Why Jesus Said "I Never Knew You"?

[Hark]

If you read from Matthew 7:13-27 in context at the link below, this is about a warning from Jesus about false prophets coming in leading many professing saved believers astray.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+7:13-27&version=KJV

But we shall zero in with this;

Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. KJV

Now why would Jesus profess to never knowing them in regards to false prophets coming in leading them astray? The key is in verse 23 of the underlined portion of that verse.

Titus 1:16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate. KJB

The underlined portion of Titus 1:16 is also a clue. Works that deny Him. How is that important?

2 Timothy 2:11 It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him: 12 If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us: 13 If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.

So any works that deny Him is a professing believer denying Him, and thus He will deny them. This is why Jesus said "I never knew you" to those professing believer because they were workers of iniquity in Matthew 7:23

But do take note of 2 Timothy 2:13 above because even if a saved believer stopped believing in Him, He still abides in those former believers and thus even believers that went astray because He will lose nothing of all the Father has given Him.

John 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

2 Timothy 2:18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some. 19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. 20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. 21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

What makes a vessel unto dishonor? Iniquity.

What makes a vessel of dishonor to become a vessel unto honor? When he departs from iniquity with His help. 2 Timothy 2:21 above.

Both of those vessels are still in His House; 2 Timothy 2:20 above

So Jesus saying "I never knew you" is because of the iniquity that is denying Him. He still abides in the believer, but the believer is a reprobate, as in, disqualified from attending the Marriage Supper held in His honor. That means the believers will be left behind to be received later on after the great tribulation as a vessel unto dishonor in His House.

Luke 13:24-30 at the link below is another version of Matthew 7:13-27, but referring to the sitting down with the O.T saints, of which I receive it to be the Marriage Supper event at the pre tribulational rapture event.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke+13:24-30&version=KJV

There is more than a loss of the rewards of crowns for being in iniquity. A believer can become a castaway.

1 Corinthians 9:24 Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. 25 And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible. 26 I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air: 27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

 

[Revmitchell]

So in your theology how long does one become a cast away?

 

[JonC]

If you read from Matthew 7:13-27 in context at the link below, this is about a warning from Jesus about false prophets coming in leading many professing saved believers astray.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew+7:13-27&version=KJV

But we shall zero in with this;

Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. KJV

Now why would Jesus profess to never knowing them in regards to false prophets coming in leading them astray? The key is in verse 23 of the underlined portion of that verse.

Titus 1:16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate. KJB

The underlined portion of Titus 1:16 is also a clue. Works that deny Him. How is that important?

2 Timothy 2:11 It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him: 12 If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us: 13 If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.

So any works that deny Him is a professing believer denying Him, and thus He will deny them. This is why Jesus said "I never knew you" to those professing believer because they were workers of iniquity in Matthew 7:23

But do take note of 2 Timothy 2:13 above because even if a saved believer stopped believing in Him, He still abides in those former believers and thus even believers that went astray because He will lose nothing of all the Father has given Him.

John 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

2 Timothy 2:18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some. 19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. 20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. 21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

What makes a vessel unto dishonor? Iniquity.

What makes a vessel of dishonor to become a vessel unto honor? When he departs from iniquity with His help. 2 Timothy 2:21 above.

Both of those vessels are still in His House; 2 Timothy 2:20 above

So Jesus saying "I never knew you" is because of the iniquity that is denying Him. He still abides in the believer, but the believer is a reprobate, as in, disqualified from attending the Marriage Supper held in His honor. That means the believers will be left behind to be received later on after the great tribulation as a vessel unto dishonor in His House.

Luke 13:24-30 at the link below is another version of Matthew 7:13-27, but referring to the sitting down with the O.T saints, of which I receive it to be the Marriage Supper event at the pre tribulational rapture event.

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke+13:24-30&version=KJV

There is more than a loss of the rewards of crowns for being in iniquity. A believer can become a castaway.

1 Corinthians 9:24 Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. 25 And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible. 26 I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air: 27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

I disagree. I interpret these to be people who may believe that they are saved but are instead working towards their own salvation on their own terms. For all appearances, they are saved (they are “doing the right things”). The reason I say this is that there is no correction to what they claim to have accomplished in Jesus’ name, yet what they practice is still “lawlessness” as they work from their own motives. (Think Sinatra….or Elvis….”I did it my way”). In other words, what I see here is a type of belief without repentance.. These people are still relying on themselves, just adjusted to new “rules” (no rebirth).

 

[Hark]

So in your theology how long does one become a cast away?

Just as long as you recognize that this is not a denomenational teaching nor an accepted view of what is generally believed about the pre trib rapture.

Becoming a castaway happens when God judges His House first at the pre tribulational rapture event. 1 Peter 4:14-19

Have you read Luke 12:40-49 ?

 

[Hark]

I disagree. I interpret these to be people who may believe that they are saved but are instead working towards their own salvation on their own terms. For all appearances, they are saved (they are “doing the right things”). The reason I say this is that there is no correction to what they claim to have accomplished in Jesus’ name, yet what they practice is still “lawlessness” as they work from their own motives. (Think Sinatra….or Elvis….”I did it my way”). In other words, what I see here is a type of belief without repentance.. These people are still relying on themselves, just adjusted to new “rules” (no rebirth).

Interesting. I once had a view that they were claiming God's work as their own.

But in context, Matthew 7:13-27 is referring to the apostasy movement of the "Spirit" where they broaden the way ( John 14:6 Matthew 7:13-14 ) in the worship place to include focus on the Holy Spirit and chasing after "Him" to "receive again after a sign" where many have fallen away from the faith to these seducing spirits, and are falling down in these movements of the "Spirit".

I believe Jesus was talking about "slain in the spirit", the "holy laughter movement", the "Pensacola Outpouring", the "Toronto Blessings" and the very popular "another baptism with the Holy Spirit with evidence of tongues" which happens to comes with no interpretation; Isaiah 8:19 & 1 Timothy 4:1-2

Do not all those believers "fall down" in those movements? Matthew 7:24-27 That is what they get for pointing believers to climb up another way when all invitations in coming to God the Father in fellowship, prayer, and in worship is to the Son ( John 14:6 John 10:1 )

Something to prayerfully reconsider and discern with His help.

 

[Revmitchell]

Just as long as you recognize that this is not a denomenational teaching nor an accepted view of what is generally believed about the pre trib rapture.

Becoming a castaway happens when God judges His House first at the pre tribulational rapture event. 1 Peter 4:14-19

Have you read Luke 12:40-49 ?

Sp what happens to these cast aways where do they go to be cast aways

 

[Hark]

Sp what happens to these cast aways where do they go to be cast aways

Revelation 2:21 And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. 22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. 23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

Jesus mentioned a fire being sent on the earth to judge the world ( Luke 12:40-49 ) at the pre trib rapture event when He will judge the House of God first ( 1 Peter 4:17-19 ) . Revelation speaks of one third of the earth being burned up, and how the second angel herald the fall of Babylon ( USA ) in between the first angel spreading the gospel to everyone after the pre trib rapture and the third angel warning everyone after that world's calamity heralded by the second angel ( Revelation 14:6-11 ) that will bring about the new order order and the bio chip of the mark of the beast system to buy and sell in order to survive, thus setting up the hour of trial that shall try all upon the earth. Revelation 3:9-10

Do note that Revelation 3:10 warns about not having any one take our crown, and yet that warning comes with becoming a castaway as Paul pointed out in 1 Corinthians 9:24-27 to avoid that hour of trial that shall try all upon the earth as Revelations 3:9 reports.

The fall of Babylon due to this coming fire on the earth is in detail in Revelation 18th chapter where the saints left behind are to be killed.

This is when the voice of the bride and the bridegroom will no longer be heard in her any more because the pre trib rapture when the Bridegroom comes for the abiding bride of Christ ( Christ the firstfruits ), had come and gone which is why they are not heard any more.

Later on, they that be Christ's at His coming ( the left behind saints and any new saints ) will be resurrected AFTER Christ deals with Satan and the world's armies first ( something believers are overlooking as these saints are not meeting the Lord in the air when He has set foot on earth already ).

This is what Zechariah prophesied and Revelation confirmed that the saints coming out of the great tribulation are resurrected after Satan and the world's armies were defeated ( Revelation 20:1-6 ) and thus Jesus had already set foot on Mount of Olives where the pre trib raptured saints will be with Him. Zechariah 14:1-5

Readers confused "first resurrection" as meaning the "only" resurrection when in context, the word "first" was just deferring from the other resurrection of the dead that will happen later on. Revelation 20:5-6

So basically, that will be where the castaways shall go, into the great tribulation. Now those that have died and are with the Lord, will be under the altar in Heaven, awaiting their resurrection after the great tribulation. Revelation 7:13-17 God has to wipe the tears from their eyes because He said there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth which will be over the loss of their first inheritance of being a vessel unto honor in His House. Then they shall forever be vessel unto dishonor in His House ( 2 Timothy 2:19-21 ) testifying to the power of God in salvation for even those that just believe in His name. John 3:18 John 1:12-13 as He will lose nothing of all the Father has given Him John 6:39 & 2 Timothy 2:20

 

[Revmitchell]

Sorry there is no such monster as a Christian castaway in scripture. The church was not made for the wrath of God and we see in Rev 6 that is exactly what the tribulation period is, God's wrath. Quite honestly your wrong theology appears to be quite like the Millennial Exclusion theology.

Christians do not suffer wrath or any form of punishment. Jesus paid the full price for our sin.

 

[Hark]

Sorry there is no such monster as a Christian castaway in scripture. The church was not made for the wrath of God and we see in Rev 6 that is exactly what the tribulation period is, God's wrath. Quite honestly your wrong theology appears to be quite like the Millennial Exclusion theology.

Christians do not suffer wrath or any form of punishment. Jesus paid the full price for our sin.

Hey. I am open to learning as much as any one else is to be. We can't grow unless we edify and reprove one another in the word.

May I ask you what Paul was talking about in 1 Corinthians 3:10-17 ?

1 Corinthians 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. 11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; 13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. 14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. 16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

What is the consequence for defiling the temple of God?

How is it that in that day when the believer is judged by his works on that foundation, he will suffer loss, but still be saved so as through "fire"?

How is this not showing God's wrath on how a believer builds on that foundation?

I have another question regarding Hebrews 12th chapter, but I'll save that for the next post.

 

[Hark]

Sorry there is no such monster as a Christian castaway in scripture. The church was not made for the wrath of God and we see in Rev 6 that is exactly what the tribulation period is, God's wrath. Quite honestly your wrong theology appears to be quite like the Millennial Exclusion theology.

Christians do not suffer wrath or any form of punishment. Jesus paid the full price for our sin.

Okay. Next question: Hebrews 12th chapter. Is the Father chastening every child He receives? Can not this be seen as wrath as well? Being scourged does sound rather severe.

Hebrews 12:1 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, 2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God. 3 For consider him that endured such contradiction of sinners against himself, lest ye be wearied and faint in your minds. 4 Ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin. 5 And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him: 6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth. 7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not? 8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons. 9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live? 10 For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.

 

[Martin Marprelate]

Now why would Jesus profess to never knowing them in regards to false prophets coming in leading them astray?

Brother, with respect, I think you are making this far too complicated.
These false teachers, and others who are saying, "Lord, Lord," have never known the Lord Jesus. They have made a false profession of faith but they have never repented of their sins and trusted in Christ for forgiveness. Therefore our Lord says to them, "I never knew you." It's not that He knew them once and then forgot about them when they fell into sin; He never knew them. Not when they were 'accepting' Christ; not when they were carrying on sinning in spite of their profession of faith; not when they were making up their unbiblical teachings about Him because they do not have the Spirit of God within them. And not now when they are standing before Him on the Day of Judgement. He never knew them and they are never coming into His heaven.

Is that a scary teaching? Too right it is. Maybe it should lead us to consider 2 Corinthians 13:5.

 

[Hark]

Brother, with respect, I think you are making this far too complicated.
These false teachers, and others who are saying, "Lord, Lord," have never known the Lord Jesus. They have made a false profession of faith but they have never repented of their sins and trusted in Christ for forgiveness. Therefore our Lord says to them, "I never knew you." It's not that He knew them once and then forgot about them when they fell into sin; He never knew them. Not when they were 'accepting' Christ; not when they were carrying on sinning in spite of their profession of faith; not when they were making up their unbiblical teachings about Him because they do not have the Spirit of God within them. And not now when they are standing before Him on the Day of Judgement. He never knew them and they are never coming into His heaven.

Is that a scary teaching? Too right it is. Maybe it should lead us to consider 2 Corinthians 13:5.

Well, can you at least understand where I am coming from? This whole thing started in Matthew 7:13-15 where Jesus is warning about false prophets coming in to warn believers that they can come into the church.

Their fruit will be ecumenical in nature. Matthew 7:16

I believe this has everything to do with these "movements of the spirit" which those astray believes it is the Holy Spirit coming and going with signs and lying wonders when it is not, as you referenced 2 Corinthians 13:5 as to why not because He is in us. John 14:16-17

One movement of the spirit will accuse the other movement of the spirit of not being of God and vise versa, like the "holy laughter" movement vs those that pray for the Holy Spirit to come into the worship place to feel His Presence in the place, but they are both wrong because He is in us and does not need to be felt outside of us in the worship place where the spirit of the antichrist dwells. 1 John 4:1-4 All of these movement of the spirit share the same "tree" and that is focus on the Holy Spirit in worship in seeking Him to receive after a sign by the flesh ( the evil fruit ). Matthew 7:17-20

This is why you see believers "falling down" that Jesus was talking about ( Matthew 7:24-27 ) in these movements of the spirit when they point saved believers to go chasing after the Holy Spirit to receive after a sign, hence giving another invitation to come to God ( thus broadening the way Matthew 7:13-14 & John 10:1 ) by way of receiving the "Holy Spirit again".

This is what believers were warned about in 1 Timothy 4:1-2 as falling away from the faith in hypocrisy when the Holy Spirit is in us and thus cannot be received again and why 2 Corinthians 11:3-4 says to be aware of and to avoid.

So believers in faith, will fall away from faith, and they can claim all of these miracles and wonderful works in His name ( Matthew 7:21-23 ) but they are workers of iniquity.

If a saved believer turns around and denies Him, what will happen to him? 2 Timothy 2;12 says that he will be denied by Him, hence "I never knew you". That is what denying does.

So any work of iniquity Titus 1:16 that denies Him, He will deny them ( 2 Timothy 2:12 ).

It's not that complicated when the scripture is why I am saying this.

Believers misread Matthew 7:21-23 as meaning they were never saved and that is not the case in context. They were being denied by Him for being workers of iniquity. If they repent with His help before the Bridegroom comes to be found abiding in Him, they will be ready to go to attend the Marriage Supper and not be denied by Him from attending as Luke 13:24-30 reveals consequence of that version of Matthew 7:13-27.

 

[Revmitchell]

Hey. I am open to learning as much as any one else is to be. We can't grow unless we edify and reprove one another in the word.

May I ask you what Paul was talking about in 1 Corinthians 3:10-17 ?

1 Corinthians 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. 11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; 13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. 14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. 16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

What is the consequence for defiling the temple of God?

How is it that in that day when the believer is judged by his works on that foundation, he will suffer loss, but still be saved so as through "fire"?

How is this not showing God's wrath on how a believer builds on that foundation?

I have another question regarding Hebrews 12th chapter, but I'll save that for the next post.

For some odd reason you assume that is referencing Christians.

 

[Hark]

For some odd reason you assume that is referencing Christians.

I do not believe a non-believer would have that foundation which was laid in Christ Jesus.

1 Corinthians 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. 11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

Nor can a non-believer's body become a temple of God with the Holy Spirit in him that would be destroyed with physical death for defiling that temple with wood, stubble, and hay = works of iniquity.

1 Corinthians 3:16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

1 Corinthians 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? 20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.

This is not about loss of salvation because of ...

1 Corinthians 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

And so may He bring the true meaning on how we are to run that race by faith in Jesus Christ as our confidence is in Him to finish it to His glory.

2 Corinthians 5:9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. 10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. 11 Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

Philippians 1:6 Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ: 7 Even as it is meet for me to think this of you all, because I have you in my heart; inasmuch as both in my bonds, and in the defence and confirmation of the gospel, ye all are partakers of my grace. 8 For God is my record, how greatly I long after you all in the bowels of Jesus Christ. 9 And this I pray, that your love may abound yet more and more in knowledge and in all judgment; 10 That ye may approve things that are excellent; that ye may be sincere and without offence till the day of Christ. 11 Being filled with the fruits of righteousness, which are by Jesus Christ, unto the glory and praise of God.

2 Timothy 4:18 And the Lord shall deliver me from every evil work, and will preserve me unto his heavenly kingdom: to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

 

[Revmitchell]

I do not believe a non-believer would have that foundation which was laid in Christ Jesus.

1 Corinthians 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. 11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.

Neither do I but he was talking to the church as a whole. The church as we know it was built on the foundation of Christ but that same church has people in it who claim to be a Christian but are in fact lost. Hence, our works will be tested. Are those works built on that foundation or something else.

There is no punishment for Christians. Period. It is an absurd claim and most certainly unorthodox.

 

[Hark]

Neither do I but he was talking to the church as a whole. The church as we know it was built on the foundation of Christ but that same church has people in it who claim to be a Christian but are in fact lost. Hence, our works will be tested. Are those works built on that foundation or something else.

There is no punishment for Christians. Period. It is an absurd claim and most certainly unorthodox.

Scripture disagrees with you. And there is a lot more than just 1 Corinthians 3:10-17 & Hebrews 12:1-29 to say so too. There is John 15:1-6 There is Luke 12:40-49 I can go on.

1 Corinthians 3:10-17 cannot be about the church when warning has been given on what each of us build on that foundation. It is our individual body that is the temple of the Holy Spirit; not the place where we worship. It is the risk of a physical death for not repenting.

Romans 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

That also means those saints who walk after the flesh shall receive condemnation, otherwise, what's the point of this exhortation?

The warning is clearer here.

Romans 8:12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. 13 For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

1 Corinthians 5th chapter has Paul instructing the church to excommunicate unrepentant believers into leading them to repentance. What do you think God will do when a church fails to do that or some believers thinks he is getting away with living in sin?

That is why God is judging His House first at the pre trib rapture. 1 Peter 4:17 See how a church's excommunication mirrors what God is going to do.

1 Corinthians 5:4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, 5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

See that? See the symbolism here as God will do His own excommunication on saved believers for not abiding in Him.

Revelation 2:21 And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. 22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. 23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

This is why God will judge an unrepentant believer with physical death.

Galatians 6:7 Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. 8 For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

Galatians 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Romans 6:22 But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life. 23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

So there is an everlasting life which is the firstfruits of the resurrection where saints abiding in Him shall be received as vessels unto honor in His House whereas those that failed to look to Him for help as their Good Shepherd to discern and to depart from iniquity in abiding in Him are at risk of being left behind to be received later after the great tribulation in inheriting the terrestrial inheritance as vessel unto dishonor in His House.

So scripture does disagree with you because God the Father will chasten every wayward believer that has gone astray, but as the prodigal son has given up his first inheritance for wild living, he will find that he is still son, because salvation can never be lost, ( John 6:39 ) but not every one will be ready for the Bridegroom when He comes for the abiding bride of Christ. ( Luke 12:40-49 )

It is a terrible thing to fall into the hands of the living God. So now is the time for repentance by trusting Jesus Christ as our Good Shepherd to help us run that race by laying aside every weight & sin to abide in Him.

 

[Revmitchell]

1 Corinthians 3:10-17 cannot be about the church when warning has been given on what each of us build on that foundation.

Mat_16:18 And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

The church, according to scripture, is exactly the very foundation on which the foundation of Christ was built.

It is our individual body that is the temple of the Holy Spirit; not the place where we worship. It is the risk of a physical death for not repenting.

We, as individuals, are in fact part of the church. The church is not a building but the body of Christ.

 

[vooks]

Christians can lose their salvation is the point. Eternal security is conditional but Calvinists /Reformed Theology won't hear none of this.

The bit about pre-trib was totally unnecessary to make this point as the pre-trib theory itself is full of holes

 

[Revmitchell]

The point is not that we can lose our salvation. Eternal security of the believer is not simply a Calvinist doctrine. In fact the vast majority of Baptist hold to it.

 

[Hark]

Mat_16:18 And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

The church, according to scripture, is exactly the very foundation on which the foundation of Christ was built.

We, as individuals, are in fact part of the church. The church is not a building but the body of Christ.

Are you thinking about this scriptural reference?

Ephesians 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God; 20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone; 21 In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:

If so, I believe you are taking two symbolic metaphors to be one and the same when it is not.

1 Corinthians 3:10-17 warns about the consequence of defiling the temple of God which will be destroyed. Are you inferring that the whole church, the body of Christ will be destroyed? I would think not.

It is not a warning that can never happen when verse 15 says that those that had only built wood, stubble, and hay will suffer loss, but still be saved so as through fire. It leads into as the cause of how one defiles the temple of God and the punishment is that our individual body will be destroyed as every saint will be accountable to what we sow towards.

Jesus was and is warning believers to be ready; there is no point in warning unbelievers on how they should live this reconciled relationship with Christ when He is not in them.

Do reconsider and discern this with Him that 1 Corinthians 3:10-17 is not about the body of Christ, but individual believe's accountability. Loss of salvation is not at stake, but there is more at stake than the loss of crowns and that is to become a castaway.

1 Corinthians 9:24 Know ye not that they which run in a race run all, but one receiveth the prize? So run, that ye may obtain. 25 And every man that striveth for the mastery is temperate in all things. Now they do it to obtain a corruptible crown; but we an incorruptible. 26 I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air: 27 But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.

See that word? Don't gloss over it when Paul mention the possibility of even himself being a castaway. Why would any saint be a castaway?

Galatians 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

That's why. Are you permitting believers to live in sin in your church?

What are you supposed to do when a believer refuses correction to repent? Excommunicate.

What do you think God is going to do with an unrepentant believer living in sin when the Bridegroom comes? The Father is going to give him a scourging and a chastening that will make him a vessel unto dishonor, but still in His House to be received later on after the great tribulation.