Featured Col. 1:15

“First born” is the term for an eldest child with emphasis on his legal right of inheritance. Deuteronomy 21:15-19. Since Christ is the first and only Son begotten of the Father, he is the Heir of the Father’s estate which is all of the heavens and the earth. Hebrews 1:2. Notice that Paul says “first born” and not “first created.”

 

In post #16 I retracted the born-again part.

 

As per usual, some of you are ignoring some Scriptures ...

“firstborn from the (spiritually) dead” (Colossians 1:18, Revelation 1:5)

“For whom He (Father God) foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to
the image of His Son, that He (Jesus) might be the firstborn among many brethren.” (Romans 8:29)

“… that the Christ would suffer, that He would be the first to rise from the dead,
and would proclaim light to the Jewish people and to the Gentiles.” (Acts 26:23)

 

Brother,

The term "firstborn" is a common term in the Old Testament and among the Jews to denote the chief "heir" among other sons in a family. He is the one who receives the double blessing and who becomes the family priest, leader, the POSITION of authority over the family.

In the book of Genesis it never refers to the son who was actually born first (Abel and then Seth over Cain, Isaac over Ishmael, Jacob over Esau, etc.) but to the POSITION of head over all the family.

In verses 16-17 additional reasons are given to support him in that POSITION of authority and leadership.

 

Surely you're not suggesting Osterloh and evangelist-7 are one and the same?? How can this be? evangelist-7 was banned!! No one would get banned and sign on as another user!! Surely not! Would they?

[/sarcasm]

 

Firstborn was the translation from Prototokos.

It means the Prototype or a kind of Mold.

In the exact form of Mold, plastic products are copied and produced.

Jesus is the Proto Type of all creatures.

 

I think he is saying the very reverse of your conclusion. Notice the immediate assertion that precedes and follows it:

Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

His assertion is that Christ is the RIGHTFUL OWNER/HEIR to all creation, (1) Because he is God in the flesh; (2) Because He created all things or the Creator in Genesis 1; (3) Because all things were created FOR HIM; (4) Because it is He preexists all creatures/creation; (5) Because by His power all things consist or are held together.

Hence, "the firstborn of every creature" is must be interpreted to be consistent with the other descriptives of who He really is - God in the flesh and thus rightful owner of all creation.

 

Psalm 89 is a Messianic Psalm and it implies the Pre-Incarnate Jesus Christ thru David.
v 18 the Holy One of Israel is the Son of God.
v 20 talk about Yeshuah in David
v 27 I will appoint Him Bekhor(the Firstborn), the Most High ( Eliyon) to the Kings of the world.

This means that all the authority of the world comes from Him, the Firstborn.

Psalm 88 and 89 were Maschil by the descendants of Korah, and they wrote them after King David. We should keep in mind LORD Jehovah can mean Yeshuah sometimes

So, Psalm 89 describes about Yeshuah, the Firstborn to the Kings of the World.

 

I didn't object to any points indicated by you.
Jesus is the Creator of all creatures but He formed every creatures in His Likeness and He was the Proto-type of all creatures.

 

David in OT often meant Mashiach( Messiah) as you can read:

Isaiah 9:7

Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this

Jeremiah 29:16
Know that thus saith the LORD of the king that sitteth upon the throne of David, and of all the people that dwelleth in this city, and of your brethren that are not gone forth with you into captivity;

Jeremiah 30:9
But they shall serve the LORD their God, and David their king, whom I will raise up unto them.


Ezekiel 37:25
And they shall dwell in the land that I have given unto Jacob my servant, wherein your fathers have dwelt; and they shall dwell therein, even they, and their children, and their children's children for ever: and my servant David shall be their prince for ever
( Is this David the son of Jesse?)


You are saying that Bible tells David is the Firstborn of the family
but Psalm 89:27 is this

Also I will make him my firstborn, higher than the kings of the earth.

Bible says David is the Firstborn of the Kings of the Earth, not of the family!

Do you see the difference?

 

Col 1:15
He is the firstborn of all creatures.

Is Jesus the firstborn of snakes and monkeys?

The Firstborn or the Prototype shouldn't necessarily be the direct negative film for the animals and plants, and all the materials. In those cases, thru the human beings, the Firstborn can radiate the light of His Image to all the other creatures.

However, in case of human beings, they were created in the Image of Jesus Christ.

 

First "every creatures" are not created in the image of God - only humans - Gen. 1:26

Second, how could the Post-incarnate word serve as the "prototype" for all mankind in regard to being "formed" unless you are inferring the Pre-incarnate Word was a physical "human" in his image? He was not!

 

You are missing the obvious. The majority of times that someone in the Bible is regarded as "firstborn" is concerning those who had not been born "first" but simply are given the POSITION or LEGAL RIGHTS of one who was born first.

David is being promised the LEGAL RIGHTS over the earth or one who stands in THE LEGAL POSITION as rightful heir over all the earth. He is a Messianic TYPE of Christ, who by virtue of His nature - hence the "INVISIBLE IMAGE" of God is the rightful or legal HEIR to all creation.

 

You may not know the activities by the Pre-Incarnate Yeshuah in OT, but He appeared many times during OT period as human beings. He ate the meal( Gen 18:1-) He wrestled with Jacob, He met Manoah couple, He appeared to Moses. He appeared to Joseph in Gen 37.
So, before the Creation, He had everything like the flesh.

Pre-Incarnate Word had the physical human too.

 

In that aspect, no other interpretation can avoid such problem either.

iS Jesus the Pre-eminent of the snakes, of monkeys, of skunks?

Here Jesus is the Prototype of all Human beings who have the domain over all creatures.

This is answered by above post.

 

Angels also manifested themselves in human body form. The preincarnate Word may have manifested in himself in the appearance of a body, but he did not have a body as part of his nature BECAUSE if he did, then there is no need for the incarnation by virgin birth. If he already had a body nature then all he had to do is appear rather than be born. His preincarnate appearances were theophanies just as angels appeared in bodily forms.