Featured Cain and God?

Book. Chapter. Verse. You're simply writing your own narrative here. There is nothing in Scripture to support your error above.

Which Savior? The Jews looked for a Savior, and they were all confused as to what this Messiah would entail. They sought a political Messiah. They didn't seek or know or understand He would save them from their sins. None can be saved until they know the true Messiah, and those in the OT had a veil over their eyes and could NOT see this truth, 2 Corinthians 3:10ff. Your ideas are purelu romantic gnostic ideologies. Look up the word romantic to get the real sense of its usage here.

And pray tell how they would come up with such an idea as to God sending them a Savior. lolzzz. All the lost hate God, don't seek Him and don't consist of some mystical tribe seeking and hoping God will send them a Savior as you attempt to describe them. Your idealism and mystical nonsense is over the top and purely unbiblical.

And you're also showing your inconsistency here, how can they possibly be doing what you say above when they've already heard in the first place????

That is incoherent drivel and more gnostic nonsense. I'd ask for Scripture, but you'd wrest it beyond recognition.

More inconsistency. They have heard, they haven't heard. You're all over the place.

 

Genesis 15:6 And he believed in the Lord; and he counted it to him for righteousness.
The moment anyone believes the Lord it that is their faith is counted unto them for righteousness. Anyone who came to faith a nanosecond after Christ death was saved how by Faith. The same Faith as Abraham.
Hebrews 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

That would be those like the American Indians who believe in a creator God and that a savior is coming. Did they have other God's as many cultures did of course but many had true faith in the God who created and was sending a savior.

Hebrews 11:31 By faith the harlot Rahab perished not with them that believed not, when she had received the spies with peace.

Had she heard of Jesus, no had she heard the great things God had done and believed you bet she did. She was not of the Jews but og pagan idol worshipers.

1 Kings 10:
1 And when the queen of Sheba heard of the fame of Solomon concerning the name of the Lord, she came to prove him with hard questions.
2 And she came to Jerusalem with a very great train, with camels that bare spices, and very much gold, and precious stones: and when she was come to Solomon, she communed with him of all that was in her heart.

The queen of Sheba heard and came seeking.

Psalms 19:
1 The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork.
2 Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge.
3 There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard.
4 Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun,

The heavens declare the Gospel to the world, verse 3. There is nowhere that the heavens and firmament don't declare God.

 

Nope I don't have, "a doctrine of an immediate spiritual intuition of truths believed to transcend ordinary understanding, or of a direct, intimate union of the soul with God through contemplation or ecstasy." No they must believe as the O.T. people believed until God sends the gospel. Many of the so called un-reached people have spoken of looking for the savior who is coming and as those in Acts heard of Christ acknowledge He was the one they had believed was coming. Just as the American Indians were found to have believed.

Its just hard for folks who want to limit God to believe that HE can reach folks in any manner He wishes. Many want to put Him in a Box and believe He can only work the way they believe Him to work instead of realizing His Omnipotence reaches the whole world.

 

So Abraham believing God is mysticism. Very interesting that you would think that. Paul stated that Abrahams Faith in God's promises saved him.

 

You see this as mysticism, "for he that cometh to God must believe that he is," yet the writer of Hebrews stated it and it is in our Bible.

 

You see this as mysticism, "Psalms 19:
1 The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork.
2 Day unto day uttereth speech, and night unto night sheweth knowledge.
3 There is no speech nor language, where their voice is not heard.
4 Their line is gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world. In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun,"
Interesting that you believe scripture is mystic. Well at least we know where you are coming from.

 

You don't believe the Power of the Holy Spirit can reach whom He will? Again God reaches all those who by His Foreknowledge will believe. He called Abram out of Flame and Destruction. Rahab believed what she heard about God without reading or having anyone tell her of their faith. Psalms 19 makes it clear. You say it doesn't apply in our age, Paul seems to say that Psalms 19 is still true in Romans 1:20 makes all mankind without excuse. They can see God in the creation so they are without excuse.

 

I appreciate your comments. The scenario I presented you with is a true event. But I can't give information past that point.

 

The above is utter nonsense.

You just don't run out of false teaching, do you?

 

Psalms 19:1 the heavens declare the glory of God, is that not what the gospel declares? Yet you call it false teaching. You see scripture as false? WOW!

 

...and the above is yet another perfect illustration of how you do this and arrive at conclusions that are not supported by the text. For the record, it is not the Scriptures that are purporting false teaching, it is your wresting of it.

 

Here we see how it is arrived at John Calvins words:

Excerpts from John Calvin Commentary on Psalms 19:

this psalm consists of two parts, in the first of which David celebrates the glory of God as manifested in his works; and, in the other, exalts and magnifies the knowledge of God which shines forth more clearly in his word. He only makes mention of the heavens; but, under this part of creation, which is the noblest, and the excellency of which is more conspicuous, he doubtless includes by synecdoche the whole fabric of the world. There is certainly nothing so obscure or contemptible, even in the smallest corners of the earth, in which some marks of the power and wisdom of God may not be seen; but as a more distinct image of him is engraven on the heavens, David has particularly selected them for contemplation, that their splendor might lead us to contemplate all parts of the world. When a man, from beholding and contemplating the heavens, has been brought to acknowledge God, he will learn also to reflect upon and to admire his wisdom and power as displayed on the face of the earth, not only in general, but even in the minutest plants. In the first verse, the Psalmist repeats one thing twice, according to his usual manner. He introduces the heavens as witnesses and preachers of the glory of God, attributing to the dumb creature a quality which, strictly speaking, does not belong to it, in order the more severely to upbraid men for their ingratitude, if they should pass over so clear a testimony with unheeding ears. This manner of speaking more powerfully moves and affects us than if he had said, The heavens show or manifest the glory of God. It is indeed a great thing, that in the splendor of the heavens there is presented to our view a lively image of God; but, as the living voice has a greater effect in exciting our attention, or at least teaches us more surely and with greater profit than simple beholding, to which no oral instruction is added, we ought to mark the force of the figure which the Psalmist uses when he says, that the heavens by their preaching declare the glory of God.
The repetition which he makes in the second clause is merely an explanation of the first. David shows how it is that the heavens proclaim to us the glory of God, namely, by openly bearing testimony that they have not been put together by chance, but were wonderfully created by the supreme Architect. When we behold the heavens, we cannot but be elevated, by the contemplation of them, to Him who is their great Creator; and the beautiful arrangement and wonderful variety which distinguish the courses and station of the heavenly bodies, together with the beauty and splendor which are manifest in them, cannot but furnish us with an evident proof of his providence. Scripture, indeed, makes known to us the time and manner of the creation; but the heavens themselves, although God should say nothing on the subject, proclaim loudly and distinctly enough that they have been fashioned by his hands: and this of itself abundantly suffices to bear testimony to men of his glory. As soon as we acknowledge God to be the supreme Architect, who has erected the beauteous fabric of the universe, our minds must necessarily be ravished with wonder at his infinite goodness, wisdom, and power… Day after day, or one day to another day, is of little consequence; for all that David means is the beautiful arrangement of time which the succession of days and nights effects. If, indeed, we were as attentive as we ought to be, even one day would suffice to bear testimony to us of the glory of God, and even one night would be sufficient to perform to us the same office. But when we see the sun and the moon performing their daily revolutions, — the sun by day appearing over our heads, and the moon succeeding in its turns — the sun ascending by degrees, while at the same time he approaches nearer us, — and afterwards bending his course so as to depart from us by little and little; — and when we see that by this means the length of the days and nights is regulated, and that the variation of their length is arranged according to a law so uniform, as invariably to recur at the same points of time in every successive year, we have in this a much brighter testimony to the glory of God.

 

more from Calvin:

David, therefore, with the highest reason, declares, that although God should not speak a single word to men, yet the orderly and useful succession of days and nights eloquently proclaims the glory of God, and that there is now left to men no pretext for ignorance; for since the days and nights perform towards us so well and so carefully the office of teachers, we may acquire, if we are duly attentive, a sufficient amount of knowledge under their tuition… The heavens, it is true, are mute and are not endued with the faculty of speech; but still they proclaim the glory of God with a voice sufficiently loud and distinct. But if this was David’s meaning, what need was there to repeat three times that they have not articulate speech? It would certainly be spiritless and superfluous to insist so much upon a thing so universally known. The other exposition, therefore, as it is more generally received, seems also to be more suitable. In the Hebrew tongue, which is concise, it is often necessary to supply some word; and it is particularly a common thing in that language for the relatives to be omitted, that is to say, the words which, in which, etc., as here, There is no language, there is no speech, [where (445) ]their voice is not heard. (446) Besides, the third negation, בלי, beli, (447) rather denotes an exception to what is stated in the preceding members of the sentence, as if it had been said, The difference and variety of languages does not prevent the preaching of the heavens and their language from being heard and understood in every quarter of the world. The difference of languages is a barrier which prevents different nations from maintaining mutual intercourse, and it makes him who in his own country is distinguished for his eloquence, when he comes into a foreign country either dumb or, if he attempt to speak, barbarous. And even although a man could speak all languages, he could not speak to a Grecian and a Roman at the same time; for as soon as he began to direct his discourse to the one, the other would cease to understand him. David, therefore, by making a tacit comparison, enhances the efficacy of the testimony which the heavens bear to their Creator. The import of his language is, Different nations differ from each other as to language; but the heavens have a common language to teach all men without distinction, nor is there any thing but their own carelessness to hinder even those who are most strange to each other, and who live in the most distant parts of the world, from profiting, as it were, at the mouth of the same teacher… That the Hebrew word קו, kav, signifies a line in writing, (449) is sufficiently evident from Isaiah 28:10, where God, comparing the Jews to children who are not yet of sufficient age to make great proficiency, speaks thus:

“For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little.”

In my judgment, therefore, the meaning is, that the glory of God is not written in small obscure letters, but richly engraven in large and bright characters, which all men may read, and read with the greatest ease. Hitherto I have explained the true and proper meaning of the inspired writer.

Some have wrested this part of the psalm by putting upon it an allegorical interpretation; but my readers will easily perceive that this has been done without reason. I have shown in the commencement, and it is also evident from the scope of the whole discourse, that David, before coming to the law, sets before us the fabric of the world, that in it we might behold the glory of God. Now, if we understand the heavens as meaning the apostles, and the sun Christ, there will be no longer place for the division of which we have spoken; and, besides, it would be an improper arrangement to place the gospel first and then the law. It is very evident that the inspired poet here treats of the knowledge of God, which is naturally presented to all men in this world as in a mirror; and, therefore, I forbear discoursing longer on that point. As, however, these allegorical interpreters have supported their views from the words of Paul, this difficulty must be removed. Paul, in discoursing upon the calling of the Gentiles, lays down this as an established principle, that, “Whoever shall call upon the name of the Lord, shall be saved;” and then he adds, that it is impossible for any to call upon him until they know him by the teaching of the gospel. But as it seemed to the Jews to be a kind of sacrilege that Paul published the promise of salvation to the Gentiles, he asks whether the Gentiles themselves had not heard? And he answers, by quoting this passage, that there was a school open and accessible to them, in which they might learn to fear God, and serve him, inasmuch as “the writing (450) of the heavens has gone forth through all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world,” (Romans 10:18.) But Paul could not at that time have said with truth, that the voice of the gospel had been heard through the whole world from the mouth of the apostles, since it had scarcely as yet reached even a few countries. The preaching of the other apostles certainly had not then extended to far distant parts of the world, but was confined within the boundaries of Judea. The design of the apostle it is not difficult to comprehend. He intended to say that God, from ancient times, had manifested his glory to the Gentiles, and that this was a prelude to the more ample instruction which was one day to be published to them. And although God’s chosen people for a time had been in a condition distinct and separate from that of the Gentiles, it ought not to be thought strange that God at length made himself known indiscriminately to both, seeing he had hitherto united them to himself by certain means which addressed themselves in common to both; as Paul says in another passage, that when God,

“in times past, suffered all nations to walk in their own ways, he nevertheless left not himself without a witness,”
(Acts 14:16.)

We see that he concludes what Paul meant and what David meant was that no people in any place are left without a witness.

 

Now let's also look to Matthew Henry from his commentary on Psalms 19 I am not going to post it all as I only posted an excerpt from Calvin before,

"III. To whom this declaration is made of the glory of God. It is made to all parts of the world (Psalm 19:3,4): There is no speech nor language (no nation, for the nations were divided after their tongues, Genesis 10:31,32) where their voice is not heard. Their line has gone through all the earth (the equinoctial line, suppose) and with it their words to the end of the world, proclaiming the eternal power of God of nature, Psalm 19:4. The apostle uses this as a reason why the Jews should not be angry with him and others for preaching the gospel to the Gentiles, because God had already made himself known to the Gentile world by the works of creation, and left not himself without witness among them (Romans 10:18), so that they were without excuse if they were idolaters, Romans 1:20,21. And those were without blame, who, by preaching the gospel to them, endeavoured to turn them from their idolatry. If God used these means to prevent their apostasy, and they proved ineffectual, the apostles did well to use other means to recover them from it. They have no speech or language (so some read it) and yet their voice is heard. All people may hear these natural immortal preachers speak to them in their own tongue the wonderful works of God."

Thus their are people who have heard and are not without witness. Some would hear that there is a great creator God like the, so where or why did the American Indians have these Gods,


Ababinili is the Creator God of the Chickasaw tribe. His name means "one who sits above" or "dwells above," and he is associated with the Sun. Ababinili is considered to be a divine spirit with no human form or attributes and is not normally personified in Chickasaw myths.

Gudatrigakwitl means "The Ancient One Above" in the Wiyot language, and is the Wiyot name for the Creator (God.) Gudatrigakwitl is a divine spirit with no human form or attributes and is never personified in Wiyot myths.

History of the Anishinaabek

In the beginning, Gizhemanidoo created the universe as we know it today. He created Grandfather Sun and Grandmother Moon, Mother Earth and Father Sky. And on the earth he created all things, living and nonliving. He created life in the earth, on the earth, in the sky and in the water. He created the plants, rivers, four-legged and winged creatures, and the swimmers. After this was done, he created one of the greatest mysteries of all – the four seasons – to bring harmony and balance to all.

After all creation was complete, he created man. After he created the first Anishinaabe, he came to him in a dream and instructed him that he was to name all things in the language that he gave him, Anishinaabemowin. So the first man went about on his journey and named all things he saw – all the animals, insects, birds and fish – however long this took. Afterward, he spoke to the Creator Gizhemanidoo in his dream and said, “I have finished what you have told me to do.” Then the Creator Gizhemanidoo spoke back to him and said, “Yes, you have indeed done so, and now it is time for me to give you your name. Your name shall be Nanabozho, and whenever your people meet and greet one another, they will say a part of your name. That is why whenever the Anishinaabe people greet one another, they say the word Bozhoo.

If someone didn't tell them the heavens did according to Psalms 19:1-4,

Paul said God is not without a witness as Calvin pointed out with this

“in times past, suffered all nations to walk in their own ways, he nevertheless left not himself without a witness,”
(Acts 14:16.)