to explain why man was a dummy for at least a million years and then suddenly became intelligent in the last 5000 years developing written language and mathematics, building cities and pyramids, etc... Before this there is no trace of man. Man suddenly burst on the scene around 5000 years ago in the exact location the scriptures say.

 

[HeirofSalvation]

Body mass does not affect the formation of fossils much.

Uh...as far as a propensity to sink and therefore embedd in mud or silt prior to rotting upon the surface???? How does body mass amongst the more "Stupid" animals NOT come into play? Of course it would!!!

The most common fossils are shelled invertebrate sea creatures--snails, clams, etc.

Ummm...yes, they are...notice their proximity to the bottom layer of silt? Will you notice their shell density or propensity to sink? Do clams have a signifigantly GREATER muscle to Bone-Mass ratio than say....Gazelles do??? :laugh:
By the way...Clams don't run from floods as fast as cats do....their legs are shorter and they have farther to go given their proximity to "ground zero". Some people consider them to be somewhat signifigantly less intelligent as well, but I don't buy it

Fossils are formed when organisms are killed and then rapidly covered by sedimentary material--practically the definition of the Great Flood.

DING DING

All land creatures would seek higher ground in a flood, not just humans.

Kinda...but the smarter ones are VASTLY more efficient at actually doing so, aren't they? Wouldn't they be?

We know that at the time of the flood humanity was centered in the middle east. Life expectancy was hundreds of years and since this era was so close to the creation week disease was not widespread meaning there would be a population explosion. There could have been 50 or 100 million people alive at the time of the Flood. There isn't enough high ground for them all to occupy.

Well...we don't "KNOW" that humanity was so centered...but it's a plausible assumption, and likely, there was not massive portions of naturally "HIGH" ground (especially considering many YEC's are partial to thinking that the greatest of natural land-masses were created post-flood)...but, they are still smart enough to hold onto man-made objects and to hold onto floating debris...Large Lizards REALLY aren't...they are truly THAT dumb.. Intelligence will come into play here.

I might as well ask why there are no fossils of current modern day animals found, like birds, sheep, cattle, horses, etc.?

There ARE such fossils...they are everywhere. There are fossilized remains of just about every imaginable modern animal, and they are found world-wide...Who reports such things though? It's called the "Cambrian Explosion"...and it is the observation of fossilized remains of nearly EVERY major Genus and even specie which we identify with now, and they are found in the same layer of Strata :godisgood:

 

[Aaron]

I might as well ask why there are no fossils of current modern day animals found, like birds, sheep, cattle, horses, etc.?

Interesting you excluded the coelacanth and insect fossils. Very modern organisms preserved in rock layers.

http://www.icr.org/living-fossils/

Note the links at the bottom of the article.

 

[Oldtimer]

Missing bodies, missing fossils.

How much of the earth is still covered by water? Fine place to lose sight of millions of bodies embedded in sediments resulting from the flood. And from the upheavels of the earth's crust due to the release of water.

How much of the strata below the oceans can be explored for land animal remains?

 

[MB]

Another discussion on the board about dinosaurs leads me to ask this question.

YECers maintain that the Great Flood is responsible for the formation of fossils, as well as other geological constructs. If dinosaur fossils are the result of the Flood and we have found dinosaur fossils all over the world, where are the fossilized remains of the hundreds of millions of humans that would have perished in the Flood?

Good point indeed where are they. I had a conversation with some people on another board about the impossibility of the presence of man on the planet for over 40,000 years. Given the rate than people had children living so long, some over 900 years in the beiginning. If you worked it out just from the flood of Noah the population would be about what it is today. How ever from the time of Adam to the flood there would have been so many everyone would have stacked on top of each other if that time was in fact just 36,000 years. Think about it we have 6 billion in the world today all coming from just a hand full of people in 4000 years. 36,000 would make so many that if they were stacked on top of each other they would be scraping dirt off the moon being stacked so high. There bones would no doubt have survived. If fact there bones would have been so plentiful they could not have missed them.
MB

 

[humblethinker]

A global flood of that magnitude would have absolutely demolished any dead carcass - tearing it limb from limb and pulverizing it - it's gross to say, but floating, swelling, and coming apart.

I'm guessing most humans would have probably treaded water and moved to higher elevations while less intelligent animals didn't

So, which is it? Was the flood a suddenly violent, cataclysmic torrent with giant tsunamis, landslides, etc, or was it like a slow filling in which the large population of people treaded water long enough till all but the final layers of sedimentation were laid? Perhaps it was violent in only the areas where people did not inhabit?

So, WHAT IS the YEC model in respect to this?

 

[Oldtimer]

So, which is it? Was the flood a suddenly violent, cataclysmic torrent with giant tsunamis, landslides, etc, or was it like a slow filling in which the large population of people treaded water long enough till all but the final layers of sedimentation were laid? Perhaps it was violent in only the areas where people did not inhabit?

So, WHAT IS the YEC model in respect to this?

Genesis 7: KJB

11 In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened.
12 And the rain was upon the earth forty days and forty nights.

--
17 And the flood was forty days upon the earth; and the waters increased, and bare up the ark, and it was lift up above the earth.
18 And the waters prevailed, and were increased greatly upon the earth; and the ark went upon the face of the waters.
19 And the waters prevailed exceedingly upon the earth; and all the high hills, that were under the whole heaven, were covered.
20 Fifteen cubits upward did the waters prevail; and the mountains were covered.
21 And all flesh died that moved upon the earth, both of fowl, and of cattle, and of beast, and of every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth, and every man:
22 All in whose nostrils was the breath of life, of all that was in the dry land, died.
23 And every living substance was destroyed which was upon the face of the ground, both man, and cattle, and the creeping things, and the fowl of the heaven; and they were destroyed from the earth: and Noah only remained alive, and they that were with him in the ark.
24 And the waters prevailed upon the earth an hundred and fifty days.


"So, WHAT IS the YEC model in respect to this?"


Noahs Flood: Where did the Water Come From?
Part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uGg_Tuy86Ow
Part 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8ZKglfPdS0&feature=related

Origins - The Worldwide Flood - Geologic Evidences - Pt 1 with Dr. Andrew Snelling http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwGgSNDPhO0 From the YouTube uploader comments:

Geological evidence for Noah's Flood will be presented, mainly for the last stage of the Flood as the water retreated off the continents. The Flood has left some startling traces on the surface of the earth in the form of erosional remnants, continental shelves, large-scale planation surfaces, quartzite rocks transported by water hundreds of miles from their nearest source, water gaps, pediments, and submarine canyons. All these geomorphic features are very difficult, if not impossible, to explain by the "slow processes over millions of years" alternative model.

[Jesus speaking] But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. Matthew 24:37-39

Fingerprints of Creation
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8giWL0fpg0

 

[humblethinker]

Genesis 7: KJB

11 In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened.
12 And the rain was upon the earth forty days and forty nights.

--
17 And the flood was forty days upon the earth; and the waters increased, and bare up the ark, and it was lift up above the earth.
18 And the waters prevailed, and were increased greatly upon the earth; and the ark went upon the face of the waters.
19 And the waters prevailed exceedingly upon the earth; and all the high hills, that were under the whole heaven, were covered.
20 Fifteen cubits upward did the waters prevail; and the mountains were covered.
21 And all flesh died that moved upon the earth, both of fowl, and of cattle, and of beast, and of every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth, and every man:
22 All in whose nostrils was the breath of life, of all that was in the dry land, died.
23 And every living substance was destroyed which was upon the face of the ground, both man, and cattle, and the creeping things, and the fowl of the heaven; and they were destroyed from the earth: and Noah only remained alive, and they that were with him in the ark.
24 And the waters prevailed upon the earth an hundred and fifty days.


"So, WHAT IS the YEC model in respect to this?"


Noahs Flood: Where did the Water Come From?
Part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uGg_Tuy86Ow
Part 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8ZKglfPdS0&feature=related

Origins - The Worldwide Flood - Geologic Evidences - Pt 1 with Dr. Andrew Snelling http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jwGgSNDPhO0 From the YouTube uploader comments:



Fingerprints of Creation
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8giWL0fpg0

Can you summarize in your own words the answer to my question? (I'm on my phone shopping :-( w my wife today and can't easily refer to the links you gave. Providing that the links directly address my question I'll check them out later. Thanks OR)

Okay, watched them and it sounds like the YEC model (as i suspected) is such that the idea that people were treading water is not compatible with such a terribly violent catastrophic flood.

 

[HankD]

Where are the Fossilized Remains of Millions of Humans

Ever heard of "fossil" fuel?

They are in the tank of your car.

HankD

 

[webdog]

So, which is it? Was the flood a suddenly violent, cataclysmic torrent with giant tsunamis, landslides, etc, or was it like a slow filling in which the large population of people treaded water long enough till all but the final layers of sedimentation were laid? Perhaps it was violent in only the areas where people did not inhabit?

So, WHAT IS the YEC model in respect to this?

Couldn't it have been both given the terrain?

 

[webdog]

[/B]

Ever heard of "fossil" fuel?

They are in the tank of your car.

HankD

That was probably the most evident answer here...and it took days to arrive at it