Does Saving faith Involve an Act of the Will?

[The Biblicist]

God says He gives to ALL men a measure of faith, and that it is NOT something meted out to merely to a select few. I will believe God's Word, that 'all men' means just that, ALL men.

That's the gospel truth and I sticking with it. :thumbs:

Try reading the verse in its context which you are attempting to quote!

3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

Questions:

1. Who is Paul saying this to? ANSWER: "TO every man that is AMONG YOU"

2. Among who? ANSWER: The Christians at Rome

3. Who is "he"? ANSWER "every man that is AMONG YOU"

4. Who is "every man"? ANSWER: "EVERY MAN that is AMONG YOU."


You have no clue about proper Biblical hermeneutics or exegesis and that is precsiely why any discussion with you is an exercise in futility.

 

[annsni]

God says He gives to ALL men a measure of faith, and that it is NOT something meted out to merely to a select few. I will believe God's Word, that 'all men' means just that, ALL men.

That's the gospel truth and I sticking with it. :thumbs:

Can you show me this verse?

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Just for you Ann. Here it is again:
Rom 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

 

[The Biblicist]

Just for you Ann. Here it is again:
Rom 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

"For I say" TO WHO? "TO every man AMONG YOU"

However, he wants to begin at the end of the verse and make "every man" mean Paul is saying this TO - evey man in the whole world!

 

[annsni]

It's interesting. I just looked up the verse in the Blue Letter Bible and the two "every man" is a different Greek word. When I looked up the second "every man" (where HP is insisting that God gives every man in creation a measure of faith), I see the word is "hekastos" and when it is used in the Scriptures, it refers to everything in a group. A few examples:

Matthew 25:15 "And unto one he gave five talents, to another two, and to another one; to every man according to his several ability; and straightway took his journey."

Mark 13:34 "[For the Son of man is] as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch."

1 Corinthians 12:7 "But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal."

Those are just a few. In reading through the list here, it is clear that it is not speaking of every person in creation but instead all of a group.

 

[The Biblicist]

It's interesting. I just looked up the verse in the Blue Letter Bible and the two "every man" is a different Greek word. When I looked up the second "every man" (where HP is insisting that God gives every man in creation a measure of faith), I see the word is "hekastos" and when it is used in the Scriptures, it refers to everything in a group. A few examples:

Matthew 25:15 "And unto one he gave five talents, to another two, and to another one; to every man according to his several ability; and straightway took his journey."

Mark 13:34 "[For the Son of man is] as a man taking a far journey, who left his house, and gave authority to his servants, and to every man his work, and commanded the porter to watch."

1 Corinthians 12:7 "But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal."

Those are just a few. In reading through the list here, it is clear that it is not speaking of every person in creation but instead all of a group.

Would not the prepositional phrase "en humin" translated "among you" prove your case as well as mine! It is a group and the group is confined to those "AMONG YOU".

 

[annsni]

Would not the prepositional phrase "en humin" translated "among you" prove your case as well as mine! It is a group and the group is confined to those "AMONG YOU".

Yes, but the "every man" in "every man among you" is actually a different Greek term than the second "every man" in "every man the measure of faith". I thought that was interesting!! The first term is "pas" which means "individually - each, all, the whole" or "collectively - some of all types" but the second term's definition is "each, every" and each time it's used, it is speaking of a whole of a particular group. It's amazing how one English phrase has two Greek terms!

 

[savedbymercy]

Faith is obedience, it's believing, yes it is a performance of the mind or heart, the will ! If anyone claims to be Justified because they DO it, they are claiming Justification by works !

 

[savedbymercy]

In Mk 11:22, Jesus says

And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God.

In the greek, this is an imperative, a command to be obeyed !

 

[DHK]

In Mk 11:22, Jesus says

And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God.

In the greek, this is an imperative, a command to be obeyed !

In Romans 12:3, the verse under discussion, it is speaking of spiritual gifts. That is the context.

 

[Heavenly Pilgrim]

Fortunately Ann you are speaking to a Christian friend, and so I will not call you a heretic, or mock your intelligence, or tell you that you believe like Hundus or those of the cults, etc. etc, but I will kindly and simply tell you that I disagree with your conclusions. :thumbs:

 

[DHK]

"For I say" TO WHO? "TO every man AMONG YOU"

However, he wants to begin at the end of the verse and make "every man" mean Paul is saying this TO - every man in the whole world!

Romans 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

Romans 12:4 For as we have many members in one body, and all members have not the same office:

Romans 12:6 Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, whether prophecy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith;
--These are gifts given to the church. one of them is faith. It is a spiritual gift in this passage. There is nothing in this passage about "the whole world." The letter was written to the believers in Rome.

 

[savedbymercy]

In Romans 12:3, the verse under discussion, it is speaking of spiritual gifts. That is the context.

Mk 11:22 Have Faith in God is a command, something to be obeyed !

 

[percho]

Mk 11:22 Have Faith in God is a command, something to be obeyed !

And to be more accurate:
YLT Mark 11:22 And Jesus answering saith to them, `Have faith of God;


Which the next verse proves.

I like that this thread was started when post 82 of thread "Ye reject salvation by grace ! " gives the answer, if correct, yet no comment on that post.

And of course I understand it is considered incorrect, yet it isn't incorrect without comment.

Post 85 also being relative now.

 

[savedbymercy]

perc

And to be more accurate:
YLT Mark 11:22 And Jesus answering saith to them, `Have faith of God;

There is no more accurate about it, Faith is commanded to do ! It is a work man does or performs !

 

[DHK]

perc

There is no more accurate about it, Faith is commanded to do ! It is a work man does or performs !

So, according to Romans 5:1 you are admitting that you have a works-based salvation?

 

[savedbymercy]

So, according to Romans 5:1 you are admitting that you have a works-based salvation?

Where does Rom 5:1 say that I have a work based salvation ?

 

[DHK]

Where does Rom 5:1 say that I have a work based salvation ?

1. SBM states that Faith is a work.
2. Rom.5:1 states that we are justified by faith.
3. SBM therefore believes that we are justified by works.

 

[savedbymercy]

1. SBM states that Faith is a work.
2. Rom.5:1 states that we are justified by faith.
3. SBM therefore believes that we are justified by works.

Faith is a work, it is believing, which is a command, something man must do. It is a work or act or performance of the Mind.

dhk is the one claiming salvation by his works, his act of believing got him saved, without it, he would not have gotten saved. Do you believe that ?

 

[DHK]

Faith is a work, it is believing, which is a command, something man must do. It is a work or act or performance of the Mind.

dhk is the one claiming salvation by his works, his act of believing got him saved, without it, he would not have gotten saved. Do you believe that ?

In Romans 4:1-5 it declares that faith is not a work.
I don't believe that faith is a work. I agree with what the Bible teaches.
Since you believe that faith is a work, you believe in a works-based salvation, because salvation is by faith (Rom.5:1; Eph.2:8,9)