preacher4truth
Active Member
Yep. Amen. Question it in a snide way too. Ridiculous.
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God's Devil
- Thread starter Luke2427
- Start date
Yep. Amen. Question it in a snide way too. Ridiculous.
Robert Snow
New Member
Not even close Robert. For you to even state this shows you are a non-thinker...
This is funny coming from one that apparently worships at Calvin's feet.
Before you blow a gasket, I am using hyperbole (quite a task for a non-thinker).
preacher4truth
Active Member
blow a gasket, I am
Well, calm down then, no need to blow a gasket Robert!
:thumbs:
Robert Snow
New Member
Well, calm down then, no need to blow a gasket Robert!
:thumbs:
You may find that us non-Calvinist operate under less pressure than you Calvinists do; we don't think it is the goal of the church to convert everyone to Calvinism. :tongue3:
It was absolutely necessary for God to withdraw his goodness from Adam in order for Adam to be able to sin.
God removed His goodness from Adam before he sinned?
Is this what you really meant to say?
So Luke, in what ways are you more hyper than Spurgeon?
Not much. I have loved Spurgeon for 15 years.
Spurgeon had as much to do with bringing me to the truth on these matters as anyone- except Edwards.
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God removed His goodness from Adam before he sinned?
Is this what you really meant to say?
No, Sis. God planned it. The only other alternative is to say that he could not have stopped it or was surprised by it.
God could have made Adam and the serpent and Lucifer and the universe in such a way that Adam would never choose to sin.
But he didn't.
Knowing what would come to pass if he made Adam the way he did and Lucifer the way he did and the serpent the way he did- knowing full well what would come to pass- he went right ahead and made them exactly that way.
What does that tell you?
Luke:
I'm dropping this after this post, for it is not a worthwhile use of time. But respectfully, I would encourage you to be cautious in your language. At best you are imprecise and unintentionally contraictory. Many times you are dancing on the brink of heresy. The bolded portion above is enough to get you excommunicated, while the unbolded portion is on much more solid ground theologically.
For the sake of your soul, be very cautious and careful in the statements you are making. This is very serious, and not a debate game. While you are starting on solid ground, in your zeal to glorify God you are extending past orthodoxy. For your own sake, I would encourage you to voluntarily silence yourself until you are more clear about what is heresy and what is orthodox.
My prayer is that you are Christian, and are just merely imprecise and unclear, and are not lost. But I cannot tell from your statements, for they dance back and forth across the line. Be cautious, my friend.
I'm done here.
My thinking is that you are quite mistaken. It is quite orthodox.
Read what Gill says of Colossians 1:17
and by him all things consist; he upholds all things by the word of his power; the heavens have their stability and continuance from him; the pillars of the earth are bore up by him, otherwise that and the inhabitants of it would be dissolved; the angels in heaven are confirmed in their estate by him, and have their standing and security in him; the elector God are in his hands, and are his peculiar care and charge, and therefore shall never perish; yea, all mankind live and move, and have their being in him; the whole frame of nature would burst asunder and break in pieces, was it not held together by him; every created being has its support from him, and its consistence in him; and all the affairs of Providence relating to all creatures are governed, directed, and managed by him, in conjunction with the Father and the blessed Spirit.
Calvinism sounded like heresy to me before I thought it through. I think this is where you are on this particular matter. It is shocking to you because you have not thought it through this far.
Here is another verse and John MacArthur on the matter:
Hebrews 1:2-3 …in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom
also He made the world. And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and
upholds all things by the word of His power. It is the work of its Creator that keeps the universe in its order and form.
John MacArthur writes,
He quite literally holds all things together. He is the power
behind every consistency in the universe. He is gravity and
centrifugal and centripetal force. He is the One who keeps
all the entities in space in their motion. He is the energy of
the universe.7
The only alternative to this is that there are beings which have power aside from that which is God's.
Adam had his own power.
This is not possible because Adam is not eternal.
ALL POWER that has ever or will ever exist is God's.
In HIM we live and MOVE and have our being.
That is the Word of God. In God Adam moved that fateful day.
By HIM all things consist. God held together the muscle fibers and sinew that brought the forbidden fruit to the mouth of Adam.
For of HIM and THROUGH HIM and TO HIM are all things- Rom. 11:36
Of God was that fateful event.
Through God was that fateful event.
To God was that fateful event.
That is the Word of God.
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psalms109:31
Active Member
Cherub
I was just looking over the internet studying being anointed as a cherub and came across this site
http://www.heaven.net.nz/answers/answer15.htm
There is other ways of thinking of satan "God's puppet" as some have suggested. I just want you to see the other side of the fence, since my communication skill is not good enough.
I was just looking over the internet studying being anointed as a cherub and came across this site
http://www.heaven.net.nz/answers/answer15.htm
There is other ways of thinking of satan "God's puppet" as some have suggested. I just want you to see the other side of the fence, since my communication skill is not good enough.
Did God give man a choice as to whether or not to sin? Yes.
Is God sovereign? Yes.
I find it arrogant of some to think that somehow they can explain such a great mystery. Just admit you can't...and quit digging. The hole's getting bigger, as you accuse God of more and more bizarre things.
It's OK to say, "I don't know how to explain it." Some of you, obviously, haven't translated that phrase into your lexicon. I encourage you to do so. It's not that painful.
Is God sovereign? Yes.
I find it arrogant of some to think that somehow they can explain such a great mystery. Just admit you can't...and quit digging. The hole's getting bigger, as you accuse God of more and more bizarre things.
It's OK to say, "I don't know how to explain it." Some of you, obviously, haven't translated that phrase into your lexicon. I encourage you to do so. It's not that painful.
I was just looking over the internet studying being anointed as a cherub and came across this site
http://www.heaven.net.nz/answers/answer15.htm
There is other ways of thinking of satan "God's puppet" as some have suggested. I just want you to see the other side of the fence, since my communication skill is not good enough.
I read it Brother. It is not very scholarly.
His argument works like this:
Evil is not a created thing (btw, that is Augustine's argument and he ought to give credit there. Instead he seems to take credit for the thought.)
Evil is just the absence of good.
That is correct.
Is evil eternal? NO. The only things that are eternal are those things that are in God- love, goodness, power, etc...
Evil is not in God, so evil is not eternal- therefore evil had a beginning.
Now put it together. Evil= the absence of good. Evil had a beginning.
What had to happen for evil to exist, to begin?
Good had to vacate some space so that evil could exist. If good did not vacate, then evil could not exist; just as if light does not vacate, darkness cannot exist.
But where there is NO light- there is DARKNESS.
And where there is no good- there is evil.
So what did God do concerning evil when He vacated his goodness in a certain space.
Remember, evil is the absence of good.
With that in mind, what did God do when he caused his goodness to be absent from a place?
Hint: What is your relationship to darkness when you turn off the light?
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Did God give man a choice as to whether or not to sin? Yes.
Is God sovereign? Yes.
I find it arrogant of some to think that somehow they can explain such a great mystery. Just admit you can't...and quit digging. The hole's getting bigger, as you accuse God of more and more bizarre things.
It's OK to say, "I don't know how to explain it." Some of you, obviously, haven't translated that phrase into your lexicon. I encourage you to do so. It's not that painful.
The Bible explains it. Hebrews 6:1 reminds us: Therefore let us leave the elementary doctrine of Christ and go on to maturity...
There is nothing noble about being theologically shallow.
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There is nothing noble about being theologically shallow.
And there's nothing noble about pretending that you can explain every mystery of God with a finite mind.
And there's nothing noble about pretending that you can explain every mystery of God with a finite mind.
Therefore let us leave the elementary doctrine of Christ and go on to maturity...
Fine, Luke. Thanks for figuring everything out. I bow to your superior wisdom.
You'll be bored in Heaven, because you've managed to learn everything here...but oh well.
Have fun. No sense discussing an issue with someone who knows everything.
Bell, what you just did was tell all of us who are either Arminian or Calvinist that we are arrogant for thinking we can figure this thing out. You told us to stop digging.
Your post undermines every great soteriology on earth whether Arminian, Biblical Dispensationalist, Molinist or Calvinist. It insinuates that everybody who takes a position is arrogant. It even purports that all who even TRY to figure out these things are arrogant. That is incorrect and offensive.
If we listened to you we would just remain theological babies.
We are supposed to dig and learn as much about God as we can. His Word requires much digging to uncover some of its finest treasures.
There are some things that we will never fully know. There are some things we CAN know. Those things we ought to TRY to know. Doing so honors God.
Therefore let us leave the elementary doctrine of Christ and go on to maturity...
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psalms109:31
Active Member
Scripture
Sin didn't start with God, it started with Lucifer.
God created him perfect, sin was not created in him it was found. When we worship what was created like ourselves over the creator who is blessed forever amen. Lucifer was ordained, anointed to be a cherub a guardian, not what he had become.
God could of created us differently, but he didn't for it is not His will to create a being without a choice.
God has set before us life and death, so choose life and live.
Sin didn't start with God, it started with Lucifer.
God created him perfect, sin was not created in him it was found. When we worship what was created like ourselves over the creator who is blessed forever amen. Lucifer was ordained, anointed to be a cherub a guardian, not what he had become.
God could of created us differently, but he didn't for it is not His will to create a being without a choice.
God has set before us life and death, so choose life and live.
psalms109:31
Active Member
Maturity
Maturity is going into righteousness, not forgetting the basic that got us where we are. To be an example to the world, the light in the darkness.
Maturity, not many can be a Paul. To not do something so that it will not make my weak brother stumble. A concern more for others than ourselves
Maturity is going into righteousness, not forgetting the basic that got us where we are. To be an example to the world, the light in the darkness.
Maturity, not many can be a Paul. To not do something so that it will not make my weak brother stumble. A concern more for others than ourselves
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quantumfaith
Active Member
Sin didn't start with God, it started with Lucifer.
God created him perfect, sin was not created in him it was found. When we worship what was created like ourselves over the creator who is blessed forever amen. Lucifer was ordained, anointed to be a cherub a guardian, not what he had become.
God could of created us differently, but he didn't for it is not His will to create a being without a choice.
God has set before us life and death, so choose life and live.
What a wonderful nugget. Thanks.
Sin didn't start with God, it started with Lucifer.
You are wrong, based on the teaching of brother Luke. God is the cause of all things. God caused sin. God created sin to show that He is all powerful. Without an enemy, God could not show that. God is the cause of sin, please do not forget it.