Thomas Helwys
New Member
No, I am simply saying that Calvin was greatly influenced by Augustine, and Augustine's theology was colored by his Manichaest and Neoplatonic past.
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Is Calvisnism Gnostic
- Thread starter Revmitchell
- Start date
No, I am simply saying that Calvin was greatly influenced by Augustine, and Augustine's theology was colored by his Manichaest and Neoplatonic past.
Thomas Helwys
New Member
I can't see them there.
How about this...
Who dtermines in the ultimate sense if we get saved or not...
Will of God or will of man?
Sorry had to do stuff for the Misses.
Good, no excellent question Yeshua..... I am categorically stating that Humans salvation is God's work from beginning to end.Thats it. Is there anything that we can contribute to our salvations? Only the sin from which we need to be saved, for we are the objects of divine grace. Thats my declarative. I hope that answers your question.
Wrong question
My position is that He who has the power and authority to give salvation gets all the credit. Man cannot come to God unless God reaches out to man first for it is not in man to come to God on his own. God opens up the heart of man for if He did not do that man could never come to God. And God by His sovereign design gives man a choice to come to Him or not.
Show that to me biblically.
I will be glad to but let's deal with one issue at a time here. Currently we are discussing the false criticism that if one is not a Calvinist then they hold the sovereignty of man over the sovereignty of God. Do you now see based on my position that this is not always the case?
You are closer then most on the other side in this question, as you at leastdo realise that man is borna sinner, and that unless God applies effectual gracing to enable him to respond by faith, all sinners stay "in the dark!"
Difference between someone like you, who hold to a classic Arminian view though, that still sees us a sinners ubnable to even come to god on their own violation, until God enables them to respond due to His grace, to some non cals here holding to "Gospel of Free Will!"
I am not Arminian and I reject the idea that God withholds grace from some.
But you do hold that Gods grace is not powerful enough to triumph over those who stubbornly resist it.....is that a fair statement?
Arminians holds that we are all born as sinners, that NONE can come to God by themselves, and God applies sufficient Gtace to all sinners to save them, and up to them to accept/reject Christ...
Don't you hold to that?
the will of man can resist the Will of God to save them, so why isn't your Free Will the final basis of who gets saved or not?
No that is a childish characterization and the reason why there can never be any civil discussions with Calvinists as well as completely contrary to what I have already posted.
The grace of Gods call is overwhelmingly efficacious.
You are not talking to a Calvinist & I will warn you to watch your tone when you speak to me. This conversation is over.
The tone went south with you sir. God Bless
Of course it is. personally I believe much of what passes for Christianity in Christians who're Arminian is Gnosticism. When one cherry picks the bible to suit themselves or their experience without a thorough knowledge of Covenant theology, then one ultimately ends up at least partially Gnostic in their belief.
Most often such people either remain ignorant of the greater promises in God's word or subscribe to world philosophy to spiritualize their experience. Common upon their lips is the problem of evil and how powerful Satan is. Whilst claiming faith in a victorious Lord they then relocate him to an impotent God in the real world.
So, the problem of Evil is NEVER solved. Rather it is placed into a future that cannot be proven now but fully revealed then.
Bottom line is I think most will never fully mature, due to the fact of not been able to correctly divide the word of God. Thereby missing out on the WHOLE council of GOD.
ARMINIAN, how big is your God? :BangHead:
This is no different than the accusation in the op. It is over the top as well. The last thing we need is another angry Calvinist on this board.
This link is especially for Rev Mitchell who wanted "scholarly" evidence for Gnosticism in Augustine's teachings.
http://books.google.com/books id=qeYE234vlgwC&printsec=frontcover&source=gbs_ViewAPI#v=onepage&q&f=false
There are literally dozens of books you can choose to study if you wish. The fact is, scholars have been writing on this for
centuries.
Edit- link did not work properly, Google:
"In search of truth Augustine, Manichaeism and other gnosticism"
You can find this book online.
http://books.google.com/books id=qeYE234vlgwC&printsec=frontcover&source=gbs_ViewAPI#v=onepage&q&f=false
There are literally dozens of books you can choose to study if you wish. The fact is, scholars have been writing on this for
centuries.
Edit- link did not work properly, Google:
"In search of truth Augustine, Manichaeism and other gnosticism"
You can find this book online.
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