Featured Arminian sovereignty: In charge vs. in control

God is the Creator. Everything else is the created. He is in charge and control totally. He allows free will in man bounded by his fallen state. He puts limits on Satan. As the Lord says in Job "I hung the stars, can you?" That pretty well sums up man's stance in front of a Holy God. There is no such thing as terms like luck, chance, or coincidence. Being sovereign to me means God acts according to His perfect purposes. He is the driving force behind the affairs of men and nations. He is working His purpose out so as to bring about the perfect timing of the return of Christ. He did the same in the OT to bring about the Incarnation.

God numbers the hairs on our head. Why would anyone think He is not involved in every aspect of the universe?

 

I am neither an arminian nor a cal but I believe that it means God is in control no matter what our actions or responses are and therefore He gets the credit solely even when He requires a response from us.

 

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

 

I believe Calvinism places God in a box when it comes to His own sovereignty. Prime example would be Calvinism declaring that God in His sovereignty is forbidden to give His created a free will choice to believe or not to believe.

 

I don't think so. Calvinism only gives "lip" service to man's freewill. Calvinism's version of freewill to make a choice is no freewill choice at all, for Calvinism declares un-regenerated man can only choose unbelief, that is not having a "God given" freewill to choose one way or the other, but rather is a "Calvinism given" freewill to choose only one way.

 

I'm curious as to your Hyper Calvinist comment.....just who do you list as Hyper Calvinists? Would you consider Arthur Pink a H C?

 

Thats cause you don't understand Calvinism. Only an "Absolute Predestination" group thinks that way and they are way in the minority.

 

Yeah, we always get that "you don't understand Calvinism" charge, but everything I understand about Calvinism I have gotten directly from debating with Calvinist. I believe all the Calvinist on this board would say un-regenerated man cannot choose to believe unto salvation, this is not having a freewill to make a choice between two paths.

 

Yeah see that's not a freewill to choose between two paths. Of course no one seeks God without God first seeking and doing the drawing. Jesus said He would draw all men unto Himself (John12:32) . Many are called, few are chosen (Matt 22:14) .

 

It's simple. He guides our steps.

The "if" in that verse maybe throws some folks ?

"Men" is italicized which usually means the word was added later. Is this the case in this verse ?

 

So then Calvinist believe that whenever a person is impelled to do something, or believe something, then they automatically must do or believe such a thing?

 

True, but we are also told to quench not the spirit, which seems to me a fairly clear statement against resisting God. Seems to me this is not a scriptural case of black-and-white, but rather a case for discernment and just how resistible or irresistible God is.

 

What is the subject matter of the verse? Don't you think what the verses is saying is that when Jesus be lifted up on that cross all men will be forced to....what? Believe in Him? I say no, but forced to deal with His life and testimony, and forced (spiritually) to MAKE A CHOICE!