Will a Christian commit certain sins?

Well just as I had suspected Bro. Bob your "list" texts didn't prove your point any more than anything else you have offered up. Nothing in those texts said that Christian wasn't capable of committing those acts. It just said that those committing those acts would not inherit the kingdom.

So I'm still waiting for proof. Oh yeah and please the text on the sin nature being partially destroyed. I'm still waiting on that one.

 

Sorry J. Jump; but I think you beginning to look silly. I said over and over that which is born of God cannot sin. The flesh is not born of God but it is kept by the Grace of God.

I have explained over and over that John said in one verse that he that says he hath no sin is a liar and that is talking to the flesh and carnal mind.

Later he says that which is born of God cannot sin and that is the inward part, the part that is not the creature but the soul and spirit which has the heart of flesh given by God when it was born again. Now I know you are going to say the soul is not involved but I say it is but for arguments sake, lets just say its the inward part.

Now, if you can't understand that J. Jump; I don't know what to say. It is so simple a 3 year old could be made to understand.

God don't lie and that is what He said by His word.

You make up words that the other was supposed to have said, knowing full well they did not say it. You do it to rile the person, but I got news for you. I never thought in this life time I would hear a man say, that he is capable of molesting His own son, if I understood you right. I could go down town where all the drunks are and they would bust my mouth if I asked them that question, much less say they are capable of it. I am astonished.

 

Sorry HBSMN, but you haven't proven your point either. You all sure like to just jump all over one particular Scripture and try to isolate it from the rest of Scripture. But in just a few verses previous the same "and were some of you . . ." it is also said:

On the contrary, you yourselves wrong and defraud. You do this even to your brethren.

So right here this disproves the no sin at all theory.

But even your isolated text doesn't "prove" your own theory, because the text says nothing about what they were "prior to salvation." That is merely a HBSMN addition to the text. It simply says and were some of you. It doesn't give a time condition on that statement. At best you are assuming "prior to salvation."

Even if your "assumption" is correct there should be another text that an "assumption" doesn't have to be made to clear that up. But you said that I Corinthians 6 was proof even.

So what it boils down to is you want people to believe you have made the correct assumption. Well unfortunately there are folks that will believe you, but I'm not going to believe your "assumption." Sorry it's nothing personal

 

Amy that's not what the text says. The text says will not inherit the kingdom. It doesn't say anything about "going to or not going to heaven."

You are making an incorrect connection. Inheriting the kingdom is not eternal salvation. Eternal salvation is a gift not an inheritance. And I agree with you that we can not lose our eternal salvation. But Scripture never promises us the kingdom unconditionally.

 

J. Jump;
You are just out and out telling false when you post on here that any of us have said a person does not commit any sin. At least tell the truth about us.

Amy; he believe that going to Heaven and inheriting the Kingdom are different things. I think he forgot that Jesus said "I overcome and sat down with my Father in his Kingdom."

 

Amy, you have to look at it with J.Jump's theological glasses. He believes that a person can be Saved eternally, but miss out on the 1000 yr reign. To him that is the Kingdom. If a saved person is saved, but commits these sins, that person gets thrown into Hell temporarily until the 1000 yrs are up, then he can enter into eternity.

I believe I have correctly stated what he believes. If not, please correct me J.Jump. I, of course, disagree with him.

But it helps in this discussion to see where he is coming from.

 

What do you all do with Romans 7?

15I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. 16And if I do what I do not want to do, I agree that the law is good. 17As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is sin living in me. 18I know that nothing good lives in me, that is, in my sinful nature. For I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out. 19For what I do is not the good I want to do; no, the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on doing. 20Now if I do what I do not want to do, it is no longer I who do it, but it is sin living in me that does it.

21So I find this law at work: When I want to do good, evil is right there with me. 22For in my inner being I delight in God's law; 23but I see another law at work in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin at work within my members. 24What a wretched man I am! Who will rescue me from this body of death?

 

It explains itself.
22For in my inner being I delight in God's law;
Here is what God told him;
My Grace is sufficient to keep thee and for your temptation I will make a way for your escape.

 

Just what is the 'and such were some of you', if it was not a prior lifestyle of fornication, idolatry, homosexuality, self mutilation, thieving, coveting, drunkardness, reviling, or extortion before Christ.

Surely you cannot be saying that these acts were committed by Christians!

The word Christian means to be Christ-like. If one thinks that committing these acts is christ-like, I am afraid one is following the wrong christ.

No, they were not Christian when living those lifestyles.

 

Please show me where the flesh is kept by the grace of God.

Okay now we are starting to agree on some things.

Well we can't just say anything for arguments sake we have to go by what Scripture says. And Scripture says the soul isn't saved yet, that it has been separated from the spirit. So no the soul is not invovled. But now we are going to get off into a different subject

Well Bro. Bob I was capable of it before I was saved, and the same sin nature still resides in me so if I am walking in the flesh that sin nature is still capable of doing what it has always been capable of doing.

So either one of two things I didn't have that capability before I was saved or salvation somehow changed my sin nature. Which was is true Bro. Bob? And I'll await your Scripture evidence to either answer.

 

Funny, you say we have to believe what Scripture says. Yet you say one who is saved can spend 1000 years in hell. I cannot find that in the Scripture.

You seem to be double-minded... very unstable.

 

2 Corth. 12:
7: And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.
8: For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me.
9: And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
10: Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.

J. Jump; this scripture answers your first and last questions.

 

And that is why most mistakes in Scripture would be avoided if people would rightly divide the Word instead of trying to combine things that aren't the same thing.

Eternal salvation is a GIFT not an INHERITANCE. Those are not the same thing no matter how you want to slice and dice it. There is no way of getting around that.

That's why you have two majority camps in Christendom. One sees the warnings and says you can lose your salvation while the others ignore the warnings and say oh those people aren't saved. Neither of which are correct.

That's why you have Bro. Bob and HBSMN and others that come up with these wild off the way doctrines because they have to be able to "explain" certain Scriptures that don't make sense when you take the plain reading of them.

When you equate inheriting the kingdom with eternal salvation you are left with only two ways to go either that person loses their salvation or they were never saved in the first place. But Scripture doesn't support either one of these.

 

Well, you sure have a lot of support for this one J. Jump.

Sure it does but that is another subject.

 

Again "your" addition "before Christ." That text does not say "before Christ."

No because I believe like your definition below Christian means Christ-like. So these were not Christians when they committed these acts, but not all "saved" people are Christ-like. You can see that on this board, and unfortunately I am guilty as anyone else having displayed some non-Christ-like behavior that I'm not proud of.

I would agree.

But salvation is not about being a Christian. Salvation is believing on Jesus as the Lamb of God Who died and shed His blood on my behalf a sinner.

Whether or not I am a follower/disciple/Christian is a matter of walk not salvation. And a correct "walk" is never guaranteed in Scripture.

 

And when you say the saved will spend 1000 years in hell, you are adding to the Scripture that which is not there. Very dangerous.

 

HBSMN here we go with your accusations again. We have had plenty of conversations and plenty of Scripture has been given. You just choose for whatever reason not to believe. And that is between you and God. You will not have to answer to me, and if you feel confident to stand before your Judge with what you believe now then who am I to say otherwise.

As for me I will take Scripture at it's word!

 

Bro. Bob seriously . . . this text doesn't say anything about the flesh being kept by the grace of God. Paul said he has a throne in the flesh as asked God to remove it three times. God denied his request and told him that His grace was sufficient for Paul to make it through having a thorn in the flesh. That doesn't say anything about man's flesh being kept by grace.

It means that whatever our throne in the flesh is it doesn't have to overtake us because God's grace is sufficient for us. That doesn't mean that we take advantage of it.

You are all over the place Bro. Bob.