Who Said?

[michael-acts17:11]

So, what words should be used? As adults, should we say, poot, boody, etc? That is childishness. Mature adults can call things by their names without the foolish immaturity. The word butt is short for buttocks; isn't that the proper term? I am not anal retentive about "slang" in my home & I think it is juvenile to be easily offended by slang. It is a GREAT stretch to apply Scripture which outline pure speech to using cultural slang. Some people in our Baptist churches just need to grow up & quit looking for reasons to be offended. We should be defined by what we are for; not what we are against.

 

[menageriekeeper]

Iconoclast, lol, I just got through posting about those verses over here:

http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=71258

From those posts:

No where in the Ephesians passage are we told not to use slang. Corrupt language isn't slang. It's deceptive language, its a con game used to draw people away from doing good or its meant to hurt rather than uplift. If edifying language is what we want to use, then corrupt language must lead in the opposite direction. Say you come out wearing a shirt that swirls in bright red and orange colors and it looks absolutely horrid on you. Its edifying for me to say "I really don't care much for that style shirt", it wouldn't be edifying for me to say "you look like a creeper in those clothes". See the difference? The first was a useful comment, the second was offensive, though neither time did I use slang or any foul language. The first comment leads to discussion, the second to defensiveness.

The first comment supports being loving and peaceful. The second is sarcastic and on the verge of hateful. Corrupt language means sooo much more than slang or even foul language. God always looks at the intention behind the speech. Out of heart does the mouth speak. Christ told us this. To simply apply the warning to particular words takes away the heart of the passage.

This does not mean I'm to be psychic! If I have someone come to me and say, "I wish you wouldn't use the word b*tt around me because I was raised that it was a bad word", I'd take it out of my vocabulary. Similarly, I realize that my parents think the word drat is short for d*mn so I don't use it at their house. I know that d*mn is an abbrevation for the word damnation which isn't considered foul at all, but I can play nice when things aren't worth arguing over.

However, if I'm in the park and I ask my children if they know where my d*rn cell phone is, I'm not going to worry about being overheard. I can't read minds. There is no reason I should have too. My language isn't directed at others and my children aren't being hurt in any way by use of the word d*rn, because they haven't been taught that it is a sin unto death to use it! (yeah, that was sarcasm, but that was also how I was taught as a child and can remember severe punishments being handed out over the use of the word d*rn. Seriously, we didn't even darn socks in our house!)

 

[freeatlast]

I was born and raised in the South, and I wasn't allowed to use language like this, and my parents weren't even religious.

Why in the world would people be talking about these subjects in church anyway?

Winman it is because of what is happening in the church and a very low regard for the Lord. Scripture warns that this would happen.

For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,

Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,
Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;
Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

If you think about it even the world knows that this kind of thing is wrong as they will limit it to where and when they use it so I think it becomes very clear who these people really are that seek to justify it this potty mouth speech.
Be not deceived: evil communications corrupt good manners.
Awake to righteousness, and sin not; for some have not the knowledge of God: I speak [this] to your shame.

 

[David Lamb]

So, what words should be used? As adults, should we say, poot, boody, etc? That is childishness. Mature adults can call things by their names without the foolish immaturity.

Not quite sure what you are saying here. Are you suggesting that the words mentioned in the OP are the correct words, whereas "poot" and "boody" are just the words children use for the same things? (Perhaps that's just American children; I've never heard of "poot" and "boody"!) I've just looked up "f*rt" in two different English dictionaries, both secular, so with no particular concern for biblical standards. One says (emphasis mine):

an offensive term meaning to release intestinal gases through the anus, usually with an accompanying sound (slang)
​

The other (again, emphasis mine) gives:

Taboo. To break wind.
​

On those very rare occasions when it might be necessary to mention this in conversation, "break wind" is surely the "proper" term.

 

[Amy.G]

I'm sorry if I've offended anybody. I really didn't know those were bad words.

 

[sag38]

The only thing that has guided FreeatLast is culture and not the Holy Spirit. He is misunderstanding the influence of current culture on his life with the guidance of the Holy Spirit. The culture has determined for him which words are offensive and which are not. Not only that he uses these words as a determinant of holiness. Since he doesn't use certain cultural words he thinks that he is more holy than those who do not which in and of itself is troubling.

 

[menageriekeeper]

Honestly Amy, I'm not offended.

Just as you say, these are words that in our culture are used every day and no offense is intended.

50-100 years ago (and even longer in some cases), someone decided that certain words were offensive. Who was offended? No one knows. But someone was. Probably someone that was of the upper class and determined to prove their status by deciding that certain language was "proper" and other usages "weren't". And part of that propriety was no one in "proper" society ever referred to a bodily function in public. Therefore words like butt and f*rt and even more proper terms were discouraged.

Does this make them sin in the eyes of God? No. Honestly, this is a cultural phenomonem (boy that's some good spelling), that reflects the fluidity of language and the openness or closeness of subjects that are "proper" to be discussed. God doesn't seem to have any inhibitions in the subject matter He discusses in His word. It's all there in plain terms. It is man who has decided that certain words and certain subjects should remain undiscussed.

That's not to say its a bad thing to not discuss certain subjects in certain forums. "let all things be done decently and in order" is good advice.

But man should seek to make things sinful that God doesn't call sinful.

 

[ituttut]

A BUMP TO freeatlast

[/COLOR]freeatlast] The bump: "Why do you find a word/s that defines a truth sin? How do you know sin when you see it, or hear it?"

You may have missed in the hustle and bustle, or may not wish to converse further. I'll understand, either way.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

So, what words should be used? As adults, should we say, poot, boody, etc? That is childishness. Mature adults can call things by their names without the foolish immaturity. The word butt is short for buttocks; isn't that the proper term? I am not anal retentive about "slang" in my home & I think it is juvenile to be easily offended by slang. It is a GREAT stretch to apply Scripture which outline pure speech to using cultural slang. Some people in our Baptist churches just need to grow up & quit looking for reasons to be offended. We should be defined by what we are for; not what we are against.

:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs:

 

[abcgrad94]

I'm sorry if I've offended anybody. I really didn't know those were bad words.

Amy, there are no "bad words," only hearts that mean words for evil or for good. Don't let others lay sin at your door where there is none. If someone believes certain words to be culturally offensive, then of course we shouldn't purposely TRY to offend them. On the other hand there are some who will take offense at everything, and it's not our job to constantly squeeze into their man-made mold just to keep them happy.

 

[Gabriel Elijah]

I think this is a very sensible topic---I asked a professor once—how could Christians apply certain verses about curse words being inappropriate for Christians---when most words we consider curse words did not exist in biblical times. Further, words have different meaning in different cultures, while I’ve never personally been to England I had a buddy from there & he told me, he always avoided the word “bloody” b/c in his home growing up-- it got him in trouble if he used it. Not to mention the fact that some words are acceptable when used one way, but considered repulsive & vulgar if used in another context. I really think those that said culture decides what are considered curse words nailed it---- & b/c we are not to hurt are witness it is best to avoid words that are obviously controversial. While so called curse words do not normally bother me (with the exception of taking the name of Jesus in vein, this honestly makes my skin crawl) I personally try to avoid controversial terms so I don’t hurt my witness as a Christian, not b/c I think God is utterly opposed to the term itself.

 

[sag38]

A friend of mine was taking "Shag" lessons with his wife. Here in the U.S. that is a form of dancing. When my friend told some British business associates that he to take shag lessons with his wife they were appalled. Shagging in the US is dancing. In England it is something else entirely.

 

[Alcott]

I have written quite a bit on this subject before, so I don't think I have a lot to say any longer but the gist: no matter how you try to justify or condemn, the history of 'vulgar' language in English does come down to snobbery. The French/Latin-based words for certain body parts or function are 'acceptable,' while the Germanic-based (and usually shorter) words for the same things are "vulgar" because of the French-speaking court and nobility. To a lesser degree this applies also to other topics, like meat-- it would be considered less proper to say "cow stew" than "beef stew" because beef comes from French (the ones who dined at the feast) and cow is Germanic (those who herded and butchered the animals).

 

[MamaCW]

I remember responding to that post.. and this is my own personal opinion..

I had mentioned the social norm bit in the original post..

I agree that parents influence the language people grow up using..both my parents still to this day curse like sailors (as a result we do not leave our little boy with them)..but you can unlearn them.. i no longer use foul language like i used to..(God's word/command as quoted in previous posts) are #1 reason)..but besides that reason..its just trashy talk to me..I truly believe that there are more educated and classier ways to communicate and express your points without having to use filthy trashy language..

as for butt and fart, ..i agree its a cultural and social class topic..i personally think the word fart is such an ugly word..i prefer to say pass gas..just sounds more correct ..butt..not something I'd use in a professional setting..or in any setting other than with very close few..

as for the question that the original poster asked..i believe societies/cultures determine what words are considered proper and profane/vulgar etc...

one thing that drives me nuts is when people will curse and act like "what did i do?" and their excuse is "i dont see it as a curse word" ...my father in law used to do that..he used the S word all the time and say it isn't a curse word..he would say it was just an acronym for ship high in transit..and i guess there are people that truly believe that lie lol..but i looked it up and it is in fact a curse word..and showed it to him..and he stopped.. but even though.. where do people see any kind of relation between ships being high in transit and using a word to vulgarly describe poop or use it in ways that have absolutely nothing to do with either..just like the P word that people use in relation to urinating AND getting mad.. how do those two things even coincide?? I don't get mad when i urinate..i dont get it..but anyway..off of my crazy rambling..

the bible tells us to obey the laws of the land.. and who determines the laws of the land..people do..just like people determine what words are considered profane/vulgar/unacceptable (although you wouldnt know it with how vulgar the world as become {ie, televisions shows allowing words that were not allowed in the past})...and if the bible tells me not to speak with profane words..i'm going to go off of what i know to be (or what society at one point considered) profanity/vulgar words..

okay..that went way above and beyond the "butt and fart" ..but it led to my rant..lol..feels good to get that off my chest haha..sorry..the cursing topic has just been a constant :tonofbricks: lately because both my parents and my father in law have potty mouths (father in law not so much).. and thats been a major concern considering we dont want our little one around that kind of language :BangHead:

 

[David Lamb]

A friend of mine was taking "Shag" lessons with his wife. Here in the U.S. that is a form of dancing. When my friend told some British business associates that he to take shag lessons with his wife they were appalled. Shagging in the US is dancing. In England it is something else entirely.

There are examples of this sort of thing happening the other way round, too. If an American heard a British schoolboy asking his friend, "Could I borrow your rubber?" the American would probably be horrified, unless he happened to know that in "British English", the word "rubber" in that context means "a piece of rubber used to erase writing".

But surely this whole matter is a question of the heart. If someone uses the word "f*rt" because that is the only way they know of referring to breaking wind, that's different to someone who uses the word deliberately to shock, while knowing that (in their culture) that word is considered rude. I cannot see any excuse for using expletives, words that are said, not for their meaning, but because they are swear-words.

 

[Luke2427]

There are examples of this sort of thing happening the other way round, too. If an American heard a British schoolboy asking his friend, "Could I borrow your rubber?" the American would probably be horrified, unless he happened to know that in "British English", the word "rubber" in that context means "a piece of rubber used to erase writing".

But surely this whole matter is a question of the heart. If someone uses the word "f*rt" because that is the only way they know of referring to breaking wind, that's different to someone who uses the word deliberately to shock, while knowing that (in their culture) that word is considered rude. I cannot see any excuse for using expletives, words that are said, not for their meaning, but because they are swear-words.

I don't care how you slice it MOST Baptists make too big a deal out of this language issue.

Sure one should be mindful of his witness and his weaker brothers.

But the sad and TRAGIC fact is that GOSSIP which is wickedness is far more tolerated in Baptist circles than the innocent use of four letter words.

That is back---wards.

 

[David Lamb]

I don't care how you slice it MOST Baptists make too big a deal out of this language issue.

Sure one should be mindful of his witness and his weaker brothers.

But the sad and TRAGIC fact is that GOSSIP which is wickedness is far more tolerated in Baptist circles than the innocent use of four letter words.

That is back---wards.

I agree, Luke, that we are on shaky ground if we try to make a big deal out of one sin, while ignoring another. I agree that if baptists (or any other Christians) tolerate gossip, it is sad and tragic.

But does that mean that there is nothing wrong in Christians using words and phrases that even the secular world refers to as obscene or offensive? (see my post 24 on this thread).

 

[Bro. James]

Venial sins

If we have to ask if our white shirt looks dirty it certainly is dirty.

"Be not conformed to this world; but be ye transformed by the renewing of your minds"

Our minds are not born again. We have many ROMs and RAMs which were programmed by the world--even the god of this world.

Study I John 1:1-10 every morning with coffee(decaff of course). Follow the instructions the rest of the day.

I am reminded of my daughter's question when she was a teen: "How do we tell which ones are the Christians, Daddy? They all ACT the same, except on Sunday.

Hippocracy=pretense, acting

Are we ready for the Bema Seat?

Have a blessed day,

Bro. James

 

[sag38]

If we have to ask if our white shirt looks dirty it certainly is dirty.

There are indeed somethings deemed to be wrong "dirty" that clearly are not.

 

[David Lamb]

Are we ready for the Bema Seat?

Sorry, but what's a Bema Seat? From your context, I imagine it's something to do with either our own deaths or the Second Coming of Christ, but I cannot find the expression in any of the English translations of the bible I have.