Featured Revelation 20!

And we are back to the earth needing to STILL be redeemed from Satan. And as long as you argue for that expect people to be surprised that you say God is reigning when you have spent so much time arguing that Satan is actually reigning on this earth.

 

I said he had dominion not reigning. Adam was given dominion in the Garden, but right now we are under the curse that came when satans the prince and power of the air causing Adam to sin thus usurping man's dominion.

Genesis 3:17-18
17 "And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;"

All unbelievers are under satan's power

Ephesians 2:2 "Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:"

So tell me are they under the dominion of God or satan?

Isaiah 14:12 "How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!"

Satan is right now weakening the nations. This prophecy will be fulfilled in the Tribulation.

We see Revelation 12:7
7 "And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night."
This is the 1/2 way point of the Tribulation.


God has everything planned even the casting down of satan. Always has always will.

 

do·min·ion
dəˈminyən/Submit
noun
1.
sovereignty; control.
"man's attempt to establish dominion over nature"
synonyms: supremacy, ascendancy, dominance, domination, superiority, predominance, preeminence, hegemony, authority, mastery, control, command, power, sway, rule, government, jurisdiction, sovereignty, suzerainty
"at the time the Spartans had dominion over Athens"
2.
the territory of a sovereign or government.
"the Angevin dominions"
synonyms: dependency, colony, protectorate, territory, province, possession; historicaltributary
"a British dominion"

Oh yes having sovereignty is so much better :BangHead:

How does Satan even come into play here. Man sinning means that dominion reverts back to the Original owner so to speak, not a third party who was not involved in the original transaction. Besides it is not Satan that had the "dominion" to curse the ground, that was God as you show in the verse below.

Who is under God's power. Besides the world system does not equal the earth.

God's power.
Here is that entire Passage showing how we are under God's control
Eph2:1-10 And you were dead in the trespasses and sins 2 in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience— 3 among whom we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body[a] and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind. 4 But[c] God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, 5 even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved— 6 and raised us up with him and seated us with him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, 7 so that in the coming ages he might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.

And this has to do with Satan's supposed dominion (sovereignty) how?

And proves nothing as your making a circular arugment

And God has everything in His Control, Dominion, Sovereignty, etc. including the Devil and the Earth.

 

Now Satan is the god of this world even though Christ is on the right hand of the throne of God (Acts 7).
It is Satan who is the prince of the power of the air, and will be until the rapture takes place; until Christ comes for His saints.

Then the Antichrist will be revealed and will seem to be in control for 3 1/2 years. He will make a covenant with the Jews and break it at the end of that time, desecrating the Temple. From that time onward everyone will know who is in control--not the Antichrist but the Lord who will be casting his judgments in wrath on the earth.
Have you ever stood before "the wrath of the Lamb"?

Revelation 6:16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

In that "great day" He shall come, deliver Israel from her anti-Semitic enemies, and establish His Kingdom for a thousand years.

 

According to your definition of sovereignty, did God have absolutely everything under control when he allowed Satan to have his way with Job?

 

So then you believe God didn't do what He said He would:
Genesis 1:26 "And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth."

God allowed or gave Dominion to man, man lost that dominion when he sinned.

Hebrew "u'irdu" sway translated dominion.

Who sways the choices of unregenerate mankind?

 

Now the real question is, is the Beloved City really Jerusalem given that the same book refers to Jerusalem this way in Rev 11:8

Sodom and Egypt are never good things in the Bible, nor are they ever considered Beloved.
But who is considered Beloved throughout the entire Bible?
The Bride
Who is the Bride of Christ?
the Church

So how does Jerusalem go from being called Sodom to being called Beloved in Revelation?

Matt 5:14
14 “You are the light of the world. A city set on a hill cannot be hidden."
Before you point to the period I'm going to point out that punctuation is not inspired. It makes sense with a comma as well. Just something to think about.

22But you have come to Mount Zion and to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to innumerable angels in festal gathering, 23 and to the assembly[a] of the firstborn who are enrolled in heaven, and to God, the judge of all, and to the spirits of the righteous made perfect, 24 and to Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel.
Heb 12:22-24
Note the past tense in verse 22

24 Now this may be interpreted allegorically: these women are two covenants. One is from Mount Sinai, bearing children for slavery; she is Hagar. 25 Now Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia;[e] she corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children. 26 But the Jerusalem above is free, and she is our mother.
Gal 4:24-26

As shown above Paul and the writer of Hebrews have no problem viewing 2 Jerusalems
Also I am curious to see how you deal with what Jerusalem is called in Rev 11.
Lets face it the throne is symbolic of power, unless you are going to make an argument that Jesus is going to sit on the Literal Throne that David sat upon that would be over 3000 years old.
Paul and the Writer of Hebrews show that there are Two Jerusalems one on earth and one in heaven.
We also know from Paul that Israel is not just natural Israel but also those grafted into the vine.
So who has power over Israel?

 

Yes He did.
To quote, Luther, The Devil is God's Devil.
God's Sovereignty does not scare me as it seems to with some people, it comforts me, knowing that nothing happens outside of God's control.

 

Have I ever argued against Adam and Eve having dominion? No I have not.
But the reprehensible idea of Satan gaining Dominion yeah I have argued against that tooth and nail.
I would say man's depraved nature has sway over his choices.
James 1:14
But each person is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desire.
We don't need the devil to sin.

 

Satan requested God.
Job 1:12 And the LORD said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the LORD.

All that he hath is in thy power.

And today?
All that is in the world is in his power.
The world is in the domain of Satan. Christ does not have the domain of this world; Satan does.

 

Blessedwife318 stated,
"How does Satan even come into play here. Man sinning means that dominion reverts back to the Original owner so to speak, not a third party who was not involved in the original transaction. Besides it is not Satan that had the "dominion" to curse the ground, that was God as you show in the verse below."

Satan brought the temptation upon Eve and she gave into that temptation. Adam made a conscious choice to sin and thus he fell. Satan is in the equation because he brought about the fall and the curse. Satan is the prince and power of the air, does a prince have dominion?

Acts 26:17-18,
17 "Delivering thee from the people, and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I send thee,
18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me."

Genesis 3:17-19,
17 "And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;
19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return."

Man doesn't have dominion over the thorns and thistles, man still has to work by the sweat of his brow. The animals are still wild after the flood. Man doesn't have dominion over the earth anymore.

So who has sway over the Earth, we know ultimately God.

But satan is allowed to do many things on this earth, Luke 22:31 "And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat:
32 But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren."

Satan was given dominion to sift Peter and his faith failed, he denied Christ. Buy God forgave and he strengthened his brethren.

Satan was allowed to try Job,

Job 2:6
6 "And the Lord said unto Satan, Behold, he is in thine hand; but save his life."
Satan was given dominion over Job but he wasn't allowed to take his life. God allowed it in His sovereignty.

 

So much for the work of Christ on the Cross I guess. :BangHead:
Job proves my point, Satan had to be given permission to do anything to Job, and even then God has Satan on a leash
"only upon himself put not forth thine hand"

 

Therefore it must be redeemed and that is why God's wrath His Sovereign judgment is poured out upon the earth for 7 years in the Tribulation. That is why the Church will be caught up to meet Christ in the air before.

Then we see the Kingdom come on the redeemed earth.

 

Really because DHK makes a bolded statement with no reference, after quoting Job showing that Satan has to have permission from God to do anything your drawing the conclusion that the earth STILL needs to be redeemed despite the Finished work of Christ on the Cross. :BangHead:

 

But under your point on Dominion you say Dominion is power and control, yet God gave Dominion to Adam and Adam lost that dominion.

If the earth is not under the dominion of satan and unregenerate man isn't either then the dominion belongs to the curse and still needs to be redeemed from the curse.

No matter how it is sliced the earth needs to be redeemed!

 

Until the curse is lifted the earth will need to be redeemed. If Christ redeemed it on the cross then the curse would have been lifted.


If satan doesn't have power to influence men then he didn't enter Judas, but we are told that he did.

He also sent an influence on King SAul and vexxed him.

Over and over we see the influence of satan upon the earth. When he is cast out of heaven then he will be confined to the earth with the beast and false christ in the tribulation.

And finally he will be cast into the Lake of Fire after the 1000 year Kingdom shown in Revelation 20.

 

Why?
Look at the context here.
This is Paul's prayer for the Ephesians. It is a prayer.
It speaks of spiritual things, heavenly things, but not so much earthly things, which my post was about.