Where do babies go when they die?

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Well, not absolutely absent. Jesus himself speaks to this in John 10:16:
Jesus calls sheep those who are not now in the fold, as if their entrance is an accomplished fact. These sheep he has not yet brought; they have not yet heard his voice. They have not yet repented and believed, but they are called sheep.

Later in the chapter, Jesus describes how they'll be recognized:
I know where Dr. Bob is coming from, and he is on sound ground. He can take it from here

Hey Tom, thanks again for actually pointing to Scripture, what a great Idea! LOL

 

[psalms109:31]

word of Jesus

The words of Jesus is Spirit and life to a dead man

 

[freeatlast]

Now that is so rank I smell it in Wyoming.

I am forgiven of my sins 100% by the work and will of God alone, not by me having to do "xyz" (add any work to your list).

Not going to tolerate works salvation being falsely taught.

(I was a sheep before I was formed in my mother's womb. I was a sheep before I could talk or walk. I was a sheep on March 16 1957 and was still a sheep on March 17, 1957 after I repented and believed. Always was a sheep. Always will be a sheep.

With a GREAT shepherd Who actually atoned for my sin and by His Grace Alone saved me)

Bob,
When I saw that WebDog seemed to agree with me on this issue I had to go back and re-visit my thoughts and words. Originally I assumed, not a good thing to do I should have questioned further, that you were saying that you needed no salvation, but I now feel that is not the case. I apologize for my attack on you and your post. Please forgive me for my outburst. I think I now better understand what you are saying about being a sheep.

 

[webdog]

OK Dog....dead in your sins. So how can you do anything when your dead in your sins?

...on the flip side, how can we possibly sin as believers if we are "dead to sin"?

 

[webdog]

Bob,
When I saw that WebDog seemed to agree with me on this issue I had to go back and re-visit my thoughts and words. Originally I assumed, not a good thing to do I should have questioned further, that you were saying that you needed no salvation, but I now feel that is not the case. I apologize for my attack on you and your post. Please forgive me for my outburst. I think I now better understand what you are saying about being a sheep.

Thanks for yet another underhanded attack on my salvation.

He's not saying he needed no salvation...he basically said he was saved eternally even before he was born APART from faith in Christ.

 

[Amy.G]

Aaaaa no, thats not what he meant...

your dead in your sins & your saved by Christs death on the cross.

your then provided irresistible grace to want to be a child of God....anyway thats how I heard it (without the stink)

And that is not biblical. You are not saved before you place your in Christ.

 

[freeatlast]

Thanks for yet another underhanded attack on my salvation.

He's not saying he needed no salvation...he basically said he was saved eternally even before he was born APART from faith in Christ.

Now that I have had time to re-visit Bob's post I disagree with your assessment and I make no apology to you. My problem was that I started using your tactics and reasoning and for that I am ashamed.

 

[webdog]

Jesus calls sheep those who are not now in the fold, as if their entrance is an accomplished fact. These sheep he has not yet brought; they have not yet heard his voice. They have not yet repented and believed, but they are called sheep.

The sheep are referred to as Israelites throughout Scripture. We are not supposed to interpret "sheep" as gentile believers. Context determines who the "sheep" are, and unless you, Dr. Bob or I are Jews we are not "sheep". We are not natural branches, we have been grafted in.

The sheep "not of this fold" in John 10 are the 2 remaining tribes with Rehoboam which formed Judah. Jesus was speaking of the full union of all 12 tribes, not the 10 that broke off from Rhoboam that went on to form what we know as Israel. It is the fullness of Christ's kingdom. Replacement theologians cannot grasp this.

 

[webdog]

Now that I have had time to re-visit Bob's post I disagree with your assessment and I make no apology to you. My problem was that I started using your tactics and reasoning and for that I am ashamed.

Then continue to hold to the same false doctrine then and believe you are a "sheep" apart from Christ.

 

[jbh28]

Hey sheep people. THIS ISN'T ABOUT THAT! STOP HIJACKING MY THREAD

In other words, go start another thread. This would be an interesting subject, but I'm not going to respond to it here because this is about if babies go to heaven or hell, not if you are a sheep before you are saved.

 

[jbh28]

And you can now see that every Calvinist has denied it to this point.

I wasn't too surprised actually

But when you choose this subject you are choosing a topic they many have personally experienced ...even as Calvinist. In any event your lack of sensitivity & sensibility is astonishing.

Are you saying that we shouldn't be having the discussion, or was it my approach? I wasn't trying to be insensitive about anything.

I'm probably going to ask the to close it anyway because there are a few(including an admin) that keeps talking about something other than the OP.

 

[webdog]

Hey sheep people. THIS ISN'T ABOUT THAT! STOP HIJACKING MY THREAD

In other words, go start another thread. This would be an interesting subject, but I'm not going to respond to it here because this is about if babies go to heaven or hell, not if you are a sheep before you are saved.

Doesn't it go hand in hand? Dr. Bob said he was a sheep before born, while an infant, and the day before he put his faith in Christ.

 

[jbh28]

Doesn't it go hand in hand? Dr. Bob said he was a sheep before born, while an infant, and the day before he put his faith in Christ.

Well, I hope he doesn't mean he was saved before he came to Christ, but I don't think that's what he's referring to. I think it's an excellent discussion about when we become sheep, but it's a little off topic. It could be twisted to be on topic which would be fine, but not it's more of when we become sheep instead of babies.

 

[webdog]

Well, I hope he doesn't mean he was saved before he came to Christ, but I don't think that's what he's referring to

What else could it possibly mean? If a "sheep" dies, do they go to be with the Lord or cast into the lake of fire? If it's the former, you can spend eternity with God apart from faith in Christ. Either all babies are "sheep" or only "sheep babies" go to Heaven while the non do not.

 

[jbh28]

I apologize if I have offended anyone with this thread. That was not my intention. I saw something mentioned in another thread and thought it might have been a good discussion.

View Poll Results: Where do babies go when they die?
Heaven, I'm a Calvinist 6 17.14%
Hell, I'm a Calvinist 0 0%
Heaven, I'm not a Calvinist 25 71.43%
Hell, I'm not a Calvinist 1 2.86%
I'm not sure, I'm a Calvinist 3 8.57%
I'm not sure, I'm not a Calvinist 0 0%

Of course, it looks like only one voted of not heaven, which means that the majority, including myself believe that babies go to heaven when they die. And all Calvinist voted either not sure or heaven.

I think most of us agree that babies go to heaven when they die. I didn't think about how personal this could be for some and I am sorry again if I upset anyone over this topic.

 

[Dr. Bob]

Mine was a serious post directly in keeping with the op. Sorry if some can't see it.

If a person is known/loved from eternity past by the Father, they will receive His grace and go to heaven. If they are not (and we have NO clue as to who is thus known/loved) they will not receive God's grace.

Nothing to do with Calvinism; everything to do with a sovereign God who saves by His grace alone, not man "doing" something.

Sorry to see a few posts go haywire here; thought the salient point I made was clear enough.

(And feel only extreme pity for those who think I am not saved or should not administrate here because of belief that I am a sheep!!) PLEASE DO NOT POST THE ANTI-CALVINIST GARBAGE HERE; stick with the op.

 

[Tom Butler]

I am going to try to keep this post within the general parameters of the OP, and at the same time address some points of contention.

I have already pointed out that Jesus described some who were not yet saved (I believe he's referring to Gentiles) as "sheep." Whether one holds that this is unconditional election at work, or simply God's foreknowledge of who who will be eventually saved, the result is the same--their salvation is a certainty. It is a certainty because what God foreknows today, he has always foreknown, from eternity.

That's why Dr. Bob could say:

(I was a sheep before I was formed in my mother's womb. I was a sheep before I could talk or walk. I was a sheep on March 16 1957 and was still a sheep on March 17, 1957 after I repented and believed. Always was a sheep. Always will be a sheep.

We also have at least four recorded instances where God has chosen people for salvation and service before they were born:

Isaiah made this assertion:

Isa. 49:1 Listen to me, you islands; hear this, you distant nations: Before I was born the LORD called me; from my birth he has made mention of my name.

So did Jeremiah:

Jer.1;5 Before I formed you in the belly I knew you; and before you came forth out of the womb I sanctified you, and I ordained you a prophet to the nations.

The angel told Zacharias regarding John the Baptist:

Luke 1:15 for he will be great in the sight of the Lord. He is never to take wine or other fermented drink, and he will be filled with the Holy Spirit even from birth.

And finally, the Apostle Paul:

Gal 1;15 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace, 16To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:

Now, these passages do not tell us what happens to all infants who die, but they do shed some light on these four, whose salvation and service were decreed from eternity.

I rest on the assurance that the future of those who die in infancy is in God's hands. I also believe we can take comfort from Jesus own words:

Mark 10:14 Suffer the little children to come unto me and forbid them not, for of such is the kingdom of heaven

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Matt 18;14 Even so, it is not the will of your Father which is in heaven, that one of these little ones should perish.

And finally, I cite this passage:

2 Cor 5:10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that each one may receive what is due him for the things done while in the body, whether good or bad.

So, infants are not judged on the basis of their sinful nature (which they are born with); they are not judged for Adam's sin; and they have no "sins of the body" to be accounted for.

And one can make the case that Jesus death the cross covered their sin nature, just as it does ours who live.

 

[jbh28]

Mine was a serious post directly in keeping with the op. Sorry if some can't see it.

If a person is known/loved from eternity past by the Father, they will receive His grace and go to heaven. If they are not (and we have NO clue as to who is thus known/loved) they will not receive God's grace.

Nothing to do with Calvinism; everything to do with a sovereign God who saves by His grace alone, not man "doing" something.

Sorry to see a few posts go haywire here; thought the salient point I made was clear enough.

(And feel only extreme pity for those who think I am not saved or should not administrate here because of belief that I am a sheep!!) PLEASE DO NOT POST THE ANTI-CALVINIST GARBAGE HERE; stick with the op.

in other words, you would say that God has chosen to save some babies. You would say that God's elected certain persons to be saved and that includes some babies.

 

[jbh28]

I am going to try to keep this post within the general parameters of the OP, and at the same time address some points of contention.

I have already pointed out that Jesus described some who were not yet saved (I believe he's referring to Gentiles) as "sheep." Whether one holds that this is unconditional election at work, or simply God's foreknowledge of who who will be eventually saved, the result is the same--their salvation is a certainty. It is a certainty because what God foreknows today, he has always foreknown, from eternity.

That's why Dr. Bob could say:

that's what I figured Dr. Bob was referring to.

We also have at least four recorded instances where God has chosen people for salvation and service before they were born:

Isaiah made this assertion:


So did Jeremiah:


The angel told Zacharias regarding John the Baptist:


And finally, the Apostle Paul:


Now, these passages do not tell us what happens to all infants who die, but they do shed some light on these four, whose salvation and service were decreed from eternity.

I rest on the assurance that the future of those who die in infancy is in God's hands. I also believe we can take comfort from Jesus own words:
[SIZE=+1][/SIZE]


And finally, I cite this passage:


So, infants are not judged on the basis of their sinful nature (which they are born with); they are not judged for Adam's sin; and they have no "sins of the body" to be accounted for.

And one can make the case that Jesus death the cross covered their sin nature, just as it does ours who live.

I've heard this argument before too about babies being innocent though with a sin nature.

 

[psalms109:31]

What I do know

I know God is just and does not show favoritism. That all will stand before the judgement seat, not to be told if we are elect or not, but have we trusted in Jesus or not. I don't know what will happen to be babies, but they will stand before the judgement seat and it will be a just judgement with no favoritism. Their is no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. What I do believe is far fetched I guess, because no one responded to it, and maybe it is just an emotional response.