Featured What is Repentance?

If you thought you were on your way to heaven because you belonged to the church, or because your parents were Christians, or because you were a good person, then yes, you need to change your mind about yourself.

That is what Jesus told those persons in Luke 13. They thought that the persons killed by Pilate, and the persons killed when a tower fell on them was evidence that those persons were terrible sinners that God punished.

Jesus asked them if they "supposed" these persons were greater sinners than all others in Galilee?

He was saying, Hey, do you think they were worse THAN YOU?

He then told them they need to repent of this false belief that they were righteous simply because nothing bad had happened to them. That was not evidence they were righteous. They needed to see they they also were sinners and in danger of perishing.

So yes, it is to turn from self-righteousness and accept that you are a sinner in need of Jesus as your Saviour. You are not going to come to Jesus until you realize you are lost.

 

Now you are scaring the death out of me. Don't take my word for it, I make mistakes like everyone else. Study the scriptures and pray, pray, pray, that God will help you understand. God wants you to understand, and we know he answers our prayers that are in his will.

Jam 1:5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.
6 But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.
7 For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord.
8 A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.

If you mean business, so does God.

1 Jhn 5:14 And this is the confidence that we have in him, that, if we ask any thing according to his will, he heareth us:
15 And if we know that he hear us, whatsoever we ask, we know that we have the petitions that we desired of him.

You are going to do well. :thumbsup:

 

This is one of the few areas where I think David Cloud is exactly right. His book on evangelism and repentance is actually really good. The bolded above is especially good.

 

You actually just proved my point. Repentance is a change of mind that results in a changed behavior. God "repented" of what he was going to do. He had a "change of mind" that resulted in a change of action. This is key - repentance MUST bring about a change. Thus God "repents" of what he is going to do. He had a "change of mind" that resulted in a change of action.

When men repent, primarily we are turning from our rebellious ways (sin) toward God's ways. So we have a change in our thinking that MUST affect a change in behavior. Otherwise it isn't genuine repentance.

Strawman. No one, here anyway, said you must stop sinning to be saved, nor did anyone say that repentance is a cessation of all sinning.

 

We will have to agree to disagree. To repent regarding salvation means to turn from self-righteousness, and realize that we need to believe on Jesus to be saved.

You will not see anywhere in scripture where someone is told they must repent of sin to be saved.

Jesus is the great physician. We do not get better to get saved, we get saved to be better.

When you believe on Jesus, you will receive the Holy Spirit. You will now have a new heart and mind and this is what will turn you from sin.

Folks that say you have to repent of sin have it backwards.

 

Self-righteousness IS sin, so.....

I disagree. It's all over the Bible.

Agreed. But repentance isn't making yourself "better." It's all about submitting to Go and turning to him away from our sin.

True. Repentance isn't a ne time event, it's a frequent, daily event. We not only are saved, but we are being saved. We not only have repented and come to faith in Christ, but we continue repenting and having faith.

I wouldn't waste my time on Jesus-is-savior. Awful site. That being said, that definition of repentance isn't the worst I've seen. But the writer is wrong that "we must repent of our sins only in the sense that we must agree with God that we are hell-deserving sinners" That is part of it, but not all.

Your evangelist friend doesn't have a clue of what he is talking about.

 

How can a non regenerated sinner have faith?

The answer to both questions is they can't. Regeneration precedes both faith and repentance. Both are gifts, and both are necessary.

Logically, in the order of salvation, regeneration comes first followed by faith and repentance. However in time, all three are instantaneous, thus faith and repentance are necessary for salvation. But that is another discussion.

Agreed.

First let's clarify. When I say repent of sin. I am not saying that a person must cease from all sin in order to be saved. That would indeed be works salvation. Repentance is a Spirit directed change of mind that affects your life, specifically how you react to sin. You quoted David Cloud previously so let me quote him as well (emphasis in original):

Now to scripture, we will limit ourselves to a handful of texts from the New Testament since there really is just so much:

But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming for baptism, he said to them, "You brood of vipers, who warned you to flee from the wrath to come? "Therefore bear fruit in keeping with repentance; and do not suppose that you can say to yourselves, 'We have Abraham for our father'; for I say to you that from these stones God is able to raise up children to Abraham. "The axe is already laid at the root of the trees; therefore every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. - Mat 3:7-10 NASB

I know Winman tried to explain these verses away by saying what must be repented of is the attitude of ethnic superiority mentioned in verse 9, but that really makes mince meat of what the prophet is saying. That is partly true of course, they did need to repent of their racism, however that is something that is combined with the general call to repent. Look at the language, "Therefore bear fruit in keeping with repentance; and do not suppose that you can say to yourselves, 'We have Abraham for our father.'" John is anticipating their excuses of why they think they don't need to repent, not fully expounding on what they must repent of.

They hear John's call to repentance, which is clearly salvific, John says they must "flee from the wrath to come," and therefore (because they are to flee the wrath to come) they must bear fruit keeping with or consistent with repentance. In other words this repentance is not only in the mind, it must be worked out in the persons life and this is part of fleeing the wrath of God. The Pharisees and Sadducees will argue that as Jews they do not need to repent, repentance is for Gentiles to them. However John heads that off before they even speak, essentially telling them "Don't say you, as Jews, are good to go and don't need to repent! Your works say otherwise!" And then John uses the picture of the axe chopping down trees. You can't miss the parallel between verse 8 "bear fruit keeping with repentance" and verse 10 "every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down..."

and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel." - Mar 1:15 NASB

Jesus has begun his public ministry, after the arrest of John, and is now calling people to repentance. This repentance is clearly tied to but separate from belief itself in the gospel. And don't miss the context, Mark sets this up immediately follows John's preaching of repentance and right before Jesus calls his disciples. The repentance preached by Jesus is assumed to be the same as John's, the context gives no indication that it is different. The repentance John preached dealt with the confession of and forgiveness of sin (Mar 1:5 and 1:4 respectively).

When Jesus calls the disciples he says to them "Follow me" and they leave everything they have a follow Christ. This following Jesus is clearly seen as the correct response to the call of repent and believe. The call has not changed, we are still to follow Jesus and we abandon all (sometimes literally sacrificing everything) in repentance and faith. Salvation (justification and sanctification, what the gospels simply call following Jesus) is clearly seen as repentance and belief/faith in the gospel.

"You have no part or portion in this matter, for your heart is not right before God. "Therefore repent of this wickedness of yours, and pray the Lord that, if possible, the intention of your heart may be forgiven you. "For I see that you are in the gall of bitterness and in the bondage of iniquity." - Act 8:21-23 NASB

This text is fascinating in so many ways. The context is this; A man named Simon who was a magician (sorcerer, not party entertainer) and had captivated the people of Samaria and these people where hailing him as an almost messianic figure. Then Philip comes through preaching the gospel, people are converted and stop following this guy, then Simon himself believes and is even baptized. Long story short, he sees the apostles perform miracles and tries to buy the Holy Spirit from them! Peter is indignant and says the above to him. First he tells him to "repent of this wickedness" in other words "repent of your sin!" Not only that but Peter tells him to seek forgiveness because he perceives that Simon is not genuinely saved! "For I see that you are in the gall of bitterness and in the bondage of iniquity." Peter sees the person, who remember has made a profession and been baptized, as being an unregenerate, sin-bound, lost person in need of forgiveness. This passage clearly shows that one can believe, be baptized and even go to church (follow the apostles here, 8:13) but it is still all in vain if there is no repentance. This man never repented to begin with, and there is no evidence he repented when rebuked by Peter. Repentance is critically important to salvation.

"So, King Agrippa, I did not prove disobedient to the heavenly vision, but kept declaring both to those of Damascus first, and also at Jerusalem and then throughout all the region of Judea, and even to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, performing deeds appropriate to repentance. - Act 26:19-20 NASB

Paul is before King Agrippa giving his testimony. He recounts the vision of Christ he had and tells Agrippa what he did in response. He went to the Gentiles and preached "that they should repent and turn to God, performing deeds appropriate to repentance." Notice that the Gentiles are to "repent and turn to God." The repentance here is a turning from something, paired with a turning to God. Two distinct, yet related actions. What is this they are to repent of? The text doesn't say specifically so the general repent of rebellion against God (sin) is applicable, though most likely he has in mind repentance of idolatry, which is the cardinal sin of the Gentiles.

Whatever the case, this repentance is clearly for salvation as the language in verse 20, "repent and turn to God," mirrors the reported words of Jesus in verse 18 where the Lord says that Paul must preach so that the people "turn from darkness to light and from the dominion of Satan to God." Why must people turn, i.e., repent? "That they may receive forgiveness of sins." This repentance is also evidenced in "deeds appropriate to repentance" again showing that biblical repentance is not only in the mind, but is worked out in the life.

Winman is appealing to scripture, though I question his exegesis. You apparently missed or forgot my first post in this thread back on page one, I used scripture clearly.

Also reason and logic are not our enemies. Our faith does not call us to check our brains at the door. Everything is to be brought into obedience to the Word of God, but if God is a logical, intelligent being as scripture says, then logic and reason must be consistent with not contrary to the Bible.

 

True repentance, in regards to salvation, is through a Godly sorrow, which leads us to Christ, seeking His mercy...

 

Baloney, there is not a single verse in the scriptures that supports regeneration preceding faith, while there are multiple scriptures that shows a person must first believe before being regenerated.

Jhn 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

Jhn 1:12-13 says to those persons who received Jesus and believed on his name, to these persons God gave the power to be born again and become the sons of God. That absolutely shows faith preceding regeneration.

Jhn 20:31 But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.

This verse says you must believe to have life, which is regeneration.

So, here are two verses clearly showing faith preceding regeneration, and I could probably show half a dozen more. You cannot show any verse saying regeneration precedes faith, I challenge you here and now to show it.

Good thing you are not saying we have to stop sinning, because nobody does it. Have you stopped sinning since you believed?

And why did you sin? Answer that one honestly.

No, John the Baptist was telling them not to say within themselves they have Abraham as their father. They thought they were saved simply because they were the descendants of Abraham. This is the false believe they needed to turn or repent of to be saved.

That John preached Jesus and not to turn from sin is shown by Paul in Acts.

Acts 19:4 Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus

Now, what did John the Baptist say about Jesus?

Jhn 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

John clearly taught Jesus was the lamb that takes away the sin of the world. The Jews understood this, they knew that men placed their hands on a lamb's head and confessed their sins, and the lamb was killed in their place, and their sins were forgiven.

So, John taught that Jesus would die for our sins. But he did not tell them they had to turn from sin to be saved.

Yes, turn from dead works that cannot save you and believe in Jesus who will take your sins away.

Heb 6:1 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,

What is the foundation of the doctrine of Christ? That we should repent of dead works, that is trying to save ourselves, and place our faith in God to save us.

Mar 1:4 John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.
5 And there went out unto him all the land of Judaea, and they of Jerusalem, and were all baptized of him in the river of Jordan, confessing their sins

These verses do not teach we must turn from sin, it says John preached the baptism of repentance FOR the remission of sins. And what must to do to have forgiveness of your sins? You must BELIEVE on Jesus. And in verse 5 it says they confessed their sins, not that they turned from sin whatever that means. Even you now say it does not mean to stop sinning.

continued...

 

Yes, we are to follow Jesus. But when we are told to repent and believe it means to turn from some form of unbelief, such as believing you are saved because you are Abraham's son, or that you are saved because you are righteous (Luke 13) and believe in Jesus.

What? you are teaching that a believer can be lost? Nonsense. When Peter said, Thy money perish with thee, he is likely speaking of physical death, not spiritual.

And Peter's words actually refute your view, because Peter called the Holy Spirit the "gift of God". It is not something you earn by your performance.

You are saying we must perform works or deeds to be saved here.

Turning from idolatry is not a work per say, but a change of mind or reliance on Christ to be saved, where before they believed on false gods.

Yes, and how do you get forgiveness? By doing good deeds or works? NO, you get forgiveness by believing on Jesus.

Yes, and I tend to question some of your exegesis. Seems fair.

I agree that truth is always logical. And the scriptures say we are saved not of works, but of faith. If we must perform deeds and works as you said several times in your post, then salvation is not a free gift simply to be received.

Rom 4:4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

If we have to do good deeds to be saved, then our reward is not of grace, but of debt. But the person who does NOT work, but believes on Jesus who justifies "the ungodly", his faith is counted for righteousness. We don't have to stop sinning and be godly to be saved, Jesus forgives the ungodly.

I believe you have it backwards, you want a man to get well before he gets saved, where scripture says we get saved to get well. It is when we receive the Spirit that we will naturally turn away from sin.

1 Jhn 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

It is when we believe that we receive the Spirit, and when we receive the Spirit we will naturally turn away from sin.

 

Romans 10:17
Consequently, faith comes from hearing the message, and the message is heard through the word about Christ.

I am saved by grace through faith.

Without faith I do not know what grace is without faith I have no reason for Godly sorrow that leads to repentance without out faith that comes from the word of Jesus and the word about Him I have no life in me His words are Spirit and life.

If I don't eat the faith His word and drink in His blood the life Jesus lived I have no life in me.

John 6:53
Jesus said to them, “Very truly I tell you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you.

Regeneration before faith before you eat and drink the medicine for Life is ridiculous

"The life of a sinner is in Christ. If you take the Father apart from the Son, though he loves his elect, and decrees that they shall live, yet life is only in his Son. If you take God the Spirit apart from Jesus Christ, though it is the Spirit that gives us spiritual life, yet it is life in Christ, life in the Son. We dare not, and cannot apply in the first place, either to God the Father, or to God the Holy Ghost for spiritual life. The first thing we are led to do when God brings us out of Egypt is to eat the Passover—the very first thing. The first means whereby we get life is by feeding upon the flesh and blood of the Son of God; living in him, trusting on him, believing in his grace and power. Our second thought was—there is life in Christ."

C.H.Spurgeon

 

If I show them to you, you will not believe. Same as the scripture that show repentance is absolutely necessary for salvation. Why should I waste my time?

Actually no, those two verses explicitly say that being born again occurs not by the will of man, but of God. It is God who takes the initiative and makes one born again.

I agree. Not sure why you think that is a problem to my position. Belief is necessary for salvation. This verse says nothing about the source of the belief, whether it is something you work up in yourself or if it’s a gift from God.

This isn’t the topic of the thread, nor is this the Calvinism/Arminianism debate section. I also know that the verses that clearly show this have been pointed out to you before and all you will do is argue, which is fine, that’s your prerogative. I just don’t feel like playing the game.

?? I don’t understand this. I said that repentance is not ceasing form all sin, and you acknowledge I said that, but then you ask me if I’ve stopped sinning since I believed. What’s your game dude?

Regardless, of course I haven’t. No one has. We all will struggle with sin until we are glorified.

For the same reason you did and everyone else did. We love darkness rather than light.

I dealt with that earlier. You are ignoring what the text says. He tells them to repent and live in a way consistent with repentance, then anticipating their objection he tells them to not rely on their ethnicity. Yes they must repent of what you said, but that is not the only thing they must repent of.

The two are not mutually exclusive. To preach Christ correctly requires one to also preach repentance. Do you agree that John preached that people must repent and live in a way consistent with repentance?

Yep. I agree with that 100%.

So he didn’t tell them to “bear fruit keeping with repentance”? They could do some sort of repentance that didn’t change their life? Sounds more like Roman penance than biblical repentance to me.

Yes, but Jesus preached the same repentance that John preached did he not? Therefore those who repent and believe the gospel will live lives that are different. They will repent of sin, and repenting of it they will leave it. That’s what Paul clearly argues in 2 Timothy 2:19:

But God's firm foundation stands, bearing this seal: "The Lord knows those who are his," and, "Let everyone who names the name of the Lord depart from iniquity. " - 2Ti 2:19 ESV

So these people can confess their sin and even repent for the “forgiveness/remission of sin” and yet not turn from that sin? Seriously? Just make an empty profession without any change and it’s all good? Yes you must believe in Jesus that is not up for debate, but repentance is intrinsically tied to believing in Jesus.

 

Repentance is not just turning from unbelief, otherwise it is stupidly redundant for Jesus and the apostles to preach “Repent AND believe!” Also, is not repenting of unbelief repenting of sin? Unbelief is sin is it not? You contradict yourself.

Repentance is almost always seen as affecting a change in the person’s life and often paired with specific sins not just unbelief that must be repented of.

"Therefore say to the house of Israel, Thus says the Lord GOD: Repent and turn away from your idols, and turn away your faces from all your abominations. - Eze 14:6 ESV

Repent therefore, and turn back, that your sins may be blotted out, - Act 3:19 ESV

Repent, therefore, of this wickedness of yours, and pray to the Lord that, if possible, the intent of your heart may be forgiven you. - Act 8:22 ESV

but declared first to those in Damascus, then in Jerusalem and throughout all the region of Judea, and also to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, performing deeds in keeping with their repentance. - Act 26:20 ESV

I gave her time to repent, but she refuses to repent of her sexual immorality. - Rev 2:21 ESV

Behold, I will throw her onto a sickbed, and those who commit adultery with her I will throw into great tribulation, unless they repent of her works, - Rev 2:22 ESV

nor did they repent of their murders or their sorceries or their sexual immorality or their thefts. - Rev 9:21 ESV

and cursed the God of heaven for their pain and sores. They did not repent of their deeds. - Rev 16:11 ESV

Are you kidding!? :BangHead:

You apparently didn’t read anything I said! Try again.

That would be pertinent if I had actually said, anywhere, that my view is we earn anything by our performance. Again you fail to comprehend what is being said.

All I did was quote Paul. If you disagree then take it up with God.

Also known as…repentance! :applause:

Believing on Jesus is intimately connected to repentance. You CANNOT have one without the other. That is why Jesus said “Repent and believe the gospel" (Mar 1:15) why Peter said that the Jews must “repent…that your sins may be blotted out.” (Acts 3:19) and why Paul could say that “Godly sorrow brings repentance that leads to salvation.” (2 Cor 7:10)

Yes. Well if we all agreed on everything life would be boring!

Nowhere did I say that we do works in order to be saved. You are either confused or lying. I assume confused.

Yep. One of the greatest truths in scripture! This, however, is not inconsistent with saying one must repent. If you think it is, then you have a wrong understanding of repentance and/or faith.

I said no such thing. Stop misrepresenting me, please. It is not Christian to do so.

Agreed. The funny thing is, a consistent reading of 1 John shows that being born of God means new birth is from God alone resulting in faith, love and good works.

 

You do know that Spurgeon was a Calvinist and believed that regeneration preceded both faith and repentance?