Women Preachers

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Yup, you do speak the truth but that does not mean personal experience should not be introduced & evaluated.

 

[BobinKy]

Hmm....still see no one from the egalitarian side has presented a Scriptural argument for their position.

As I said before in this thread, read chapter 20 of the gospel of John.

...Bob

 

[Crabtownboy]

For those who oppose a woman preaching how do you interprete the following:

Joel 2:28 “And afterward,
I will pour out my Spirit on all people.
Your sons and daughters will prophesy,
your old men will dream dreams,
your young men will see visions.

ACT 2:16 But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel;
*

ACT 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
*

ACT 2:18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:

To prophesy means to preach. Dictionary.com gives the following definitions:

to speak as a mediator between god and humankind or in God's stead.

Archaic . to teach religious subjects.

 

[preacher4truth]

Yup, you do speak the truth but that does not mean personal experience should not be introduced & evaluated.

I think I just evaluated its worth.

:tongue3:

 

[preacher4truth]

For those who oppose a woman preaching how do you interprete the following:
To prophesy means to preach. Dictionary.com gives the following definitions:

to speak as a mediator between god and humankind or in God's stead.

Archaic . to teach religious subjects.

Are you using this Scripture to prove women pastors are biblical? If not let me know. Also, when was this fulfilled?

 

[thegospelgeek]

For those who oppose a woman preaching how do you interprete the following:





To prophesy means to preach. Dictionary.com gives the following definitions:

to speak as a mediator between god and humankind or in God's stead.

Archaic . to teach religious subjects.

My wife quite often speaks the counsel of God when she talks to others about Christ. Annsni has done quite well speaking the counsel of God in this thread. The word prophecy can mean speaking the counsel oF God or it can mean exercise the gift of prophecy. It can be as bold as proclaiming a predictive word of God such as Elijah or as simple as telling someone God loves them according to God's word. The word does not necessarily mean 'preaching' as many say it does.

If you apply the preaching or Prophetic office as the meaning here, then you contridict other scripture, which is what the goal is in your post.

Then we must decide which scripture we misunderstand. Since the prophecy can mean something that does not violate another scripture and we have to "rassel" the other scripture to get them to fit if we say that prophecy is preaching, I think the answer is obvious.

 

[go2church]

Ok my post is so far back that it really is not much use in posting now, I'll try and catch this train next time it comes around.

 

[thegospelgeek]

As I said before in this thread, read chapter 20 of the gospel of John.

...Bob

Sorry, but I must be misunderstanding something. Read John 20 and do not see the connection.

 

[Jerome]

From the closing paragraphs of Charles Spurgeon's sermon of Sunday morning, Jan. 26, 1868:

I feel it no small privilege to be the means of bearing God’s message to this congregation. It pleases me when I know that many grey-headed believers, who know far more of experimental truth than I can be supposed to know, have nevertheless been comforted by the message which my Master has sent to them by me. But what an honor to have a message to the apostles! Oh, the power of grace! Mary, once a demoniac, becomes a preacher to preachers! I dub her Doctor of Divinity indeed, for she has to instruct these mightiest of messengers in the faith.
Note the message. Did ever man preach a better sermon than this woman preached? . . . . I shall leave the matter in the hands of the Holy Spirit. May the Lord raise many a Mary Magdalene in the midst of this church, for his name’s sake. Amen.

 

[preachinjesus]

As I said before in this thread, read chapter 20 of the gospel of John.

Show me where the office is given. I don't say women can't preach. Preaching doesn't equal pastoring. Though pastors do preach. There is an office issue there.

Again show me where, even here where a local church office is given. Your passage is superfluous at best.

 

[BobinKy]

Show me where the office is given. I don't say women can't preach. Preaching doesn't equal pastoring. Though pastors do preach. There is an office issue there.

Again show me where, even here where a local church office is given. Your passage is superfluous at best.

I do not have much time right now, but I will say a few words. If you are still interested, I will make another post this evening.

The English word "office" does not appear in the New Testament of the King James Bible, according to The Strongest Strong's Concordance of the Bible (James Strong, Zondervan, 2001, p. 1120).

The word "office" does appear one time in the New Testament of the NIV 1984 translation at Hebrews 7:23, according to The Strongest NIV Exhaustive Concordance (Edward Goodrick & John Kohlenberger III, Zondervan, 1999, p. 819). However, this one occurence of the word "office" is not in the Greek manuscripts upon which the NIV 1984 is based.

Therefore, since my time is short, would you please take the next step and define the word "office" in your post above. And I will get back with you tonight.

...Bob

 

[preachinjesus]

Positions of authority within the local church.

 

[quantumfaith]

Perhaps someone has already considered this, but is there any possibility, exegetically speaking, that Paul is speaking of his own personal proclivities from his "jewishness" regarding women and their role? I do recall, somewhere else, in one of his letters, he made a point to say that it was "Paul" speaking and not the "command of God" (dont recall where that is)

I must say, personally, I am much more "comfortable" with male pastor/preachers, but honestly dont know if that is cultural or spiritual.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

After over 20 years with the PCUSA, having to work through & with Female Pastors, Im very uncomfortable with the suggestion of going back to it. Thats only my own comfort level though.

 

[Old Union Brother]

I think that the scripture that you are looking for is in 1 Corinthians:
7:6 But I speak this by permission, and not of commandment. and then in7:12 But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away.

These scriptures are on a whole other topic.

 

[jaigner]

One even went as far as telling us how wise it is to give the people what they want as far as in what we teach, and how wise it is to do such. Not here, and not in todays church, will I, for one, scratch ears, but will seek out God's direction, not mans. This attitude is unbelieveable. It's called scratching itching ears v. preaching the Word and seeking God's direction above all else.

Who said this? I don't think there's anyone here saying we should scratch ears. I certainly don't. But that doesn't mean I think all my interpretations are right. I'm sure some of them are wrong, but it's still where I feel led on the issues.

We say sola scriptura, but at the end of the day, it is some persons lives that are used as authority, thus, sola scriptura is not adhered to.

The doctrine of sola scriptura does not mean that we read the Bible and apply without contextual interpretation. The reformers didn't do that. No good theologian does that, either. Reading biblical text without seeing the need to interpret according to historical context or general revelation is called nuda scriptura, and nude Scripture is dangerous Scripture. So everyone interprets. And the ring of truth coming out of Paul's context and other input from the Bible is that there was no overarching eternal command that women be silent for all eternity.

 

[jaigner]

I must say, personally, I am much more "comfortable" with male pastor/preachers, but honestly dont know if that is cultural or spiritual.

This is an excellent point. I grew up with a supposedly complementarian set of parents, in an SBC church that gave women no actual authority. I was taught to mock and judge egalitarian believers because it was so obvious that they were wrong.

Well, fast forward to grad school when I was studying theology at a well-known evangelical college. Suddenly, I find out that there are many who were otherwise like-minded, but disagreed with me on one or two or three doctrinal points. I became convicted that some of my beliefs and, even worse, my judgmental attitude toward others, were wrong.

And this is one of those things I moved on. Through careful study and prayer, over several years, I felt led to turn around on this issue. My realization at the time was this: "I grew up with male leadership and I'm comfortable with male leadership, but I can't get there from the text."

At that point, I had no choice but to turn over the beliefs that my cold hands were grasping and let the Spirit lead me. So that's why I'm movable on these issues.

 

[quantumfaith]

I think that the scripture that you are looking for is in 1 Corinthians:
7:6 But I speak this by permission, and not of commandment. and then in7:12 But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away.

These scriptures are on a whole other topic.

Thanks OUB, I knew they referenced another topic, my question was, is it exegetically possible that a similar property might apply in this given situation?

 

[quantumfaith]

This is an excellent point. I grew up with a supposedly complementarian set of parents, in an SBC church that gave women no actual authority. I was taught to mock and judge egalitarian believers because it was so obvious that they were wrong.

Well, fast forward to grad school when I was studying theology at a well-known evangelical college. Suddenly, I find out that there are many who were otherwise like-minded, but disagreed with me on one or two or three doctrinal points. I became convicted that some of my beliefs and, even worse, my judgmental attitude toward others, were wrong.

And this is one of those things I moved on. Through careful study and prayer, over several years, I felt led to turn around on this issue. My realization at the time was this: "I grew up with male leadership and I'm comfortable with male leadership, but I can't get there from the text."

At that point, I had no choice but to turn over the beliefs that my cold hands were grasping and let the Spirit lead me. So that's why I'm movable on these issues.

Thanks for you honesty!!!!!!

 

[quantumfaith]

Who said this? I don't think there's anyone here saying we should scratch ears. I certainly don't. But that doesn't mean I think all my interpretations are right. I'm sure some of them are wrong, but it's still where I feel led on the issues.



The doctrine of sola scriptura does not mean that we read the Bible and apply without contextual interpretation. The reformers didn't do that. No good theologian does that, either. Reading biblical text without seeing the need to interpret according to historical context or general revelation is called nuda scriptura, and nude Scripture is dangerous Scripture. So everyone interprets. And the ring of truth coming out of Paul's context and other input from the Bible is that there was no overarching eternal command that women be silent for all eternity.

:thumbs::thumbs::thumbs: