Atonement

I would like for our PSA advocates to point out in the scriptures where it says Jesus paid the penalty for our sins.

 

Martin, you seem to assume God cursed the Son as if in vengeance.

Does not the word “cursed” (Galatians 3) also mean one doomed to destruction, one under divine judgement?

When Christ (took, bore, became) sin, Devine judgement was assigned, just as the Scriptures state.

What is not shown in Scriptures was some vengeance poured out by God as a result, for Christ being made without sin can and did take the judgment for sin and it result in God being pleased, not vengeful.

To assume the definition of vengeance in this verse (related to one hanging on a tree) is inconsistent with the statements concerning the crucifixion in other places. The proper definition must be one under divine judgement.

Corinthians states that God made Him sin. (2 Corinthians 5:21).

It makes no sense for God to have vengeance for what He (God) did.

Again, God making the one who knew no sin, sin was pleasing to God.

Divine judgment was assigned, not vengeance.

 

Well I do not know what I can do to help you other than to suggest that you keep reading Deuteronomy 21:22-23 and Galatians 3:13 until the truth dawns.

 

You seem to pit Scriptures as refuting Scriptures by insisting on a definition of vengeance.

Such is not good when presenting.

Rather, Scripture supports, defines, and clarifies other Scripture, which means vengeance as a definition is unsupportable.

 

Well here you are, JonC; let's cut to the chase. Answer the following plain and simple questions.
1. Was Christ made a curse?
2. For whom was He made a curse?
3. Who cursed Him?

And I agree with Justin Martyr and Martin Luther.

'For Christ is innocent as concerning His own person, and therefore He ought not to have been hanged on a tree: but because, according to the law of Moses, every thief and every malefactor ought to be hanged, therefore Christ also, according to the law, ought to be hanged, for He sustained the person of a sinner and a thief, not of one, but of all sinners and thieves, and therefore guilty of death and everlasting damnation. But Christ took our sins upon Him, and for them died upon the cross; therefore it behoveth that He should become a transgressor, and (as Isaiah saith, chapter liii) "be reckoned among the transgressors".........................But some will say, it is absurd and slanderous to call the Son of God a cursed sinner. I answer, if thou wilt deny Him to be a sinner and accursed, deny also that He was crucified and dead.' [Martin Luther]

 

The best I can come up with.

For the wages of sin is death; Rom 6:23
For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; 1 Cor 15:3
All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and the LORD hath laid on him the iniquity of us all. Isa 53:6

 

Let me dovetail this in and see if it applies to your thought.

Duet 32:35,36 To me belongeth vengeance, and recompence; their foot shall slide in due time: for the day of their calamity is at hand, and the things that shall come upon them make haste. For the LORD shall judge his people, and repent himself for his servants, when he seeth that their power is gone, and there is none shut up, or left.

Did not God take vengeance upon himself by sending his Son, through woman, in the flesh, to become a curse for us in order to gather his people unto himself? The Son being paid our sin debt in our stead?

 

God cannot take vengeance upon himself. Vengeance belongs to God. He has the authority to recompence. "Vengeance is mine, I will repay."

God cannot have poured out vengeance upon the Son, because the Son was God in the flesh.

As the song says,

1. For me it was in the garden
   He prayed: “Not My will, but Thine.”
   He had no tears for His own griefs,
   But sweat drops of blood for mine.
2. In pity angels beheld Him,
   And came from the world of light
   To comfort Him in the sorrows
   He bore for my soul that night.
3. He took my sins and my sorrows,
   He made them His very own;
   He bore the burden to Calv’ry,
   And suffered and died alone.

(Charles H. Gabriel, "My Savior's Love" My Savior’s Love > Lyrics | Charles H. Gabriel )

 

OK. Let's try again. Read Deuteronomy 21:22-23 and tell me: who cursed Christ?

 

Galatians 3:13

 

I wonder if you would like to look at the verses in Deuteronomy again and tell me where the word 'esteemed' is. I have highlighted the most relevant portion for you

Deuteronomy 21:22-23 "If a man has committed a sin worthy of death and he is put to death, and you hang him on a tree, his corpse shall not hang all night on the tree, but you shall surely bury him on the same day (for he who is hanged is accursed of God), so that you do not defile your land which the LORD your God gives you as an inheritance.

Quite. But that does not alter the fact that on the cross Christ suffered the curse of God for us. Since you say you agree with Luther on PSA, let's hear from him: 'Paul therefore doth very well allege this general sentence out of Moses as concerning Christ. "Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree." But Christ hath hanged on a tree, therefore Christ was accursed of God' [Luther on Galatians 3:13]. Do you agree with Luther? Yes or no.

Certainly the Lord Jesus was/is 'holy, harmless undefiled' and certainly men quite correctly esteemed Him 'stricken, smitten by God and afflicted' because that is what He was. 'It pleased the LORD to bruise Him; He has put Him to grief.' Certainly also He was crucified at the hands of godless men, but the Holy Spirit is content to lay the responsibility squarely upon God.
Who bruised the Christ? Who put Him to grief? Yahweh did!

BTW, since God Himself supernaturally turned day into night while Christ hung upon the tree (Mark 15:33 etc.), He did actually hang there at night. He really did carry that curse for us.

It would be great to discuss the meaning of these amazing facts and glory in the amazing love of the Father who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him up for us all [edited]

 

same thing.

 

I'm not blind enough to miss the shenanigans you play with the text.