Featured Alien Baptism

This is the bit I have a problem with. It's denominationalism. There will be no denominations in heaven, so we really ought to being trying to do without them now. To deny another church's baptism is to deny that it is a church, but even that is not the real point. Baptism isn't the property of any one church or denomination; believers are baptized into Christ, not into a church.

It may well be as valid as yours. Laugh

Really? And where exactly is that in the Bible? I have seen pictures of ancient baptisteries that simply would not accommodate someone lying out full stretch.

 

This is a problem. There are fine paedobaptist churches in Britain (though very few fine Methodist churches), but I think we can't recognize infant baptism as valid. You may disagree, but I think that is a different issue to telling someone who has been baptized by immersion on his profession of faith that its not good enough because it wasn't done in one of 'our' churches.

Yes. We have a chap in our church who has a phobia about putting his head under water. The thought of having water going up his nose scared him witless. In the end, we had him kneel in the water and our minister pushed his head quickly under the water. It's possible to scoff at fears like that, but in fact it was one of the bravest things I've seen. The guy was shaking like a leaf when he entered the baptistery, but he was determined to follow his Lord. His joy afterwards was wonderful to see!

I wouldn't tell someone who had had the triple immersion that he has to have a fourth one.

 

I have absolutely no authority to violate the authority of any church, even if I wanted to. I merely do what I suppose everybody does on a discussion forum- I give my understanding and hope that it may influence others.

 

Since preachers like to alliterate, here's my four points of scriptural baptism:

The Right Pattern - Full immersion in water

The Right Person - A professed believer in Jesus Christ.

The Right Purpose - Symbolic of the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus.

The Right Permission - Performed under the authority of a New Testament Church.

Also most immersions performed by non-Baptist churches not only fail to qualify on #4, but also on #3. If you were immersed by a pedobaptist church (like Methodist or Presbyterian), your immersion did not symbolize the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus. Pedobaptists believe baptism is symbolic of the Holy Spirit, not the Resurrection of Jesus. Something to think about!

For more good quotes from our Baptist Heritage check out my website at:https://westkentuckybaptist.wordpress.com/

 

The idea of being re-baptized to fit a particular denomination is not Biblical and, without meaning to be insulting here, a slap in the face of God.

We are baptized, as believers, into the body of Christ, not the local church. If a true believer has been baptized, accept it on their word. It will be between them and God at that point.

 

This part of your post is exactly right. Baptism proclaims our identification with Christ. Church membership proclaims our identification with the local church- that is, our joining together with its people and our submission to its constitution and discipline.

 

I agree that baptism proclaims our identification with Christ. But, respectfully, do you have any Scriptural evidence that baptism is baptism in the local church body? I didn't realize it was the church body that saved me, but Christ Himself. As for me, I was baptized into Christ, not into a local expression of His body.

For Scripture on this, I turn to Ephesians:4:4-6:

4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,
6One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

There is only one baptism ... not many. All these terms are being used in their universal sense to express that we are all one in Christ. One Lord, one faith, one baptism.

There is also one body, not many. That one body (the church) expresses itself regionally in the local churches. We are baptized into that one body, the church. Colossians 1:8: "And he is the head of the body, the church ..."

 

I agree that we are baptized into Christ at the moment of belief and that water baptism is an outward expression of that.

Every believer, as priests and kings, filled with the Holy Spirit, have the authority to do something as simple as a water baptism. This concept gets cleared up when we realize that as members of Christ's body, we are the one church invisible, the universal church, but that that that one universal church expresses itself locally and regionally when believers of that one church gather locally.

Believing that there is One Body does not automatically equate with Roman Catholicism and "baby sprinkling", any more so than that the doctrine of the Trinity (Godhead) is not exclusive to the Roman Catholic church.

I don't know if you have time or care to watch this, but I did a sermon title, The Universal Church, where I explain my views on this.

I also know that Baptists have a hard time with the idea of a universal church, but nevertheless, the Bible speaks of it in Colossians 1:8, and other verses, where the "the body" is equated with "the church" (singular).

That one church, which is the one body of Christ, expresses itself regionally, i.e. the "local church".

Once this doctrine is understood, water baptism becomes clear.

 

Do you have time to watch the sermon I posted above? I explain in great detail why there is one church which expresses itself regionally in many churches.

Matthew 16:18, the first time church appears in the Bible, it is used in the singular, describing the whole church that Jesus built (not churches): "And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.”

That is the church universal, the one church, the one body of Christ spoken of in Ephesians 4, which you have not yet addressed.

We see through the book of Acts that this one church began in Jerusalem, and that once the church was persecuted at the hands of the physical circumcision (the Jews), and by Saul of Tarsus, the one church spread abroad into Asia Minor and localized expressions of that one church were established in various cities.

That is why they continued to call the churches, "THE church at Antioch", "THE church at Ephesus", "THE church at Rome", etc. It was the one, singular church, united in faith, and doctrine, one body, one baptism, but now meeting in different locales.

Again, we this is in Colossians, speaking of the entire body of Christ, not just the local church at Colossae.

Colossians 1:24: "Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for >>> his body's sake, which is the church <<<".

How many bodies does Christ have? He has one body, not many. He has one head, and one body, which is THE church.

There is a duality. There is one church, many local expressions of that one church. Baptists have a real hard time with this, I understand that, but the "local church only" concept is not Biblical. Is Christ's body divided? Does He have one head and thousands of bodies? No. He has one head, one body, one church.

The Bible defines "the body" as "the church".

 

Not only does this misrepresent anything he has said it is ridiculous. It is poor debate tactic to characterize someone else's position and then paint it broadly like this. You need to just stick to what he said and avoid poor characterizations.

 

the fact is both are true, there is the local assembly where we are to serve God faithfully and there is the broader world wide church made up of believers everywhere. It is poor exposition to emphasize one over the other except where certain things can only be applied. Jesus said He would build his church. He said this knowing that his disciples were to go out and start churches everywhere.