Featured Why so much Angst About Limited atonement?

Luke 23:33 And when they were come to the place, which is called Calvary, there they crucified him, and the malefactors, one on the right hand, and the other on the left.
34 Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do. And they parted his raiment, and cast lots.

And were these Roman soldiers, whom Jesus prayed for, also the elect?
Or was Jesus just wasting his time as he hung there?

 

Also the sin of attributing the works of Christ to Satan cannot be replicated today. That was the sin of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. That sin was only able to be committed during Christ's time on earth. The only unpardonable sin today is unbelief.

 

All unbelief today is against the Spirit's Testimony of Christ as He reveals it in the Gospel ! Rev 19:10

And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

1 Jn 5:6-10

6 This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.

7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.


8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.

If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater: for this is the witness of God which he hath testified of his Son.

10 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness [of the Spirit] in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.

 

reformed

Thats not a True statemernt as it concerns the Elect and or any for whom Christ died ! God consigned the Elect into unbelief so that He may have Mercy upon them Rom 11:32

32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.

So Unbelief in the Elect meets with God's Mercy upon them !

 

(1) Only one Calvinist has attempted to deal with the living water "thing". Willis tried, but his position places those having been given the living water as Christ making them thirsty when Christ said they would never thirst AFTER receiving the living water that He shall give. You simply agreed with him.

(2) Jesus said "ALL manner of sin shall be forgiven UNTO MEN" and at the same time gave an EXCEPTION. The ONLY sin that wasn't "died for" is the blasphemy against the Holy Spirit (unbelief). This is why when those say if Christ died for ALL, ALL would be saved is false. Christ died for ALL's sin, EXCEPT anyone's sin of rejecting the Holy Spirit's call.

 

Pastor, there is nothing contradictory in Jesus’ High Priest prayer before His crucifixion, during His crucifixion, and after His resurrection.

In verse 9 of John 17 Jesus prays:

I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.

Since the will of Jesus always reflects the will of the Father:

1. Why would Jesus not pray for the world since, according to non-Cal theology, ‘God so loves the world’, meaning every human who ever lived?

How is 'love' manifest to those for whom Christ refuses to pray?

2. Why would Jesus make such a startling negative statement if He loves everyone, including Judas Iscariot?

3. Verses 20 and 21 cited above also limits those for whom Christ prays: He prays only for those who, in the future, will believe on Him.

Therefore, Christ’s prayer on the cross, is perfectly consistent with His prayer in the Garden.

It is limited to those who either now believe or shall in the future believe in Him.

Furthermore, if Christ’s prayer is limited in scope (on behalf of believers only), His atonement which bestows forgiveness of sins is also limited to believers only.

Just as the Jewish High Priest on the Day of Atonement asked the Lord forgiveness for the sins of Israel -- NOT for the world -- in like manner Jesus prays for forgiveness -- NOT for the world -- but for spiritual elect Israel, comprised of Jewish and Gentile believers.

Remember, the Father always hears the prayers of His Son.

Thus, the biblical truths:

I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep. [i.e., for believers only]

I lay down my life for the sheep. [i.e., for believers only]

Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church [i.e., believers only], and gave himself for it; [i.e., for believers only]

Unto him that loved us [i.e., believers only], and washed us [i.e., believers only] from our sins in his own blood.

 

"Christ died for ALL's sin, EXCEPT anyone's sin of rejecting the Holy Spirit's call," therefore not all sins have been died for and the atonement is limited.

Thank you.

The Archangel

 

Well. I will have to go with Jesus on this one. You are free willed to believe as you wish.......

 

Wrong again!! BZZZZZZZZ!




Jesus said the Truth shall make you free. Jesus is the Truth, and no sinner has Jesus, therefore, no sinner is free....

 

Do you realize what the word "Except" means?

If all sins are forgiven, there is no exception.

If all sins are forgiven--with the exception of one or some--then only some, not all, sins are forgiven.

If some sins are not forgiven, there is a "limit" to the atonement as not all sins are forgiven.

It's really simple. And, it's what the text you cited is saying.

The Archangel

 

We aren't saved by His death, but His life. His death brought the atonement, but if He had not arisen, we'd still be in our sins...

 

Thats true:thumbsup:

 

I would say we are saved by both. Actually Jesus is eternal life, He only died physically. Without that physical death, no one could be saved by His life. He gives this living water when we call upon Him by faith.

 

I know I don't always agree with Willis, but he's right on this one. Paul even confirms as much in his letters to the church at Corinth.

That 17th verse tells us that it took the raising of Christ up from the dead. Without the resurrection, we would have no hope. As he wrote in verse 19, we would be most miserable.

 

:thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup::thumbsup:

 

Wrong again. If Jesus was not risen we'd still be in our sine....we are saved by His life. I live so ye can live also....