The scriptures says Noah found favor in the eyes of the LORD. Why do you think Noah found favor with God?
The Bible says Noah was a righteous man, blameless among the people of his time, and he walked with God.
Last edited by a moderator:
-
Welcome to Baptist Board, a friendly forum to discuss the Baptist Faith in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to all the features that our community has to offer.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
The Baptism debate
- Thread starter The Biblicist
- Start date
- Status
The scriptures says Noah found favor in the eyes of the LORD. Why do you think Noah found favor with God?
The Bible says Noah was a righteous man, blameless among the people of his time, and he walked with God.
What is your question. The Bible simply says the opposite of what you were posting. The Bible says that Noah found grace in the sight of the Lord.
Another interesting verse in the light of grace is this one. You might want to ponder it for awhile:
Romans 11:6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
Paul is explaining that Jesus saves us by his shed blood. That we do not have to help in being saved as the Jews once had to. Jews had to participate in the cleansing part. The Jews had to get an animal to be sacrificed for their sins. The priest had to perform his duties exactly how God instructed. There had to be external washings. There were all kinds of rules and regulations! There had to be Burnt Offering, Grain Offering, Fellowship Offering, Sin Offering, Guilt offering, and drink offering, just to worship God. We do not have to do those works anymore, because Jesus did it all for us.
That does not mean we do not have to obey.
That is your interpretation of the verse. You have read a lot into that verse which isn't there. There is nothing there about OT law at all. The fact is that works (of any kind--good works, any kind of works) and grace do not mix. You cannot work your way to heaven. God will not allow "obedience" or "works" as a ticket to heaven. Instead it will damn them to hell. It is either faith alone, or it is nothing but hell.
Do you know what grace is? It is unmerited favor from God. UNMERITED. It cannot be earned! It CANNOT be the result of WORKS. It is UNmerited.
Romans 4
4 Now to the one who works, his wage is not credited as a favor, but as what is due. 5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness,
Did you see that? God justifies the ungodly!
You cannot make yourself clean enough to stand in the presence of God. We do not come to God clean. We come to God as filthy sinners and HE makes us clean.
You are wrong. Israel had the ceremonial works of the law.
Read the scripture carefully.
Romans 6:11 And if by grace, then it is no longer by works; if it were, grace would no longer be grace.
The scripture says NO LONGER BY WORKS. Works, works of the law, the ceremonial laws, saved the Jews in the Old Testament times.
We still have to obey God.
God nailed the ceremonial laws to the cross; God did NOT nail obeying to the cross.
You are wrong. Israel had the ceremonial works of the law.
Read the scripture carefully.
Romans 6:11 And if by grace, then it is no longer by works; if it were, grace would no longer be grace.
The scripture says NO LONGER BY WORKS. Works, works of the law, the ceremonial laws, saved the Jews in the Old Testament times.
We still have to obey God.
God nailed the ceremonial laws to the cross; God did NOT nail obeying to the cross.
You are the only one on the board who defines works so narrowly. Works has a much wider meaning than works of the law.
We always had to and have to obey God. God did not nail obeying to the cross. God nailed the rules and regulations to the cross, the works of the law that was done to come close to God. We do not have to do those things now, because Jesus’ sacrifice once and for all.
Please think more carefully, pray about it more. We have to obey God. For you to come after me so hard, and call obeying God an accursed and condemned belief is something the devil would enjoy hearing.
Think about it, if a person says they believe, you then say now start obeying. If the person does not obey, the Bible says The man who says, "I know him," but does not do what he commands is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
So then, if the man who says I know him but does not do what he commands is a liar, then when he is told to obey God, and he does, then he is no longer a liar. That man is now then saved by believing AND obeying.
If that obedience is a requirement for salvation Paul calls that message accursed. Salvation is by faith and faith alone.
You go against the Word of God when you say such things.
I want you to give this question the time and attention it deserves.
If a man says he believes, but he does not obey, the Bible says he is a liar.
So then, if that man is told to start obeying, and he does, that man is now then saved by believing AND obeying.
How is that an accursed and condemned teaching?
Because Christ paid the penalty for our sins; the full penalty, not in part but the whole.
Salvation is a gift to be received by faith, not by works or good deeds. It can only be received by faith, just as a child receives a gift from his or her parents. There is no work involved. They just receive it even if they don't deserve it. So is salvation. It cannot be earned, worked for, merited. Salvation is not by works.
After one believes in Christ and his atoning blood, the believer will do good works, not because he has to, but out of the love he has for the Savior, and because the Holy Spirit dwells within and is working in him. It is not out of duty, but out of love.
You did NOT answer the question, nor did you hit on it at all.
If a man says he believes, but does not obey, the Bible says he is a liar. So then, if that man is told to start obeying, and he does, that man is now then saved by believing and obeying.
However, according to you, that man is now accursed and condemned.
I have answered your question, in that I stated clearly my position.
You answer me now.
If you sinned right now, suppose in telling a lie, and you died by having a heart attack without a chance to repent of that sin, would you still go to heaven?
The man who believes he is saved by both faith and works believes in a message that is accursed. Works always follow salvation never before. Works are done out of a heart of love after salvation. That is the second time I have answered that question just in the last five posts.
Brother, he simply cannot grasp that the salvation of God BEGINS FIRST inside of man from whence works originate. He is like the "blind pharisee" who thinks he can cleanse outside by works BEFORE the inside is cleansed:
Mt 23:26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.
The INSIDE of the cup must be cleansed FIRST before the outside can be clean.
The INSIDE of man (the heart) must be cleansed FIRST before its works can be clean.
He does not realize that works originate from the INSIDE, from the heart, and so salvation must BEGIN with the HEART first, as iit is the condition of the heart that determines whether the works are good or bad.
Mt. 12:35 A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things: and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things.
QUESTIONS:
1. Where do "good things" originate according to Christ? ANSWER: "out of the good...heart"
2. Where do evil things originate according to Christ? ANSWER "out of the evil treasure"
He believes his works determine good or bad when Christ says it is the tree/heart that determines whether they are good or bad.
Mt 12:33 Either make the tree good, and his fruit good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the tree is known by his fruit.
He believes that some men are simply born with good hearts and so can do good works without any NEW HEART. However, the wisest man on earth asked
Pr 20:9 Who can say, I have made my heart clean, I am pure from my sin?
No man can do it because it is a work of CREATION by God - Eph. 2:10 "For we are HIS WORKmanship CREATED in Christ Jesus UNTO good works"
According to his logic some men have made their hearts good and therefore some men don't need a new heart or need to be regenerated. Job denies this is possible:
Job 14:4 Who can bring a clean thing out of an unclean? not one.
However, it does not matter how much scripture or how clear the scripture is, this kind of person is incapable of understanding or receiving the truth unless God performs a work of grace within them that opens up their mind to understand the scriptures. I know, if that is to be done, it is accomplished by keep on presenting the truth to him with prayer that the Holy Spirit will removed the blindness.
Last edited by a moderator:
- Status