Is Irresistible Grace "resistible"?

[The Archangel]

Unbelievable, you would correct the very words of our Lord Jesus Christ when he was telling Nicodemus how to be saved. This is arrogance to it's extreme! Too bad you Calvinists weren't there to tell Jesus how to properly present the gospel. Incredible pride and arrogance!

Personal attack; nothing of substance. How unfortunately typical.

Hmmm......You do know that those "words in red" are actually editor's marks and they words in red are not inspired...right?

In fact, there is no consensus on where Jesus stops talking and where John begins (again) to narrate.

The Archangel

 

[preacher4truth]

So you are saying there is no salvation by grace through faith anywhere in John 3:16? What is God's love? What did He give the world? What is required to receive eternal life?

I have yet to meet a person who has no idea who Jesus is / was in this day and age.

Funny, I met many people in Cleveland among the diverse groups that are there that have never heard. So has Alistair Begg.

Did I say that other stuff you question me on? Uh, no.

I told you what the Gospel is. Get it straight. It's right there listed out for you plainly in Scriptures.

 

[preacher4truth]

Personal attack; nothing of substance. How unfortunately typical.

Hmmm......You do know that those "words in red" are actually editor's marks and they words in red are not inspired...right?

In fact, there is no consensus on where Jesus stops talking and where John begins (again) to narrate.

The Archangel

lol...called arrogant for showing plainly what the Gospel is, even where it can be found.

It gets really briary and thistely here among the brethren, when trying to gather fruit, even when talking of the Gospel.

Amazing and shameful aint it?

 

[quantumfaith]

Personal attack; nothing of substance. How unfortunately typical.

Hmmm......You do know that those "words in red" are actually editor's marks and they words in red are not inspired...right?

In fact, there is no consensus on where Jesus stops talking and where John begins (again) to narrate.

The Archangel

So does this mean whether Winman is correct or incorrect requires consensus? And BTW, I dont know with certainty whether he is or not.

 

[preacher4truth]

Verses 3 - 8 were the first creeds passed on verbally (statement of faith) through the early church, it is not the Gospel message. If it were, only the 500+ people who saw Christ post resurrection know the true Gospel, and faith in Peter, James, Paul and 500 people are needed to be saved in addition to His death burial and resurrection.

I use that he was seen, with the pure Gospel. Nothing wrong with that.

I told you plainly what it is. And you want to fight over it.

Unreal.

 

[webdog]

Funny, I met many people in Cleveland among the diverse groups that are there that have never heard. So has Alistair Begg.

...that never heard the Gospel, or have no idea who this Jesus person is in history?

Did I say that other stuff you question me on? Uh, no.

That's right...because I said them as questions to you. You state there is no salvation by grace through faith found in John 3:16. Depending on how you answer what I posed, I think we will find it

I told you what the Gospel is. Get it straight. It's right there listed out for you plainly in Scriptures.

...and I commented on that post that a church creed is not the Gospel.

 

[webdog]

I use that he was seen, with the pure Gospel. Nothing wrong with that.

I told you plainly what it is. And you want to fight over it.

Unreal.

Don't be so defensive...unfold your arms This is a debate site. If you only want people to agree with you, it's probably not going to happen here (or most places). Understand people aren't fighting you, but a position held by you.

It is in error to use 1 Corinthians 15:3-8 as the Gospel, as I pointed out.

 

[preacher4truth]

...that never heart the Gospel, or have no idea who this Jesus person is in history?
That's right...because I said them as questions to you. You state there is no salvation by grace through faith found in John 3:16. Depending on how you answer what I posed, I think we will find it
...and I commented on that post that a church creed is not the Gospel.

I never said, nor stated, that there is no salvation by grace through faith, in that verse. That untruth is coming from you and you alone friend. I have never said that. Now you resort to saying things I have never said?

I told you where the Gospel is, get it straight.

Paul says plainly he is declaring the Gospel, you say he is not. Hmmmm.

 

[The Archangel]

So does this mean whether Winman is correct or incorrect requires consensus? And BTW, I dont know with certainty whether he is or not.

No, not at all.

Like basing a doctrine only on the [disputed] longer ending of Mark, basing one's idea of the Gospel solely on Jesus' words, especially when it is disputed if these are Jesus' words or John's narration, is not helpful. This practice sets up a false dichotomy between the words of Jesus and the rest of the Scripture. The scripture is the scripture; it is a whole. It is not divided against itself.

The Archangel

 

[webdog]

I never said, nor stated, that there is no salvation by grace through faith, in that verse. That untruth is coming from you and you alone friend. I have never said that. Now you resort to saying things I have never said?

I told you where the Gospel is, get it straight.

Maybe you didn't mean it, but actually you did...

Me:
OK...salvation by grace through faith is not found in John 3:16 :BangHead:
You:
Neither is the Death, Burial and Resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ, which is the Gospel.

 

[preacher4truth]

Maybe you didn't mean it, but actually you did...

Me:
OK...salvation by grace through faith is not found in John 3:16 :BangHead:
You:
Neither is the Death, Burial and Resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ, which is the Gospel.

Correct. Neither are found there.

I was simply agreeing with you. Saying and quoting me as saying is outright a misrepresentation of facts and me.

:wavey:

 

[glfredrick]

Unbelievable, you would correct the very words of our Lord Jesus Christ when he was telling Nicodemus how to be saved. This is arrogance to it's extreme! Too bad you Calvinists weren't there to tell Jesus how to properly present the gospel. Incredible pride and arrogance!

The conversation with Nicodemus was not just the verse we now know as John 3:16. Jesus started a tad earlier and went on a tad longer. Perhaps you should take up and read... :thumbs:

 

[webdog]

Paul says plainly he is declaring the Gospel, you say he is not. Hmmmm.

You edited your post after my reply...
What did Paul say? "For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received..."

What is he delivering that he received? The creed (statement of faith) of the church. http://carm.org/questions/about-jesus/1-cor-153-4-demonstrates-creed-too-early-legend-corrupt

 

[glfredrick]

You are not going to get anywhere with these Calvinists Amy, they think they know everything and everybody else is an idiot. And most would argue with a fencepost.

Still waiting on one person named Winman to respond to my earlier post...

 

[webdog]

Correct. Neither are found there.

I was simply agreeing with you. Saying and quoting me as saying is outright a misrepresentation of facts and me.

:wavey:

You are making my head spin. You said "I never said, nor stated, that there is no salvation by grace through faith, in that verse."

I show where you said just that.

You agree again in this post it is not found in the verse.

...yet you say I misrepresent you.

I'm glad I'm sitting or I'd probably pass out...

 

[preacher4truth]

The Gospel is plainly given in 1 Corinthians 15. It cannot be any more plain. Paul even tells us he is declaring it to us.

Also, this same Gospel was preached in Acts, to the churches, and the Apostles were even mocked when coming to the resurrection part. Christ was plainly shown as the One who was crucified and died, that He was buried, and that He rose from the dead. What Peter preached to the saving of souls was the Gospel. This was the message preached to the churches, it is descriptive in Acts and shows pure Gospel preaching and in turn establishing of churches by the power of teh Gospel.

This message is the power of God. Jesus died, was buried, and rose again.

Not one person in Acts preached "For God so loved the world." Instead they told the brutal story of the Gospel, and ended the message with our great hope, the Resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Any other "gospel" is not the "Gospel" and is a water-down paraphrase. John 3:16 is not the Gospel. It doesn't contain nor comment upon the truth that Jesus would die, was buried, and rose again.

If you want to call me arrogant and whatever else for that, then go for it.

I'm not ashamed of the Gospel, and I know what it in fact is.

 

[preacher4truth]

You edited your post after my reply...
What did Paul say? "For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received..."

What is he delivering that he received? The creed (statement of faith) of the church. http://carm.org/questions/about-jesus/1-cor-153-4-demonstrates-creed-too-early-legend-corrupt

He is declaring to them the Gospel. Hilarious you leave that word out.

Creed or not, it was and is the Gospel. If someone came to me to have me explain it, I would take them there, and tell them the same message those in Acts told others: that is that He died, was buried, and rose again. That there is good news. That is what they preached and what I preach.

I'm done arguing with you about it. When shown plainly what it is you fight. It was preached in Acts, and to the churches and is as plain as day.

Oh, and by the way, Paul said it was also what he had preached to them. It's not just a creed but they certainly MAY have made a creed out of the Gospel.

He also said what he was declaring to them was what they did stand upon. They certainly weren't standing on a "creed" they instead stood upon the Gospel that he was declaring in those words in 1 Corinthians 15, and this was the same message he had preached unto them.



- Blessings

 

[Winman]

Still waiting on one person named Winman to respond to my earlier post...

I honestly don't know which particular post you are speaking of, I answered several and quoted you so you would know I was responding to you, just as I'm doing now.

 

[preacher4truth]

Unbelievable, you would correct the very words of our Lord Jesus Christ when he was telling Nicodemus how to be saved. This is arrogance to it's extreme! Too bad you Calvinists weren't there to tell Jesus how to properly present the gospel. Incredible pride and arrogance!

You stated in this same thread in response to me, that the Gospel is the death burial and resurrection (#236) to which you now say I am correcting His Words by claiming the same Gospel as what you said it was? You also got huffy about it because I asked you over and over again to tell me what it was.

Oh, lest you forget, it's not John 3:16.

lol...

:wavey:

 

[Rippon]

I have yet to meet a person who has no idea who Jesus is / was in this day and age.

Read my post numbered 233.

Besides, just going by your anecdotal experiences is not a good gauge of reality. You have probably not met with representative people from a number of third world countries. And of couse you haven't traveled back in time to various nations which for centuries have not heard the Word of God.It is a fact that many now and in the past have never heard the Gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ.