http://www.bpnews.net/BPnews.asp?ID=37417
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No surprise here.
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Is the CBF poised for a shift on homosexuality?
- Thread starter mandym
- Start date
http://www.bpnews.net/BPnews.asp?ID=37417
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No surprise here.
Michael Wrenn
New Member
If the CBF changes its policy, I will withdraw my support.
One thing that will never change in the CAC (my Communion) while I'm alive is our stance on this, abortion, and other moral issues. They cannot and will not be voted on.
One thing that will never change in the CAC (my Communion) while I'm alive is our stance on this, abortion, and other moral issues. They cannot and will not be voted on.
From post # 1 ...in protest of the Southern Baptist Convention's return to orthodox theology.
This is a little off OP - but the above statement is the correct statement. Usually, it is stated as the Conservative TAKEOVER.
And actually, this is the whole point - we must return and remain in the fundamentals of Biblical truth. Moral problems such as abortion and homosexuality are extremely important must be addressed.
This is a little off OP - but the above statement is the correct statement. Usually, it is stated as the Conservative TAKEOVER.
And actually, this is the whole point - we must return and remain in the fundamentals of Biblical truth. Moral problems such as abortion and homosexuality are extremely important must be addressed.
preacher4truth
Active Member
The problem is that the church is making the issues of today more important than preaching the Gospel.
The answer for the church doesn't lie within addressing the issues of our world or nation. Our best offensive weapon is a return to belief in the power of the Gospel.
The answer for the church doesn't lie within addressing the issues of our world or nation. Our best offensive weapon is a return to belief in the power of the Gospel.
From the article
"the CBF is an association of Baptist churches organized nearly 20 years ago in protest of the Southern Baptist Convention's return to orthodox theology."
Now if the writer can't get even the most basic of information right, what would lead me to think that they rest of the article is going to be fair?
He does a pretty good job of talking about the conference but then jumps into the whole hiring homosexuals question as if these two things are linked.
They aren't, this conference has been in the planning for a while now and has nothing whatsoever to do with the remarks by the current CBF moderator. You wouldn't know that from the article, but then again I think that was the point.
He then ends the article with a quote from Mohler, who knows nothing of CBF workings or discussions, you know NOT being CBF and all.
Hack job - but that's what Baptist Press does best these days, so it's no surprise.
"the CBF is an association of Baptist churches organized nearly 20 years ago in protest of the Southern Baptist Convention's return to orthodox theology."
Now if the writer can't get even the most basic of information right, what would lead me to think that they rest of the article is going to be fair?
He does a pretty good job of talking about the conference but then jumps into the whole hiring homosexuals question as if these two things are linked.
They aren't, this conference has been in the planning for a while now and has nothing whatsoever to do with the remarks by the current CBF moderator. You wouldn't know that from the article, but then again I think that was the point.
He then ends the article with a quote from Mohler, who knows nothing of CBF workings or discussions, you know NOT being CBF and all.
Hack job - but that's what Baptist Press does best these days, so it's no surprise.
This is a bad article that has a "political" agenda behind it.
Listen, I'm not a fan of the CBF. They left the SBC but seem to desire to come back and take back control for their own pursuits.
That said, this is a terrible article. One of the sad truths that happens in SBC life (for about the past 10 years now) is that many leaders, when challenged on issues, have used monikers of "liberal" "heretic" or even identified the individual(s) as homosexual sympathizers. (One immediate example came from when Dr Patterson called for the dissolving of the relationship between the SBC and the BWA, specifically on the grounds that the BWA worked with a group from Portland called the Evergreen Assocation that had open propagration of homosexual theological agendas on their website. This was a false claim)
Essentially if the leadership in the SBC doesn't like you they use any combination or development on these terms to attempt to dismiss your claims. BPNews is a chief partaker in this trend. BPNews is yellow journalism at its worst.
The funniest part of the article is that line several have quoted: "in protest of the [SBC's] return to orthodox theology." That is just revisionist history if I've ever heard it. Lots of the leaders in the CBF left because they got fired from their positions by leaders of the Resurrgence who, often, took over those positions themselves (or staffed them with their buddies.) If anybody doesn't think that that Conservative Resurrgence wasn't at least 50% about power they're kidding themselves.
Now the leadership in the SBC (I guess because they're bored...they've shot all the enemy and are now turning on the wounded) wants to go after the CBF and put the final nail in the coffin. This is a bad strategy. Just let the group die out on their own. They aren't a sustainable organization and are slowly going the way of the dodo bird. Why this article now? The CBF has no voice whatsoever.
Just a sad example of paultry journalism. I'm embarrassed that my home convention would put out this tripe.
Listen, I'm not a fan of the CBF. They left the SBC but seem to desire to come back and take back control for their own pursuits.
That said, this is a terrible article. One of the sad truths that happens in SBC life (for about the past 10 years now) is that many leaders, when challenged on issues, have used monikers of "liberal" "heretic" or even identified the individual(s) as homosexual sympathizers. (One immediate example came from when Dr Patterson called for the dissolving of the relationship between the SBC and the BWA, specifically on the grounds that the BWA worked with a group from Portland called the Evergreen Assocation that had open propagration of homosexual theological agendas on their website. This was a false claim)
Essentially if the leadership in the SBC doesn't like you they use any combination or development on these terms to attempt to dismiss your claims. BPNews is a chief partaker in this trend. BPNews is yellow journalism at its worst.
The funniest part of the article is that line several have quoted: "in protest of the [SBC's] return to orthodox theology." That is just revisionist history if I've ever heard it. Lots of the leaders in the CBF left because they got fired from their positions by leaders of the Resurrgence who, often, took over those positions themselves (or staffed them with their buddies.) If anybody doesn't think that that Conservative Resurrgence wasn't at least 50% about power they're kidding themselves.
Now the leadership in the SBC (I guess because they're bored...they've shot all the enemy and are now turning on the wounded) wants to go after the CBF and put the final nail in the coffin. This is a bad strategy. Just let the group die out on their own. They aren't a sustainable organization and are slowly going the way of the dodo bird. Why this article now? The CBF has no voice whatsoever.
Just a sad example of paultry journalism. I'm embarrassed that my home convention would put out this tripe.
One does have to even listen to anyone. Just watch how they live and the decisions they make. That will tell you what they are really living for and focused on.
One of Satan's methods is to get the Christian busy, busy, busy and not producing. It seems like they have forgotten the parable of the wheat and tares about pulling them up.
Alive in Christ
New Member
It shouldnt be hard to to. Simply declare that our current view..that homosexuality is a hidious perversion..has not changed, and will not change.
We already know what God has to say regarding homosexuality. It is a hidieous perversion.
I have no problem with that, as long we continue to call homosexuality what it is.
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Another One Bites the Dust?
What a shame....however it's a sign of the times.
What a shame....however it's a sign of the times.
For over about 4,000 years.
Or we could tone down the rhetoric and say the same thing.
There isn't anything wrong with saying something like:
"God's word clearly indicates that the only appropriate context for sexual intimacy is in a marriage between a man and a woman. All other forms or expressions of sexuality, including homosexuality and promiscuity, are sinful."
We all should stand firm for biblical truth, but it's also important to remember that not every person who deals with this issue is a vocal activist. Some people struggle with this issue but want to have someone help them and encourage them to remain faithful to God's word.
You are absolutely right. A few weeks ago someone contacted me about pastoring their church and told me a few years ago they had a split over an issue. The issue was over the color of the skin of the people coming into the community and in their church. Imagine that in Los Angeles, CA where there are almost 200 different languages present in that city.
preacher4truth
Active Member
So what I'm seeing is we need to cater to this crowd as some special group? The Gospel doesn't work for them, right?
What I see is giving in to political correctness and bowing down to this group as if we need to pander to them as if they're elite or need treated as special.
What baloney.
Paul preached to the Corinthians, some of them were this way, and they got saved. Wonder how?
They believed the Gospel and were saved, changed, regenerated. He didn't have resources, programs, conferences, pamphlets, pandering philosophies, nor a version of a message tuned to their liking. He just plainly preached the Gospel.
What I see is giving in to political correctness and bowing down to this group as if we need to pander to them as if they're elite or need treated as special.
What baloney.
Paul preached to the Corinthians, some of them were this way, and they got saved. Wonder how?
They believed the Gospel and were saved, changed, regenerated. He didn't have resources, programs, conferences, pamphlets, pandering philosophies, nor a version of a message tuned to their liking. He just plainly preached the Gospel.
I love the SBC and have also supported CBF since the '90's.
I believe engaging in the act of homosexuallity is sin.
BUT I agree we need to stop "going after" "those people".
Rather, we need to agressively evangelize and let God clean up the acts of ALL who get saved.
We are so willing to accept cohabitation, serial marriage, and all others forms of fornication today while screaming at the top of lungs about the gays.
Are they sinners? Yes. But so are adulterers, those who like "a little porn", and all other sins of the flesh.
Including gluttony, backbiting, and engaging in "doubful disputations" when scripture tells us up front some will see every day the same and some not, etc.
We can lose to Satan trying to stamp out sin, or we can win by leading people to Christ.
I believe engaging in the act of homosexuallity is sin.
BUT I agree we need to stop "going after" "those people".
Rather, we need to agressively evangelize and let God clean up the acts of ALL who get saved.
We are so willing to accept cohabitation, serial marriage, and all others forms of fornication today while screaming at the top of lungs about the gays.
Are they sinners? Yes. But so are adulterers, those who like "a little porn", and all other sins of the flesh.
Including gluttony, backbiting, and engaging in "doubful disputations" when scripture tells us up front some will see every day the same and some not, etc.
We can lose to Satan trying to stamp out sin, or we can win by leading people to Christ.
You are absolutely right. Satan loves to get the Christian busy and consumed with correcting the bad while leaving behind the lost and those who truly want help.
Michael Wrenn
New Member
Two wrongs, or multiple wrongs, don't make a right.
We need to stop having "dialog" and voting on whether homosexual practice is right or wrong.
We need to stop having "dialog" and voting on whether homosexual practice is right or wrong.
True enough, Michael, but do you take the same stand on all other sins of the flesh?
Why not spend our time giving folks the WHOLE law and then the gospel?
If we managed to stop all gay activity tomorrow, it wouldn't add one iota to the population of heaven for eternity.
And how many lost people don't think they are sinners because they don't do "those things?"
The Great Commission doesn't tell us to go and stop gay activism, or stop alcohol use, or stop abortion, or any other hot button issue.
It tells us to go and make disciples. I have a hunch those He has truly regenerated don't spend near as much time doing all those no no's.
Truly, Satan has managed to hamstring us by getting us to focus on changing society from the outside in.
Only lasting change will come from the inside out as a RESULT of salvation, not a cause FOR salvation.
Why not spend our time giving folks the WHOLE law and then the gospel?
If we managed to stop all gay activity tomorrow, it wouldn't add one iota to the population of heaven for eternity.
And how many lost people don't think they are sinners because they don't do "those things?"
The Great Commission doesn't tell us to go and stop gay activism, or stop alcohol use, or stop abortion, or any other hot button issue.
It tells us to go and make disciples. I have a hunch those He has truly regenerated don't spend near as much time doing all those no no's.
Truly, Satan has managed to hamstring us by getting us to focus on changing society from the outside in.
Only lasting change will come from the inside out as a RESULT of salvation, not a cause FOR salvation.
There are some who believe in sinless perfection.
One who has a regular devotional life allows the Holy Spirit to work.
Quote]Truly, Satan has managed to hamstring us by getting us to focus on changing society from the outside in.[/QUOTE]We are called out from the world as salt and light not called in the world.
The answer to Mohler's question is found in the article at http://www.abpnews.com/content/view/7247/53/
"An Associated Baptist Press report of those comments prompted even outsiders like Southern Baptist seminary president Albert Mohler and the Institute on Religion & Democracy to question whether CBF is poised for a shift on homosexuality"
"On March 8, CBF Executive Coordinator Daniel Vestal -- who was in office 12 years ago when the Coordinating Council adopted a policy not to “allow for the purposeful hiring of a staff person or the sending of a missionary who is a practicing homosexual” -- released a statement defending the policy, which was an attempt to keep the issue a matter of discussion for local churches instead of on the floor at national meetings."
"An Associated Baptist Press report of those comments prompted even outsiders like Southern Baptist seminary president Albert Mohler and the Institute on Religion & Democracy to question whether CBF is poised for a shift on homosexuality"
"On March 8, CBF Executive Coordinator Daniel Vestal -- who was in office 12 years ago when the Coordinating Council adopted a policy not to “allow for the purposeful hiring of a staff person or the sending of a missionary who is a practicing homosexual” -- released a statement defending the policy, which was an attempt to keep the issue a matter of discussion for local churches instead of on the floor at national meetings."
Tom Butler
New Member
I question the idea that churches are spending too much time bashing homosexuality at the expense of evangelism and witnessing. This suggests that defending the faith and evangelizing the lost are mutually exclusive choices--that if you do one, you can't do the other.
Reminds me of a true story. Years ago we had a porno house in downtown Paducah. One night pickets appeared on the sidewalks, and for several nights thereafter. One of the pastors was asked, "why are you spending so much time on picketing, when there are plenty of other evils out there to deal with."
"Well, son, "he said, "I don't preach on every sin every Sunday, but I get to them all sooner or later. This is the one I'm gettin' to right now."
Reminds me of a true story. Years ago we had a porno house in downtown Paducah. One night pickets appeared on the sidewalks, and for several nights thereafter. One of the pastors was asked, "why are you spending so much time on picketing, when there are plenty of other evils out there to deal with."
"Well, son, "he said, "I don't preach on every sin every Sunday, but I get to them all sooner or later. This is the one I'm gettin' to right now."