Where Does Believing Faith Come From

[Carico]

Paul wrote this to the already redeemed, which you were not at the time God was drawing you, so that scripture does not apply to the unredeemed.

So then since I trust that you believe Romans 3:11, "There's no one who seeks God," Then who, pray tell, leads us to seek God? I'll give you a hint; it's not our sinful nature since that verse says, "There's no one who seeks God", nor is it the devil. So who's left who leads us to seek God? Jesus tells us in John 6:63-64, but since too many people here ignore his words, I'm sure that it's useless to quote them here.

 

[Amy.G]

So then since I trust that you believe Romans 3:11, "There's no one who seeks God," Then who, pray tell, leads us to seek God? I'll give you a hint; it's not our sinful nature since that verse says, "There's no one who seeks God", nor is it the devil. So who's left who leads us to seek God? Jesus tells us in John 6:63-64, but since too many people here ignore his words, I'm sure that it's useless to quote them here.

The Holy Spirit leads us to God, but His leading does not mean that one will automatically receive Him. And until you receive Him, you will not be indwelt by Him and be born again.

Read what Stephen said:

Act 7:51 ¶Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers [did], so [do] ye.


People CAN resist the Holy Spirit's drawing. Or as you so often like to say to the rest of us, maybe you don't believe Acts 7:51.

 

[Carico]

The Holy Spirit leads us to God, but His leading does not mean that one will automatically receive Him. And until you receive Him, you will not be indwelt by Him and be born again.

Read what Stephen said:

Act 7:51 ¶Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers [did], so [do] ye.


People CAN resist the Holy Spirit's drawing. Or as you so often like to say to the rest of us, maybe you don't believe Acts 7:51.

So you think that the sinful nature or the devil are more powerful than the Holy Spirit from God. is that correct? If so, then you need to believe Romans 11;29 as well, "For God's gifts and His call are irrevocable."

That means they cannot be altered. that's why when Jonah ran away from God, God found him; when Jacob wrestled with God, God broke his hip so he would surrender. David committed adultery and murdered a man yet God was still with him. When Jeremiah turned down God's request, God overpowered Jeremiah as Jeremiah says in 20:7. So you are incorrect.

 

[Amy.G]

So you think that the sinful nature or the devil are more powerful than the Holy Spirit from God. is that correct? If so, then you need to believe Romans 11;29 as well, "For God's gifts and His call are irrevocable."

Of course not, but God gives us a choice. "Choose this day whom you will serve".

My question to you is do you believe Acts 7:51? Stephen said the Jews resisted the Holy Spirit. Is that true?

 

[Winman]

That is not what John 14:17 says. Jesus was dwelling with the disciples but when He went back to God, the Holy Spirit would dwell within them.

I believe the scriptures, every jot and tittle. It is you that I do not believe.

Yes Amy, they do not understand that the Holy Spirit first works from outside a man. It is only when a person willingly receives Christ into their heart that the Holy Spirit enters a man and quickens them.

Acts 7:51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.

Here, Stephen shows that the Holy Spirit is trying to save these men. The Holy Spirit is calling and drawing them from the outside. But these men resisted the Holy Spirit and would not receive him into their hearts.

Carico loves to speak of how others are blinded and deceived, but will not accept the clear teachings of scripture.

 

[Amy.G]

So you are incorrect.

I am not incorrect. Stephen said the Jews resisted the Holy Spirit. Do you believe that?

You say that you believe the scriptures, but you are resisting the Holy Spirit right now when you deny that He can be resisted.

 

[Carico]

I am not incorrect. Stephen said the Jews resisted the Holy Spirit. Do you believe that?

That's because God is blinding their eyes which you would know if you read Romans 11. So you need to read much more of the bible to understand God's chosen and that only a remnant of the Jews will be saved and why. Only those whom God enables can come to Christ as Jesus tells us in John 6:63-634. So read it and believe it. John 9:39, " For judgment I have come to the world, so that the blind will see and those who see will become blind."

 

[Winman]

So then since I trust that you believe Romans 3:11, "There's no one who seeks God," Then who, pray tell, leads us to seek God? I'll give you a hint; it's not our sinful nature since that verse says, "There's no one who seeks God", nor is it the devil. So who's left who leads us to seek God? Jesus tells us in John 6:63-64, but since too many people here ignore his words, I'm sure that it's useless to quote them here.

Carico, are you seperated from reality? You yourself said you wanted to understand the Bible for years and so do many of your atheist friends.

According to you, a man must be regenerated by the Holy Spirit before he has any desire to seek God. But by your own words you did not believe the Bible and neither do your friends who also have a desire to believe.

You simply cannot give up this false doctrine. Your very own experience shows a lost man can seek God.

 

[Amy.G]

That's because God is blinding their eyes which you would know if you read Romans 11. So you need to read much more of the bible to understand God's chosen and that only a remnant of the Jews will be saved and why. Only those whom God enables can come to Christ as Jesus tells us in John 6:63-634. So read it and believe it.

So are you saying that the Holy Spirit can be resisted, but only if God blinds the eyes of those He is drawing? Now does that make any sense? Why would God draw someone through the power of the Holy Spirit and then blind them so they can't believe? God does not play games as you seem to be implying.

According to your doctrine, anyone whom God draws will be saved. Yet we see in Acts 7:51 that that is not true is it? God was drawing the Jews by the power of the Holy Spirit, yet they resisted. Your doctrine claims that they would not be able to resist God's drawing or that would make it "ineffectual". One of you is wrong and it's NOT the bible.

 

[Carico]

So are you saying that the Holy Spirit can be resisted, but only if God blinds the eyes of those He is drawing? Now does that make any sense? Why would God draw someone through the power of the Holy Spirit and then blind them so they can't believe? God does not play games as you seem to be implying.

God isn't giving the Holy Spirit to the Jews any more. He is not drawing the Jews, he is punishing them for their previous unbelief as Jesus explains in MT. 23. So again, "No one can come to me unless the father has enabled him." God is not enabling the Jews to see. Jesus said that when talking about Judas. God wasn't leading Judas to follow Christ but to betray Christ.

 

[Winman]

So are you saying that the Holy Spirit can be resisted, but only if God blinds the eyes of those He is drawing? Now does that make any sense? Why would God draw someone through the power of the Holy Spirit and then blind them so they can't believe? God does not play games as you seem to be implying.

Carico has messed up. Carico in her own words has admitted that she wanted to believe the Bible for years and could not. And then she says many of her atheist friends also want to believe the Bible but it does not make sense.

And Carico constantly talks about God blinding people when I have shown her several scriptures that shows God only blinds those who willfully reject Christ first.

 

[Amy.G]

That's because God is blinding their eyes which you would know if you read Romans 11. So you need to read much more of the bible to understand God's chosen and that only a remnant of the Jews will be saved and why. Only those whom God enables can come to Christ as Jesus tells us in John 6:63-634. So read it and believe it. John 9:39, " For judgment I have come to the world, so that the blind will see and those who see will become blind."

If the Holy Spirit draws someone to God, will that person be saved?

 

[Amy.G]

God isn't giving the Holy Spirit to the Jews any more. He is not drawing the Jews, he is punishing them for their previous unbelief as Jesus explains in MT. 23. So again, "No one can come to me unless the father has enabled him." God is not enabling the Jews to see. Jesus said that when talking about Judas. God wasn't leading Judas to follow Christ but to betray Christ.

That is untrue. You are saying that a Jew cannot be saved. God does not turn anyone away who chooses to receive Him. Jews are saved everyday. I know of them personally. God's blinding of the Jews is referring to national Israel. He does not reject individuals who come to Him in faith. Hence the "remnant".

 

[Carico]

If the Holy Spirit draws someone to God, will that person be saved?

Yes, unequivocally because God's gifts and His call are irrevocable. :godisgood: But again, the key is that since no one but God knows who His elect are, then salvation is open to anyone who wants it. In those whom God is drawing, he gives them the desire for him. There are only TWO powers operating in the world; God and Satan. So the battle belongs to the Lord, not us and that's why "our struggle is not against flesh and blood."

 

[Amy.G]

Carico has messed up.

Irrevocably. :laugh:

 

[Carico]

Carico has messed up. Carico in her own words has admitted that she wanted to believe the Bible for years and could not. And then she says many of her atheist friends also want to believe the Bible but it does not make sense.

And Carico constantly talks about God blinding people when I have shown her several scriptures that shows God only blinds those who willfully reject Christ first.

Wrong. Those atheists who want to believe will eventually be saved. But they can't believe without the HS even though they want to. So it's you who are wrong again.

I'm sorry that you don't believe Jesus when he says "No one can come to me unless the Father has enabled him." I do. And that's why I know I was being drawn by God.

 

[Amy.G]

Yes, unequivocally because God's gifts and His call are irrevocable. :godisgood: But again, the key is that since no one but God knows who His elect are, then salvation is open to anyone who wants it. In those whom God is drawing, he gives them the desire for him. There are only TWO powers operating in the world; God and Satan. So the battle belongs to the Lord, not us and that's why "our struggle is not against flesh and blood."

Then explain Acts 7:51.

Act 7:51 ¶Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers [did], so [do] ye.

The Holy Spirit cannot be resisted unless He is drawing. Why weren't these Jews saved? The Holy Spirit was drawing and convicting their hearts.

Act 7:54 ¶When they heard these things, they were cut to the heart, and they gnashed on him with [their] teeth.

But instead of believing the Holy Spirit speaking through Stephen:

Act 7:57 Then they cried out with a loud voice, and stopped their ears, and ran upon him with one accord,

They rejected the drawing of the Holy Spirit and killed Stephen to shut him up.

 

[Winman]

Yes, unequivocally because God's gifts and His call are irrevocable. :godisgood: But again, the key is that since no one but God knows who His elect are, then salvation is open to anyone who wants it. In those whom God is drawing, he gives them the desire for him. There are only TWO powers operating in the world; God and Satan. So the battle belongs to the Lord, not us and that's why "our struggle is not against flesh and blood."

Then why did Jesus say "many are called, but few are chosen"?

Matt 22:2 The kingdom of heaven is like unto a certain king, which made a marriage for his son,
3 And sent forth his servants to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not come.

Matt 22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen.

 

[Carico]

Actually, many posts here are like the people whom Jesus rebuked in the parable of the worker. They want to tell God what to do. Jesus tells them, "Don't I have the right to do what I want with my money?" Winman and Amy say "No! Man makes the decision of the universe." :laugh:

Claiming that faith comes from the self is called "self-righteousness", the yeast of the Pharisees. "By their fruits you will recognize them."

 

[Amy.G]

Wrong. Those atheists who want to believe will eventually be saved. But they can't believe without the HS even though they want to. So it's you who are wrong again.

They can't possibly want to believe according to your own words. Remember that no one seeks God? Now you are saying that these atheists are seeking God. Which is it????????