God created natural law. Will God ever violate the laws he created?
If so, what does this say about God?
If not, what does this say about God?
If so, what does this say about God?
If not, what does this say about God?
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Will God Violate Natural Law?
- Thread starter Crabtownboy
- Start date
webdog said:
Are they really violations of natural laws, or is it we just do not know everything about natural laws?
Now I am curious, if, as you say, God violates natural laws, what does this say about him?
Yes and yesCrabtownboy said:
We don't know everything about natural laws, but we also know that miracles do violate the natural laws we have knowledge on. For instance, a jar of water cannot be turned into an aged wine naturally. It's impossible. Man also cannot walk on liquid, another violation of natural law...yet there are recorded instances of both (among many, many more such miracles.)
I guess it depends, what natural law. Weather, earthquakes, etc?
I don't believe He does. Why create those things if He isn't going to allow them to run their course.
This is not to say there are no mircles, such as people being healed, or the money coming just in time, etc.
But I think theres a difference.
What does it say about God, I don't know I'd have to give it some thought.
I guess it's a good question, but we may never really know for sure.
I don't believe He does. Why create those things if He isn't going to allow them to run their course.
This is not to say there are no mircles, such as people being healed, or the money coming just in time, etc.
But I think theres a difference.
What does it say about God, I don't know I'd have to give it some thought.
I guess it's a good question, but we may never really know for sure.
Last edited by a moderator:
When you ask the question, "if, as you say, God violates natural laws, what does this say about him?" are you thinking that natural laws are rules of some sort?
I'd just think that natural laws are normative things. They come from our observations about what happens in the universe.
That God would, in a supernatural way, turn the natural laws on their head, so that, for instance, he brings life from death, show that creation is subservient to God. It does what he tells it to do. He is it's master. It also shows that he is always involved in his creation. He is not just a watchmaker who makes a watch, winds it up, and leaves it to run. He is the one who runs his creation.
I'd just think that natural laws are normative things. They come from our observations about what happens in the universe.
That God would, in a supernatural way, turn the natural laws on their head, so that, for instance, he brings life from death, show that creation is subservient to God. It does what he tells it to do. He is it's master. It also shows that he is always involved in his creation. He is not just a watchmaker who makes a watch, winds it up, and leaves it to run. He is the one who runs his creation.
canadyjd
Well-Known Member
I don't think the term "violate" conveys the truth of what happens with miracles. I would say that God "suspends" natural laws to accomplish His purposes, which is usually to reveal to us an important truth about Himself.
What does it say about God? He is God....the Creator and Sustainer of all things.
What does that say about us? We ought to spend more time on our knees in reverence and awe of our Mighty God.
peace to youraying:
What does it say about God? He is God....the Creator and Sustainer of all things.
What does that say about us? We ought to spend more time on our knees in reverence and awe of our Mighty God.
peace to you
raying:Crabtownboy said:
NO.:thumbs:
Natural law is so named by men, not God. If there is natural law, and it is commanded by God, why isn't it so stated by God in the Bible?. What is natural is as it is suppose to be, according to the way God made it. God didn't seem to follow any rules for creation. he could have just as easily made man by speaking him in to existance but instead He put man together with His own Hands.
If God heals someone He didn't go against Him self because God is not what we might call natural, nor is He subject to the laws of what He has made. God is the creator and all things are subject to Him.
MB
If God heals someone He didn't go against Him self because God is not what we might call natural, nor is He subject to the laws of what He has made. God is the creator and all things are subject to Him.
MB
Jos 10:12 Then Joshua spoke to the LORD in the day when the LORD delivered up the Amorites before the children of Israel, and he said in the sight of Israel: "Sun, stand still over Gibeon; And Moon, in the Valley of Aijalon."
Jos 10:13 So the sun stood still, And the moon stopped, Till the people had revenge Upon their enemies. [Is] this not written in the Book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and did not hasten to go [down] for about a whole day.
Since God created everything that was created, including the laws that govern the creation, He can do anything He pleases with it.
God is SUPERnatural. :thumbs:
Jos 10:13 So the sun stood still, And the moon stopped, Till the people had revenge Upon their enemies. [Is] this not written in the Book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and did not hasten to go [down] for about a whole day.
Since God created everything that was created, including the laws that govern the creation, He can do anything He pleases with it.
God is SUPERnatural. :thumbs:
Crabtownboy said:
Will he? Yep; unless he is going to let the universe expand for billions of years, let the sun become a red giant and evaporate the earth's water and kill all life, ....
It says either he is above the law or else his is an outlaw.
If he will not violate natural laws, he may as well not exist and we have no afterlife.
Tom Butler
New Member
There's an old hymn called "Master, the Tempest is Raging."
The chorus says:
The wind and the waves all obey his voice.
I think we can't say God violates natural law, but on occasion he over-rides it.
We are probably about to enter a discussion on the Myanmar cylcone, and it's predicted 100,00 deaths. The question will be, if God controls the weather, why didn't he stop this one?
The chorus says:
The wind and the waves all obey his voice.
I think we can't say God violates natural law, but on occasion he over-rides it.
We are probably about to enter a discussion on the Myanmar cylcone, and it's predicted 100,00 deaths. The question will be, if God controls the weather, why didn't he stop this one?
As I understand it, there is no sacredness to the laws of nature. In any case, violating them is actually unnecessary for something to occur that we humans would call miraculous. What if you told someone in the middle ages, that a man would be taken to walk on the moon on a metal ship with no wings?
God's ability is much greater than our own. Working within or without the laws of nature, we probably wouldn't know the difference. After all, we don't really know what the laws of nature are, just a little bit here and there about them.
I question this. Are death and distruction "laws"? There are things in the universe, I believe, that can neither be killed nor destroyed. How do they avoid it? Or do you suppose angels die? Perhaps they restore their bodies faster, or their flesh is not of a kind that can be blow or ripped apart, subsisting of some form of energy perhaps.
It's all very interesting to think about, but who knows. One thing I think is for sure, death is only a law for US.
God's ability is much greater than our own. Working within or without the laws of nature, we probably wouldn't know the difference. After all, we don't really know what the laws of nature are, just a little bit here and there about them.
I question this. Are death and distruction "laws"? There are things in the universe, I believe, that can neither be killed nor destroyed. How do they avoid it? Or do you suppose angels die? Perhaps they restore their bodies faster, or their flesh is not of a kind that can be blow or ripped apart, subsisting of some form of energy perhaps.
It's all very interesting to think about, but who knows. One thing I think is for sure, death is only a law for US.
JustChristian
New Member
Crabtownboy said:
Personally, I don't believe that God created natural laws. God created the universe. Natural laws are discovered by man through his observation of how God's universe works or through mathematics and deductive reasoning. But natural laws change as man understands more about God's universe. In Hippocrates' time it was believed that the human body was filled with four basic substances, called four humours which are in balance when a person is healthy. All diseases and disabilities resulted from an excess or deficit of one of these four humors. The four humors were identified as black bile, yellow bile, phlegm, and blood. With the advent of modern medicine in the 19th century completely different laws about the human body were developed. Similarly, it was once thought that the earth was the center of the universe and everything revolved around it.
Einstein showed that the accepted laws of Newton didn't hold at speeds approaching the speed of light and that matter can be converted into energy.
In these cases and many more accepted natural laws changed with new information. I don't believe that God changed the laws. I believe that man discovered more about them.
I don't think we'll ever discover the completely accurate natural laws. To do so would be to completely understand (at least part of) God's ways. Is God bound by His own laws of how His universe operates? To me that would be a subset of the question of whether He changes or changes His mind. I'll leave that up to you.