Why Do Catholics pretend to be other denominations?

[Claudia_T]

JJ

thats nutty :tongue3:

 

[J. Jump]

Why are they going to the Lord, saying Lord and Lord? Because they thought they were accepted by Him and saved. But actually not!~

Wow Eliyahu I haven't seen a translation yet that includes all that. That is what Eliyahu thinks, not what Scripture says. The passage says that they call Him Lord. No one is able to call Him Lord except the Holy Spirit leads them according to Scripture.

That right there tells us they were saved. But just in case that isn't convincing enough, which it should be, it also tells us that these folks cast out demons. An unsaved person can not cast a demon out of someone, because that would be Satan casting out himself and Scripture also tells us that is not possible.

There "works" are involved here not their eternal (spiritual) salvation.

One more interesting verse

It is quite an interesting passage. However you are taking a passage that is talking about apples and trying to force it to be speaking about oranges. It's speaking about apples and unless it is dealt with on that basis then it will be handled the incorrect way.

This is not a passage of eternal (spiritual) salvation. Jesus came as their King. He was offering them a place in His kingdom. These were already "saved" people. They were of the House of Israel. Lost sheep. Scripture never speaks of sheep as damned to an eternal hell. Sheep are saved, although they may be lost (not on the right path).

There's so much more that could be said . . .

 

[J. Jump]

thats nutty :tongue3:

Well I have to admit that I have had much more harsh responses than that But I must ask how is it nutty to repeat what the Scripture says. It says there are some that think they will be on their way to the kingdom of the heavens, but in fact will be told that they can not enter because the King of the Kingdom doesn't know them.

How does He not know them? Well it's in regard to their works. So if works is in the contextual picture we know that eternal (spiritual) salvation is not, because there are at least three Scriptures that make it very plain and clear that works do not enter the picture at all . . . EVER. We must leave the period where Scripture leaves the period, instead of trying to add a comma and then a conjunction

 

[Claudia_T]

JJ

Just teasing you

 

[J. Jump]

Just teasing you

You're such a kidder :applause: Thanks for the clarification. And it's okay if you really do think I'm nutty. Like I said I've been called much worse

 

[Claudia_T]

JJ

Well I dont regard your ideas any worse than some of the others I have seen on here before... how's that? And I know other people think mine are nutty too.

And so we are just a can of mixed nuts.

Claudia

 

[Eliyahu]

[/b]

Wow Eliyahu I haven't seen a translation yet that includes all that. That is what Eliyahu thinks, not what Scripture says. The passage says that they call Him Lord. No one is able to call Him Lord except the Holy Spirit leads them according to Scripture.

That right there tells us they were saved. But just in case that isn't convincing enough, which it should be, it also tells us that these folks cast out demons. An unsaved person can not cast a demon out of someone, because that would be Satan casting out himself and Scripture also tells us that is not possible.

There "works" are involved here not their eternal (spiritual) salvation.



It is quite an interesting passage. However you are taking a passage that is talking about apples and trying to force it to be speaking about oranges. It's speaking about apples and unless it is dealt with on that basis then it will be handled the incorrect way.

This is not a passage of eternal (spiritual) salvation. Jesus came as their King. He was offering them a place in His kingdom. These were already "saved" people. They were of the House of Israel. Lost sheep. Scripture never speaks of sheep as damned to an eternal hell. Sheep are saved, although they may be lost (not on the right path).

There's so much more that could be said . . .

You are accusing me for what I didn't say!
It was my explanation! Did I say it was also in the Bible?

There will be a lot of people who misunderstand their salvation! the person who are losing will be themselves!

Therefore Paul asked this to the people of Corinthian church.

2 Cor 13
5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

This applies to everyone! You cannot be the exception! Watch out!

 

[Melanie]

I for one am glad to have Catholics posting here.

Have you ever tried dialoging with Catholics on an RC message board?? Let me tell you that does not last very long before the Bible starts getting trashed non-stop.

But in a context like the Baptist Board there you don't have the "we are right because we always say we are right" groundswell of opinion in favor of RCC traditions. The arguments they make here have to stand up on their own merit - with arguments that "get challenged" by the entire group rather than "assumed to be true".

As much as it may be disconcerning to meet a Catholic here who used to attend a non-Catholic congregation -- it is a good "wake up" call. A lot of what passes for Bible study and doctrinal instruction in some non-RC congregations is merely "passing time" and tickling ears.

Even in Bible based groups - many people drift in and then back out again without being seriously engaged in exegetically sound Bible study groups. Learning the difference between man-made tradition and solid Bible doctrine is not something that simply "happens" because you attend a non-RC church group my friend.

In Christ,

Bob

That is interesting Bob, I will keep an eye out for Bible trashers on Catholic forums or any other forum for that matter, because the Bible is thoroughly part of the RCC whatever people say to the contrary:type:

 

[J. Jump]

You are accusing me for what I didn't say!
It was my explanation! Did I say it was also in the Bible?

You missed my point. My point was that if it is not in the Bible then it is your opinion and we must not deal with opinions we must deal only with what Scripture says. What happens is people read a passage and then they say here is what I think it means . . . and then their explanation becomes as good as Scripture. But what I think of Scripture, what you think of Scripture, what Joe Blow, or Sally Sue thinks of Scripture is absolutely of no matter.

The only thing that matters is what does Scripture say. Because when we know what Scritpure says then we can also know what It means.

It says they cried Lord, Lord. Unsaved folks do not call Jesus Lord. This is a scene of judgment when works are bought out into the open and tried by fire. There will be no unsaved folks at the JSOC. By way Scripture says these folks were saved folks, but yet were unknown to the Judge not becuase of what they believed or didn't believe of His saving grace, but what they believed or didn't believe about the works they were doing.

The passage that you have mentioned in I Corinthians doesn't say examine yourselves to see if you are in the faith that leads to eternal (spiritual) salvation. How can we know that based on what Scripture says. Well elsewhere Scripture tells us that eternal (spiritual) salvation is a one time event that once it happens it is over and done with.

That being the case there is nothing left to examine 1 second after the event is over, because it is complete.

For us to examine ourselves to see if we are in the faith that is eternally saving means that salvation was not an event, but is a life-long process. That violates what Scripture says.

Hope that helps.

There will be a lot of people who misunderstand their salvation! the person who are losing will be themselves!

Therefore Paul asked this to the people of Corinthian church.

2 Cor 13
5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

This applies to everyone! You cannot be the exception! Watch out!

 

[BobRyan]

That is interesting Bob, I will keep an eye out for Bible trashers on Catholic forums or any other forum for that matter, because the Bible is thoroughly part of the RCC whatever people say to the contrary:type:

Here is a tried and true method -- works every time.

Ask them "What do you think of the SOLA SCRIPTURA method of TESTING traditions to see IF they are legit and tossing out the ones that contradict scripture"...

now what they are SUPPOSED to say is "WE Love IT! We think that is the ONLY way to go and as it turns out all of our traditions have passed the test of scripture so they are all wonderful!"....

Problem is -- on REAL RC forum (and EVEN on this forum when the sola-scriptura VS TRADITION subject comes up) the overwhelming flood of RC responses are of the form "We don't need no stinking Sola Scriptura doctrine to test our traditions because our traditions are the SAME as the Bible and only a stinking non-Catholic would think to test them by the Bible. The REASON that non-Catholics NEED such a system is that they have no church leaders telling them what to think - like we do with the Pope"!!

(or something very close to that)

Mark my words.

In Christ,

Bob

 

[Eliyahu]

You missed my point. My point was that if it is not in the Bible then it is your opinion and we must not deal with opinions we must deal only with what Scripture says.

Then you must not write anything other than the scriptures, Full Stop.

 

[Matt Black]

Forgive me, I am new here, but why do very obvious Catholics like Stan the Man, Matt Black, and Angus Dei state their denominations as Baptist and Methodist on the board?

I have a hard time believing someone about anything who would lie about such an important matter.

I refer you to my reply on the other thread, viz:-

Last time I looked, ad hominem remarks of this sort were not permitted on this board. I attend and am a member of a [URL="http://lhfc.org.uk/belief.asp"]Baptist church[/URL]. I lead a Bible study group there. That doesn't mean I don't think that Landmarkism is a pile of garbage - most Baptists I know think that. So I'd be grateful if you'd retract your remark.

I would also add that my upbringing is Catholic and that I have higher views of the sacraments than most modern (but not historic) Baptist views. But I would say that that's the great thing about being Baptist - that you have 'soul liberty' to make up your own mind on matters of this nature. I am not an 'obvious Catholic' - last time I bothered to check, I'm not permitted to receive Communion at a Catholic church. Just because someone takes a higher sacramentalist view doesn't make them a Catholic - you'll find most Protestants, including the Methodists to whom you refer, take a higher view than the Zwingliist memorialism many modern Baptists have latterly embraced

 

[J. Jump]

Then you must not write anything other than the scriptures, Full Stop.

Exactly. We must only repeat what Scripture says. If all we have is an opinion of what Scripture says then we can't teach that to others, and others shouldn't believe it until it is proven that it is in line with what Scripture says. Outside of that human error creeps/or stampedes in.

 

[Eliyahu]

Exactly. We must only repeat what Scripture says. If all we have is an opinion of what Scripture says then we can't teach that to others, and others shouldn't believe it until it is proven that it is in line with what Scripture says. Outside of that human error creeps/or stampedes in.

Between you and me, I will keep this in mind.

 

[Matt Black]

I'm still waiting for that retraction, Snoopy.