In another thread Reynolds stated :
In what ways do you think that the SBC is getting liberal?
In what ways do you think that the SBC is getting liberal?
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Is the SBC getting liberal?
- Thread starter Salty
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Uh no its not. Not even close.
Actually the opposite is true. The Conservative Resurgence has brought the SBC back to its roots (in most areas).
The Seminaries, for the most part, are back in the hands of conservatives.
Granted the younger generation of leaders does things a lot different than we old guys, but "different" does not necessarily mean "bad" or "liberal."
The word "liberal" when used in this context means "Modernism." "Liberal Theology" is a denial of some or all of the old fundamentals of the faith.
For the most part, those who would deny such basic truths have already left the Convention and many have affiliated with the CBF.
The Seminaries, for the most part, are back in the hands of conservatives.
Granted the younger generation of leaders does things a lot different than we old guys, but "different" does not necessarily mean "bad" or "liberal."
The word "liberal" when used in this context means "Modernism." "Liberal Theology" is a denial of some or all of the old fundamentals of the faith.
For the most part, those who would deny such basic truths have already left the Convention and many have affiliated with the CBF.
There are some who are in the BGCT that affiliate with both
and I sure the same is true with BGC, VA and the SB Conservatives of VA.
I doubt the conservatives are supporting the CBF.
Not the CBF - the GBC, VA - the General Baptist Convention of VA Formed in 1899.
At times, when a church calls a new pastor - the church will change Commonwealth affiliations (BGC-VA / SBC- VA) as many members have no ideal what the difference is
Is the SBC getting liberal?
SBC ~ CBF ~ GBC ~ BGCT ~ SB
liberal ~
open to new behavior or opinions and willing to discard traditional values.
The fact is;
The world at large is getting more and more liberal.
The fact is;
New behaviors are encouraged.
Opinions supersede Facts as acceptable.
Traditional values ARE discarded.
The fact is;
Public schools ARE encourage and accepted, and OFTEN have a LEGAL attendance requirement.
Public schools DO promote and encourage Liberalism, and HAVE for MANY years.
Public schools DO have control over a child's MIND the MAJORITY of a child's formative years.
The fact is;
ANYONE, unwilling to accept, agree or participate in Liberalism, is badgered and labeled, with a long list of "generally touted" as "unfavorable" terms and labels.
The fact is;
Such "terms" (labels);
examples being; hater, bigot, homophobic, racist, blah, blah....
1) ARE labels being "OFTEN" "dictated" by the Liberal, AS the position of ANOTHER, true or not.
2) ARE NOT "illegal" positions for anyone to believe, think, be or claim for themselves.
3) ARE specifically designed to DEFLECT away from the INTENDED goal of promoting Liberalism.
The fact is:
Liberals title themselves AS TOLERANT, "while", using their LIST, to tag others, and THEN what?
No one is noticing it is the Liberals WHO ARE badgering others of things they are NOT TOLERANT of?
The fact is;
Liberals HAVE re-defined TOLERANCE, to suit THEIR agenda. And IF another does not AGREE with THEM, "the other" IS "according to Liberals", INTOLERANT. <--- handy eh? LOL
Now to the question of the OP ~
Different RACES exist.
Different CULTURES exist.
Different TRADITIONS exist.
And whether or not one will ADMIT IT, Religious beliefs ARE part of a persons Culture and Tradition.
AND ~ For ONE race of people OF the SAME CULTURE and SAME TRADITIONS to form a "league" (or organization or whatever you want TITLE it), for the express purpose of preserving their CULTURE and TRADITION <---- THAT......IS Biblical....AND....IS precisely WHY individuals CHOOSE to associate with such "league".
Race of people? Yes. Race is not only about skin color. Human is a race. Jews are a race. People from certain geographical areas have historically defined a people's culture and traditions and race, (and still do today, ie Arab-American, African-American). <--- Arab gives us the geographical area of their historical culture and traditions, and American gives us notice of their "citizenship", while also giving us notice their historical culture and traditions they maintain, ie void of assimilation.
AND ~ WHEN "any individual" outside of, such culture and traditions, WANT TO JOIN IN, with such established "culture and traditions" ..... THEY DO SO, BY ASSIMILATION....which is to SAY, they adopt, accept and participate in such cultures and traditions.
What is the topic of the OP ~ IS an OUTSIDER ~ ie Someone of a different race, different culture, different traditions.....DICTATING "ANOTHER", should "adopt" their culture and traditions, based on "their" opinions.
This is NOT unique to Religious organizations. Because IF you open your eyes, it is the SAME Liberals promote for foreigners coming into the US, which in a nutshell is the COMPLETE opposite of ASSIMILATION.
It is a constant preaching in combination that the US has NO culture or traditions, or that they are So OUTDATED, or that they are SO unacceptable....
....that assimilation of Foreigners is NOT GOOD, but that INSTEAD the US should adopt and become assimilated with Foreign cultures and traditions.
Dilemma IS; THE FEAR of being TAGGED with a Liberals "list" of unfavorable "terms".
Thus Liberal TACTICS, for some time has been VERY favorable to the Liberal agenda.
And will remain so, UNTIL, someone who IS the spokesman for the "league" (organization) has enough fortitude to STOP trying to defend themselves against "the name calling", and simply REJECT the "same calling" and STAND UP for their OWN established customs, their OWN established traditions, AND that they HAVE no desire to adopt an others agenda, AND THEN say, ANYONE desiring to ASSIMILATE WITH our customs and our traditions are most welcome to do so.
PERIOD.
(and FYI ~ IF one IS familiar with the LEGAL intent of allowing a foreigner to become a US citizen, it specifically includes ASSIMILATION....which is completely "opposite" of the Liberal agenda)
SBC ~ CBF ~ GBC ~ BGCT ~ SB
liberal ~
open to new behavior or opinions and willing to discard traditional values.
The fact is;
The world at large is getting more and more liberal.
The fact is;
New behaviors are encouraged.
Opinions supersede Facts as acceptable.
Traditional values ARE discarded.
The fact is;
Public schools ARE encourage and accepted, and OFTEN have a LEGAL attendance requirement.
Public schools DO promote and encourage Liberalism, and HAVE for MANY years.
Public schools DO have control over a child's MIND the MAJORITY of a child's formative years.
The fact is;
ANYONE, unwilling to accept, agree or participate in Liberalism, is badgered and labeled, with a long list of "generally touted" as "unfavorable" terms and labels.
The fact is;
Such "terms" (labels);
examples being; hater, bigot, homophobic, racist, blah, blah....
1) ARE labels being "OFTEN" "dictated" by the Liberal, AS the position of ANOTHER, true or not.
2) ARE NOT "illegal" positions for anyone to believe, think, be or claim for themselves.
3) ARE specifically designed to DEFLECT away from the INTENDED goal of promoting Liberalism.
The fact is:
Liberals title themselves AS TOLERANT, "while", using their LIST, to tag others, and THEN what?
No one is noticing it is the Liberals WHO ARE badgering others of things they are NOT TOLERANT of?
The fact is;
Liberals HAVE re-defined TOLERANCE, to suit THEIR agenda. And IF another does not AGREE with THEM, "the other" IS "according to Liberals", INTOLERANT. <--- handy eh? LOL
Now to the question of the OP ~
Different RACES exist.
Different CULTURES exist.
Different TRADITIONS exist.
And whether or not one will ADMIT IT, Religious beliefs ARE part of a persons Culture and Tradition.
AND ~ For ONE race of people OF the SAME CULTURE and SAME TRADITIONS to form a "league" (or organization or whatever you want TITLE it), for the express purpose of preserving their CULTURE and TRADITION <---- THAT......IS Biblical....AND....IS precisely WHY individuals CHOOSE to associate with such "league".
Race of people? Yes. Race is not only about skin color. Human is a race. Jews are a race. People from certain geographical areas have historically defined a people's culture and traditions and race, (and still do today, ie Arab-American, African-American). <--- Arab gives us the geographical area of their historical culture and traditions, and American gives us notice of their "citizenship", while also giving us notice their historical culture and traditions they maintain, ie void of assimilation.
AND ~ WHEN "any individual" outside of, such culture and traditions, WANT TO JOIN IN, with such established "culture and traditions" ..... THEY DO SO, BY ASSIMILATION....which is to SAY, they adopt, accept and participate in such cultures and traditions.
What is the topic of the OP ~ IS an OUTSIDER ~ ie Someone of a different race, different culture, different traditions.....DICTATING "ANOTHER", should "adopt" their culture and traditions, based on "their" opinions.
This is NOT unique to Religious organizations. Because IF you open your eyes, it is the SAME Liberals promote for foreigners coming into the US, which in a nutshell is the COMPLETE opposite of ASSIMILATION.
It is a constant preaching in combination that the US has NO culture or traditions, or that they are So OUTDATED, or that they are SO unacceptable....
....that assimilation of Foreigners is NOT GOOD, but that INSTEAD the US should adopt and become assimilated with Foreign cultures and traditions.
Dilemma IS; THE FEAR of being TAGGED with a Liberals "list" of unfavorable "terms".
Thus Liberal TACTICS, for some time has been VERY favorable to the Liberal agenda.
And will remain so, UNTIL, someone who IS the spokesman for the "league" (organization) has enough fortitude to STOP trying to defend themselves against "the name calling", and simply REJECT the "same calling" and STAND UP for their OWN established customs, their OWN established traditions, AND that they HAVE no desire to adopt an others agenda, AND THEN say, ANYONE desiring to ASSIMILATE WITH our customs and our traditions are most welcome to do so.
PERIOD.
(and FYI ~ IF one IS familiar with the LEGAL intent of allowing a foreigner to become a US citizen, it specifically includes ASSIMILATION....which is completely "opposite" of the Liberal agenda)
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TMI ~ sorry, I can't not remove my post. Maybe you can. I have to remind myself TMI is unacceptable on this forum.
liberal ~
open to new behavior or opinions and willing to discard traditional values.
The fact is;
The world at large is getting more and more liberal.
Happy is a copy and paste artist who doesn't even understand what she copies and pastes.
Anyone with an IQ greater than his (or her) hat size knows that "liberal" when used in a theological context means "having no unified set of propositional beliefs."
In other words (dumbed down for a certain reader) the "propositional beliefs" of the old fundamentals of the faith have been denied in whole or in part.
Anyone with an IQ greater than his (or her) hat size knows that "liberal" when used in a theological context means "having no unified set of propositional beliefs."
In other words (dumbed down for a certain reader) the "propositional beliefs" of the old fundamentals of the faith have been denied in whole or in part.
Happy is a copy and paste artist who doesn't even understand what she copies and pastes.
Anyone with an IQ greater than his (or her) hat size knows that "liberal" when used in a theological context means "having no unified set of propositional beliefs."
In other words (dumbed down for a certain reader) the "propositional beliefs" of the old fundamentals of the faith have been denied in whole or in part.
liberal ~
open to new behavior or opinions and willing to discard traditional values.
LOL ~
"the old fundamentals of the faith have been denied"
"willing to discard traditional"
Gee....who knew, those are LIKE POLAR OPPOSITES......
Do they make a hat large enough to fit your size?
Do you also consider yourself a copy and paste artist?
I must commend you, you are not only understanding what you copied and pasted, but you have mastered putting to use "Elbert Hubbards" quote.
I believe the convention is getting much more liberal as a southeren baptist. The problem lies in both the younger generation, which I am a part of, and reduced fidelity to the bible. I was taught when I became a southern baptist that we are the types to quote the bible all the time when we run into a real question or make an important decision. The bible is the rule of life for all southern baptists.
Nowadays I see all kinds of problems though:
1. Charismatic influence
2. Using reason and logic to answer a serious question or seek guidance for a serious problem instead of going to the bible
3. Growing acceptance of popular culture
4. Increased acceptance of divorce and divorcee culture
5. Some acceptance of the whole "relevance" church fad
6. More leadership roles for women
7. An "ecumenical spirit" especially towards Rome and other Protestants, despite our Anabaptist history
That induced mental stress. I may expand later.
Nowadays I see all kinds of problems though:
1. Charismatic influence
2. Using reason and logic to answer a serious question or seek guidance for a serious problem instead of going to the bible
3. Growing acceptance of popular culture
4. Increased acceptance of divorce and divorcee culture
5. Some acceptance of the whole "relevance" church fad
6. More leadership roles for women
7. An "ecumenical spirit" especially towards Rome and other Protestants, despite our Anabaptist history
That induced mental stress. I may expand later.
I must add the following to my examples of a liberalizing Southern Baptist Convention:
8. This may have been the case before recently, but I detect some strands of the health and wealth Gospel as put forward by Joel Osteen. The idea that God really wants us to live like kings on earth despite the fact we are to mimic the life of Jesus of all people.
9. A quenching of our outrage at broken homes as we just get used to a new norm in this nation
10. I don't know if this is liberalizing, but we have disastrous youth and college programs that lose us ~80% of those who went through our children's programs
11. Of course, all of this comes before the real good work of a baptist denomination, which is to get back to the churches of the New Testament. Something already abandoned it seems in the Convention, as we gear towards adapting to the culture around us instead of resisting it with holiness and godliness.
8. This may have been the case before recently, but I detect some strands of the health and wealth Gospel as put forward by Joel Osteen. The idea that God really wants us to live like kings on earth despite the fact we are to mimic the life of Jesus of all people.
9. A quenching of our outrage at broken homes as we just get used to a new norm in this nation
10. I don't know if this is liberalizing, but we have disastrous youth and college programs that lose us ~80% of those who went through our children's programs
11. Of course, all of this comes before the real good work of a baptist denomination, which is to get back to the churches of the New Testament. Something already abandoned it seems in the Convention, as we gear towards adapting to the culture around us instead of resisting it with holiness and godliness.
How so?
Doctrine wise, I agree. Behavior on social issues is where I disagree. The SBC as of late has gone on its apology tour for being ashamed of its past. Our delegate came back from the convention last year saying he thought that the name Southern in the name SBC was actually in jeopardy. Fast forward to this year, divisive bad behavior is rewarded because a prominent BLACK pastor was the sponsor.
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