Featured About Hebrews' warning: Do not draw back to perdition

O Boy!
I Cor. 6:9. 'Do you not know that the unrighteous will not enter the kingdom of God? DO NOT BE DECEIVED!' It looks like we've got another deceived person come on the forum. That's OK. You'll feel right at home here.

He certainly is! "Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name and done may wonders in Your name?' And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you [N.B. not, "I knew you once and then forgot about you"]; depart from Me, all you who practise lawlessness!'" (Matthew 7:22-23).

'...Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some.....' (Hebrews 10:25).
'They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that it might be made manifest, that none of them were of us' (1 John 2:19). Leaving a church because you get tired of it, or because you think it's baloney, or because you don't have time for it is, to put it mildly, not a great evidence of salvation.

 

The unrighteous are the unsaved. Not the sinning saints. We are righteous because Jesus makes us that way! Not because we 'keep ourselves in some church or keep ourselves saved and sinless'!

None of those folks were saved. The only unpardonable sin is to reject Jesus and His salvation and Holy Spirit.

In this day and age that would likely not involve the church system! If it did, it would not mean weekly rites of repetition and ceremony.

Going to church is not a great evidence either! If some insincere spies were faking it and among the persecuted early believers, yes, when they leave it is because they were never sincere. That does not apply to believers. Period.

 

You're missing the forest for the trees. The epistle is written to believers in the church (1 Corinthians) as a warning to those who would live in a lifestyle of sin and expect eternal life. He does not want anyone to be deceived. Perhaps this would be those in the presence of the Lord in Matthew 7:21ff.

Also no one is saying we keep ourselves saved, your merely showing your inability to distinguish between evidence of conversion and works salvation. And yes, there are much Scriptures that show there are evidences of true conversion, and evidences of false conversion.

Agree there...

Not really. There are some going to hell who never rejected either as they are already under condemnation; John 3:17; Ephesians 2:3.

This is how you treat the passage in Hebrews?

No one said it applies to believers - you're too busy conflating things to listen to the Word of God and presuppose what others are thinking and believe. This is why you come up with straw man arguments.

 

The same folks who had a guy that was having sex with his mother if I recall. The so called lifestyle of sin is a a phrase that is a haven for cranks and religious fanatics to try to judge others for little sins! The harlot was saved by Jesus. The tax collector. The bible is full of sinful men and their deeds. The sin is to reject Jesus. God judges our works after that not you. Yes spies who were insincere would have been among believers! That doesn't mean that believers or saved folks were not really saved.

No there are not. The saved are always saved, and those with not so great works get not so great rewards.

No having condemnation does not mean going to hell! No more than having depresion, or doubts, or fears of the enemy does. We are not to fall into his condemnation trip.

That means nothing. Some preacher can claim half the folks in his building are not really saved. Not really believers. Soon as they sin...or get caught that is..that confirms it in their minds! Absurd.

 

Define Spirit filled! For Paul commanded us all to be Filled With Sporit, meaning we control being filled woth the Spirit, so how do we control it?

 

Baptism of the Holy Spirit occurs at salvation and is not a separate event. We are dipped in the Holy Spirit when He comes and indwells us. That is the Baptism, at the same time we are indwelt we are also filled by the Holy Spirit. That is He fully controls us and when does His control of stop? When we son after salvation, we become controlled by sin, the old nature. How do we get the filling back we confess our sin and the Spirit takes back control.

 

The indwelling of the Spirit is not synonymous with the filling. We are indwelt with the Spirit at Salvation and Paul makes it clear we remain indwelt.
1 Corinthians 3:
16 "Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?
17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are."

1 Corinthians 6:
19 "What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's."

The Holy Spirit indwells every single believer and when we sin we defile the temple of the Holy Spirit which is our body.

But Paul's gives us a command,
Ephesians 5:
17 "Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is.
18 And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit;
19 Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord;"

Be filled with the Spirit that is a command and we told not to be drunk with wine to excess, that not to allow sin to control but to allow the Spirit to control.

They are not synonymous.

Colossians 1:
8 "Who also declared unto us your love in the Spirit.
9 For this cause we also, since the day we heard it, do not cease to pray for you, and to desire that ye might be filled with the knowledge of his will in all wisdom and spiritual understanding;
10 That ye might walk worthy of the Lord unto all pleasing, being fruitful in every good work, and increasing in the knowledge of God;"

Paul and his companions prayed that the Colossian believers would continue in their Spiritual walk and one can only have a Spiritual walk when they are filled with the Spirit. He already we can defile the temple by walking in sin and yet the Spirit still indwells us but then he commands in Ephesians 5:18 that we be filled with the spirit and prays that the Colossian believers would continue a walk worthy of the lord and that walk can only be with the filling of the Spirit.

As to the Baptism of the Spirit we see the seven one things Paul gives to us in,
Ephesians 4:
4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

One body of those born again believers, One Spirit the Holy Spirit, One hope in Jesus Christ, One Lord the Lord Jesus, One Faith in which One Baptism The Baptism of the Holy Spirit, One God and Father of all.

 

So we agree on a point, filling and indwelling are not synonymous

 

Trying to figure out what you are trying to say? Does all this mean you agree the saved still remain saved even if the blow it?

 

Yes once saved always saved because the indwelling Spirit never leaves us.

 

Who saved them?
Did God save them, or did they save themselves?

 

Oh, I see, it's not really biblical, it's just cranks and religious fanatics that do this. Rolleyes

Must be what Paul and John were, as Paul mentions this practice of sin, and that those who do such will not enter the kingdom (written as a warning to actual professing believers in churches) and the apostle John also does this in his epistle of 1 John, also written to believers to warn them.

Now, do tell us all which "little sins" Christ bore to Calvary.

 

So you're saying there are no Scriptures that show evidence of true conversion and of false? Correct?