Why Would SDA Members Hang Out on BB?

That is a good approach -- get to the details... the specifics and compare them to the Bible

In fact in some forms of that - we are following the dictates of God's sovereign will .. just like the Arminian is following the sovereign dictates of God to expose the flaws in Calvinism .. which is one of the problems with Calvinism.

2 Tim 3:16
16 All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;

Paul does not say "just some scripture... just the words in red"

 

And you can see a "Calvinists have the wrong gospel" sort of thread on the Arminian vs Calvinist section of this board.

Arguing against false teaching for an actual Bible student - would require an actual Bible discussion. .Notice how many of the recent plethora of threads attacking Adventists -- avoid the Bible like it was the plague. That is 'instructive' for the unbiased objective reader.

Insulting someone because they challenge you to be objective is not the sign of having a secure position.

 

My point is simple, this "your going to he'll because you don't agree with me " childishness is the exact reason why myself and so many others are Non-denominational. We are so fed up with denominations fighting over who has the better brand of religion that we decide to hold on to what we all have in common, the Gospel. Furthermore, this childish bickering is what causes millions to run from the Church.

In regards to my seminary schooling, I go to an amazing Baptist Seminary. Yes, they teach Baptist doctrine, and Lutherianism, Methodism, Pentocostalism, ect. Because my school prides itself on diversity. In my class, you would find Anglicans, Methodists, Presbyterians, Pentocostals, and more. It is because the school teaches something called "critical thinking" and encourages us to come to our own conclusions based on the evidence provided.

And my statements about reformed theology are 100% true. The gospel only applies to the elect, if one is not elect it doesn't matter if they believe a false gospel. If they are elect, it doesnt matter if they follow a false gospel because the "irresistible grace" of God will inevitably draw the elect to the true Gospel. So why continue to further divide the Church with useless arguing.

The same goes to these SDA preaching nonsense about being the only ones with truth. Know who else says that, Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons, Roman Catholics, Muslims, and yes...even reformed Calvinist. It is crazy that when a searcher finally makes the decision to become a Christian (after having to decide between every other religion claiming the be the only one right), only to be met with denominations claiming they are the only ones who got it right and the rest are going to Hell. Most go running for the hills laughing. I challenge you to go to any atheist forum and tell me I am wrong.

I am calling for Christian unity. If that makes me obtuse then so be it! And in regards to the Gospel, denominations can't even agree with what "the Gospel" really is. How are we supposed to correctly choose the right "brand" of gospel from the right "brand" of Christianity.

There, I am done... go on fighting amongst yourselves. The Baptist church seems to be spending a lot of time fighting amongst eachother on Calvinism vs Arminianism so I will leave you all alone to figure it out for yourself.

 

Unity, though very much desired, must be based in Truth, not simply to cease factions. It can only be that way, John 17:17 KJB and:

John 17:21 KJB - That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.​

What is truth, according to scripture?

"... After a long and severe conflict, the faithful few decided to dissolve all union with the apostate church if she still refused to free herself from falsehood and idolatry. They saw that separation was an absolute necessity if they would obey the word of God. They dared not tolerate errors fatal to their own souls, and set an example which would imperil the faith of their children and children's children. To secure peace and unity they were ready to make any concession consistent with fidelity to God; but they felt that even peace would be too dearly purchased at the sacrifice of principle. If unity could be secured only by the compromise of truth and righteousness, then let there be difference, and even war. 4SP 46.2 ..." - The Spirit of Prophecy, vol. 4, Page 46 - The Spirit of Prophecy, vol. 4, Page 46 -- Ellen G. White Writings

Revelation 12:7 KJB - And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,

Revelation 12:8 KJB - And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
​

 

1 Timothy 3:16 does not say that all scripture is necessary for salvation. Which is the point I made. I 100% agree that all scripture is useful. But not all scripture is necessary to be saved. The Gospel is necessary for salvation, how much gospel did the thief on the cross believe and practice?

 

I agree.

In Romans 2:13-16 Paul speaks of the fact of salvation that is happening even with people with no access to the Bible at all.

He is not making the case for "no bible" just that
God is "the evangelist" who "Draws ALL mankind unto Him"John 12:32
and "Convicts the WORLD of sin and righteousness and judgment" John 16...
not just Christians.

If our rule was to ask "what is the most that God can do with the least amount of Bible" -- then the answer is "full salvation" for someone with "no Bible at all" according to Romans 2.

God does not ask us to get out there and evangelist because "He is helpless without us" but rather for our own good.

 

Just to be clear, I am not calling for unity at the expense of truth. I am calling for unity on what we all can agree with to be true and it is pretty much laid out in the Nicine creed (which even Catholics agree to). I am not even saying we cannot disagree about things. It's ok to have arguments and debate. But don't tell a Christian that their salvation is somehow in question because of your disagreement.

To reformed and that Brian, I posted several statements from official SDA sources stating what they officially believe. And yes, it was pretty much the basic concepts of the gospel. Yet I heard very little from you both or any Baptist for that matter expressing any disagreement. Why is it so difficult to stand together as Christians on that. Why question their salvation?

 

No one goes to heaven because they choose to agree with some other person or goes to hell because they do not. What matters is the Word of God ... the Holy Spirit convicts each person of Truth .. Jesus said "I AM the way the Truth and the life" John 14 and in 2Thess 2 Paul says that at the end of time people "perish who did not receive a love of the Truth so as to be saved".

Someone could read what I just posted there and respond "Bob I don't agree with your post" and that will not get them lost. In the end - what matters is following what the Holy Spirit is saying.

If you follow me around on this board and you will find that I repeatedly quote the "Baptist Confession of Faith" section 19, and the "Westminster Confession of Faith" section 19 and D.L. Moody and Dies Domini by Pope John Paul II and "The Faith Explained" by Leo Trese (Commentary on the Catholic Catechism post-Vatican II) and a other documents by other groups - strongly affirming what they are teaching there. Not because I agree with very last word they say on all topics - but because on some points I find that we have common ground.

(I have not been doing that recently because a certain person has decided to start a bazillion threads on the one-topic of "why I don't like Ellen White" or "Why I don't like Seventh-day Adventists")

And what is amazing is that the "common ground" is often some teaching that is the most opposed among people of that SAME denomination. Where I am being hammered by them for teaching what their own scholars teach.

 

Your straw man is easily seen. Nowhere did I ever say the angel is pointing to the fourth commandment. And nowhere in the text does the angel say anything about the fourth commandment. Making stuff up doesn't get you the results you have imagined it would.

The facts remain. Now do you have any supporting scripture that would cause you to believe the angel is speaking of the Sabbath commandment? Certainly any unbiased Bible student can see the angel said nothing about the Sabbath commandment.

Please tell us you have not based your belief on something not spoken in scripture, something derived only out of a pure speculation of emotion?

 

As a Seventh-day Adventist, I am not bound by any 'creed', but am bound to the Bible [KJB].

The 'Nicene creed' has doctrinal issues, by very word definition built into it, of which, I, based upon scripture [KJB] cannot align, nor adhere, to in agreement. What those are, I am not going to presently discuss tonight.

"Catholics" indeed agree to it, and there is reason for it.

I do not tell people they are going to hell if they do not believe me. God is judge, and He knoweth the hearts. I can only relate to what comes out of the heart through the mouth/fingers, and I may test the words by the scripture [KJB].

 

Why Would CALVINIST Members Hang Out on BB?

All the baptist I ever met ZERO are Calvinist probably wouldn't know what one was.


Talk about "hiding affiliations".


How about starting a new faith instead of hitchhiking on the baptist banner. You can call the denomination......CALVINIST.

You wouldn't pack a church tho.

IF anyone wanted to start a denomination they have a easy time starting a baptist church and no one can stop you.

Westboro Baptist...... Any one want to guess if they Calvinist or not?


If I were Calvinist, why would I debate anyone? You already convinced that you can't convince only God can, so communication really only needs to be directed to God.

And since all regeneration happens on hearing the Gospel, It doesn't matter where they hear it from. You should have folks spontaneously becoming Calvinist out of the blue in everywhere the gospel is heard.

 

worship Him who made the heaven and the earth and sea and springs of waters.” Rev 14:7
For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea and all that is in them Ex 20:11
God, who made the heaven and the earth and the sea and all that is in them. Acts 14:15

ahhh -- we can all see it now -- those texts don't appear to have any connection at all just as you have imagined for us. ...

oh no wait!!

I think you just "undid" your own imaginative post.

.. thanks.

hmmm...

And good thing you said that since we have this Bible detail - glaringly obvious to all of us...!!

worship Him who made the heaven and the earth and sea and springs of waters.” Rev 14:7
For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea and all that is in them Ex 20:11
God, who made the heaven and the earth and the sea and all that is in them. Acts 14:15

Until you read the actual Bible...

worship Him who made the heaven and the earth and sea and springs of waters.” Rev 14:7
For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea and all that is in them Ex 20:11
God, who made the heaven and the earth and the sea and all that is in them. Acts 14:15

Making stuff up doesn't get you the results you have imagined it would.

The facts remain.

hmmmm.... let me think... I had it... just a minute ago..

Oh yes here it is..

worship Him who made the heaven and the earth and sea and springs of waters.” Rev 14:7
For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea and all that is in them Ex 20:11
God, who made the heaven and the earth and the sea and all that is in them. Acts 14:15

I really to enjoy these little forays "into the obvious" and the fact that each time you ask that we do this.. you keep asking for it to be done over and over

Certainly any unbiased Bible student can see the angel said this about the Sabbath commandment.

worship Him who made the heaven and the earth and sea and springs of waters.” Rev 14:7
For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea and all that is in them Ex 20:11
God, who made the heaven and the earth and the sea and all that is in them. Acts 14:15

Please tell us you have not based your belief on something not spoken in scripture, something derived only out of a pure speculation

 

That last post - was particularly rewarding..

 

He, the penitent thief [who had robbed God of righteousness], believed all the Word of God [and every word that proceeded out of His mouth] who hung upon the cross next to him.

 

Everyone, I am going to pause the discussion for a moment to ask for everyone's prayers. My wife just went into labor. Please pray that she and the baby are safe and healthy. Thank you.

 

So is the part about the Sabbath just a figment of your imagination? You do see the angel said nothing about the Sabbath commandment? Well, obviously you don't. But why not is the real question. To what gain is there to add to Gods word that which is not there? Is it emotionalism?

 

Well, actually he believed Jesus is the Son of God. The only requirement for justification.

 

Update, it was a false alarm. But she and the baby are going to be fine.

 

The text:

Luke 23:27 KJB - And there followed him a great company of people, and of women, which also bewailed and lamented him.

Luke 23:28 KJB - But Jesus turning unto them said, Daughters of Jerusalem, weep not for me, but weep for yourselves, and for your children.

Luke 23:29 KJB - For, behold, the days are coming, in the which they shall say, Blessed are the barren, and the wombs that never bare, and the paps which never gave suck.

Luke 23:30 KJB - Then shall they begin to say to the mountains, Fall on us; and to the hills, Cover us.

Luke 23:31 KJB - For if they do these things in a green tree, what shall be done in the dry?

Luke 23:32 KJB - And there were also two other, malefactors, led with him to be put to death.

Luke 23:33 KJB - And when they were come to the place, which is called Calvary, there they crucified him, and the malefactors, one on the right hand, and the other on the left.

Luke 23:34 KJB - Then said Jesus, Father, forgive them; for they know not what they do. And they parted his raiment, and cast lots.

Luke 23:38 KJB - And a superscription also was written over him in letters of Greek, and Latin, and Hebrew, THIS IS THE KING OF THE JEWS.

Luke 23:40 KJB - But the other answering rebuked him, saying, Dost not thou fear God, seeing thou art in the same condemnation?

Luke 23:41 KJB - And we indeed justly; for we receive the due reward of our deeds: but this man hath done nothing amiss.

Luke 23:42 KJB - And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.

Luke 23:43 KJB* - And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day, shalt thou be with me in paradise.​

The two malefactors, went with Jesus from the prison, to Golgatha, Calvary. They saw and beheld all the things done unto Jesus, and the things He said to them in return, and in how He prayed for His tormentors forgiveness. They knew what the sign read over Jesus' head, and they had known from the prison about this man, Jesus, and the rumors and events that surrounded Him. This single malefactor, a nameless nobody who had come to nothing, and Jesus, the man with the only name under heaven given among men, whereby anyone is saved, Creator and owner of the world, and thus are contrasted the Great Controversy, the old man of sin, and the Man without sin, a man who had squandered his borrowed life, and the one who is Life and lives it, a man who had been filled with the things of satan, and the man who had been filled without measure with the Spirit of God; both hiding nothing from the other, both naked, both revealed to all the world, onlookers and Heaven, sinful, poor, pitiful, lost and broken humanity having no name, no future, next to Jesus [JEHOVAH is Salvation], KING of Kings and LORD of Lords, high and exalted, lifted up for the whole world to see in His perfect character of love, forgiveness, justice and righteouness.

The malefactor, saw and heard all these things, the judgments of God to come, the prophecies of Jesus, the forgiveness He offered, and came to receive faith, and so believed all the Word of God - Jesus, that which was written about Him above His head, and all the words that had then proceeded out of the mouth of God manifest in the fallen sinful flesh of mankind.

The malefactor gave voice to his new found faith, acknowledging his own sins and the sinlessness of Jesus, and calling upon Him, saying, "Lord ...", and acknowledging Jesus as such, and that He rightfully had a "kingdom", and desire to be saved, and in it.

Jesus, despised and rejected, no one then truly appreciating who He was, or His mission, or even of what He was right then doing, - the great I AM, even with you alway even unto the end of the world, but only one single nameless man, who looked upon Him as Lord. Jesus even died for that one, even if no one else in all the world would have accepted Him.