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Who is responsible?

D

drfuss

New Member
For many years the Roman Catholic Church blamed the Jews for Christ being crucified. Some years ago, the RCC apologized for blaming the Jews.

Who should take the blame for Christ being crucified and to what extent?

God?
Sinners?
The Jews?
Romans?
Chief Priests?
Christians?
Satan?
Adam?
 
D

donnA

Active Member
Chirst Himself. No one made Him, He chose to do it, because of His great love. He didn't have to.

Blame? Blame?
As if it was bad thing?
It bought your freedom and forgiveness.
But again, Christ chose it becasue He loved us.
 
D

drfuss

New Member
DonnA writes:
"Chirst Himself. No one made Him, He chose to do it, because of His great love. He didn't have to."

I agree. I think that is the best answer. Christ loved us so much that He was going to sacrifice Himself for us one way or the other. The Romans and the Jews were the ones that happened to be involved.

On the other hand, I may look at it differently if I were a Jew. The Jewish religeous leaders rejected Jesus as the Messiah. Had the Jewish nation accepted Jesus, their kingdom could have been established then. Todays Jews could blame their religeous leaders of 2000 years ago.

However, the sin problem had to be handled first and thank the Lord He took care of that for all of us.
 
P

Pete

New Member
Revelation 13:8 declares Christ as "the Lamb that was slain from the creation of the world." Back from Genesis 3:15 (oh ok, Genesis 1:1 then ;)) God has been revealing Himself and His plan of salvation.

At Jesus' arrest He showed exactly who was in control of the situation "Do you think I cannot call on my Father, and he will at once put at my disposal more than twelve legions of angels?" Matthew 26:53, "I am he" John 18:5. He pointed this out when He was before Pilate as well "You would have no power over me if it were not given to you from above." John 19:11

The blame goes to Satan & sinners (which includes the Jews, Romans, Chief Priests, Adam, you, me, and a cast of billions), the praise, glory, & thanks goes to God.

"Praise be to the Lord, the God of Israel, because he has come and has redeemed his people." Luke 1:68
 
J

J. Jump

New Member
It depends on what perspective you look at it from. If you are looking from just a historical perspective then you could blame the Jews and/or the Romans.

Spiritually speaking the Bible makes it plain that the Jews killed Him. Acts 2-4 tell us that as well as the OT type of Cain and Abel.

But also spiritually speaking it was you and I and all sinners that made it even necessary from Him to go to the cross and die.
 
D

drfuss

New Member
DonnA writes:
"Blame? Blame?
As if it was bad thing?
It bought your freedom and forgiveness.
But again, Christ chose it becasue He loved us."

Donna, you are right. Instead of saying who was to "blame"; I should have asked who was "responsible"?

Hopefully, readers will take it in that context.

Thanks,

drfuss
 
E

El_Guero

New Member
Pete

Have you ever wondered what those 12 legions thought when HE DID NOT ask for rescue.

Have you ever thought about how the commander of troops (of the angelic body guard) felt when God the Father did not give him permission to go in?

Can you imagine what the lowest angel felt when he was not allowed to perform HIS JOB and protect the Christ from that Roman spear? When the angel was not allowed to DO what he (she or it) had trained for for THOUSANDS of years?

Pete said:
Revelation 13:8 declares Christ as "the Lamb that was slain from the creation of the world." Back from Genesis 3:15 (oh ok, Genesis 1:1 then ;)) God has been revealing Himself and His plan of salvation.

At Jesus' arrest He showed exactly who was in control of the situation "Do you think I cannot call on my Father, and he will at once put at my disposal more than twelve legions of angels?" Matthew 26:53, "I am he" John 18:5. He pointed this out when He was before Pilate as well "You would have no power over me if it were not given to you from above." John 19:11

The blame goes to Satan & sinners (which includes the Jews, Romans, Chief Priests, Adam, you, me, and a cast of billions), the praise, glory, & thanks goes to God.

"Praise be to the Lord, the God of Israel, because he has come and has redeemed his people." Luke 1:68
Click to expand...
 
E

El_Guero

New Member
Now think about the feeling that goes through each and every angel in the Body Guard when the King throws his leg over the white horse.

Thousands of years of training & waiting will be let loose in nano-seconds. The snap count will be so quick, even a blink of an eye will be slow. No hesitation. Absolute obedience. Every warrior absolutely prepared. Every commander's dream - but, only the Christ will have that privilege of leading the perfect Army into combat.

I thank Our Lord & God that I won't be on the other side.
 
P

Pete

New Member
El_Guero, I've often thought about the angels watching and waiting for the command that day...Was fiddling around with trying to write something a few years ago. Got through the crucifixion and resurrection, but never thought as far ahead as your second post. Got goosebumps, cried, and thought "Praise God" all at the same time then. Thanks for helping me work out the answer to 1 + 1 :) If I can dig up what I was working on would you mind if I used a line or two of yours? Will post in PM first if can find it and get it done :)
 
T

Tom Butler

New Member
I get the feeling that everybody is wanting to dance gingerly around the OP question. And I notice that some posters wanted to rephrase the question, suggesting that is was a bit imprecise.

If one asks, "for what reason did Jesus die?", we can blame outselves as sinners whom he took our place.

If one asks, "who carried out the death sentence?", we know it was the Romans.

If one asks "who hated Jesus enough to plot his death and succeed?", we know it was the Jewish leaders.

If one asks who was ultimately responsible, we answer that God is, from the foundation of the world.

If one asks who killed him, we could answer that no one could kill God the Son without his allowing it.

If one asks who is to blame, then we can turn so this passage in Acts 2:22-23. Peter is addressing "Ye men of Israel." Then, "Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have tken, and by wicked hands, crucified and slain."

This, parenthetically, is the classic verse which teaches God's sovereignty and man's responsibility.

Hope this helps.
 
2

2BHizown

New Member
reformedbeliever said:
This was part of God's predestined purpose, and His perfect plan.
Click to expand...

Exactly! God by His decree before the foundation of the world determined all that would happen, forever!
 
R

Rex77

Member
Ac 2:22 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:

Ac 2:23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:
 
The Archangel

The Archangel

Well-Known Member
To All

It is a difficult question. It is a difficult answer. Certainly we, as sinners, contributed to the death of Christ. Certainly the Jews contributed and certainly the Romans contributed. There is plenty of “blame” to go around. However, the simple answer is “God killed Jesus.”

Acts 13:26-29
26 “Brothers, sons of the family of Abraham, and those among you who fear God, to us has been sent the message of this salvation. 27 For those who live in Jerusalem and their rulers, because they did not recognize him nor understand the utterances of the prophets, which are read every Sabbath, fulfilled them by condemning him. 28 And though they found in him no guilt worthy of death, they asked Pilate to have him executed. 29 And when they had carried out all that was written of him, they took him down from the tree and laid him in a tomb.

God ordains the free actions of us humans and this is a great example of that. The Jews, “Because they didn’t understand the utterances of the prophets” fulfilled the writings of the prophets.

They should have known better, yet they didn’t. Their lack of understanding caused them to do exactly what God had written through the prophets. The Jews were to blame, among others, but God had planned this all along and His plan does not mean that those who, by their own free will, committed the acts are without guilt or blame.

Gotta go. Sorry to “Hit and Run.”

Blessings,

The Archangel
 
L

LeBuick

New Member
donnA said:
Chirst Himself. No one made Him, He chose to do it, because of His great love. He didn't have to..
Click to expand...

Ah, but Christ was only being obedient. It was the will of him that sent him.
 
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