Is it Right to Pray for Justice and Vengeance?

[Steven Yeadon]

I have wanted more and more to pray for justice and vengeance from the LORD against those that do harm to the lowly or persecute the saints. It finally got to the point that I call out to the LORD in pain for those so harmed on a regular basis. This may sound well and good at first, but in praying, I am realizing that I am asking for wrath against many people in America, the West, and on the news. Is it right to daily call out for justice against people I know or know of? I do pray for these enemies as well that they may be saved, and that they may have joy every day for as long as they can.

I have just run out of fuse wire myself on issues of justice, but I know that God is far more persevering and loving than I am. I feel I must do something, and I settled on praying for justice and vengeance, the most powerful thing I could do.

 

[Rob_BW]

I can definitely relate, and reading through the Psalms, it seems we are in good company. Now, I don't recall praying for vengeance, per se. But in all things, God's will be done.

 

[1689Dave]

I have wanted more and more to pray for justice and vengeance from the LORD against those that do harm to the lowly or persecute the saints. It finally got to the point that I call out to the LORD in pain for those so harmed on a regular basis. This may sound well and good at first, but in praying, I am realizing that I am asking for wrath against many people in America, the West, and on the news. Is it right to daily call out for justice against people I know or know of? I do pray for these enemies as well that they may be saved, and that they may have joy every day for as long as they can.

I have just run out of fuse wire myself on issues of justice, but I know that God is far more persevering and loving than I am. I feel I must do something, and I settled on praying for justice and vengeance, the most powerful thing I could do.

I have seen God's wrath on those who have persecuted me over the years. But it means trusting him to deal with the persecutors and staying out of it. Some might say, "oh well, they just died early of natural causes." But if you believe God controls all, it is easy to see his wrath in those who persecute you and other believers.

“Do not avenge yourselves, dear friends, but give place to God’s wrath, for it is written, “Vengeance is mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. Rather, if your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him a drink; for in doing this you will be heaping burning coals on his head.Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.” (Romans 12:19–21) (NET)

 

[Steven Yeadon]

I have seen God's wrath on those who have persecuted me over the years. But it means trusting him to deal with the persecutors and staying out of it. Some might say, "oh well, they just died early of natural causes." But if you believe God controls all, it is easy to see his wrath in those who persecute you and other believers.

“Do not avenge yourselves, dear friends, but give place to God’s wrath, for it is written, “Vengeance is mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. Rather, if your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him a drink; for in doing this you will be heaping burning coals on his head.Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.” (Romans 12:19–21) (NET)

The reason I feel currently justified to pray for justice is the parable of the persistent widow:

Luke 18:1-8
Then Jesus told his disciples a parable to show them that they should always pray and not give up. 2 He said: “In a certain town there was a judge who neither feared God nor cared what people thought. 3 And there was a widow in that town who kept coming to him with the plea, ‘Grant me justice against my adversary.’

4 “For some time he refused. But finally he said to himself, ‘Even though I don’t fear God or care what people think, 5 yet because this widow keeps bothering me, I will see that she gets justice, so that she won’t eventually come and attack me!’”

6 And the Lord said, “Listen to what the unjust judge says. 7 And will not God bring about justice for his chosen ones, who cry out to him day and night? Will he keep putting them off? 8 I tell you, he will see that they get justice, and quickly. However, when the Son of Man comes, will he find faith on the earth?”


I make it a habit to love on all those in person that persecute Christians or harm the lowly, as I know what the bible tells me. Only if I am an authority or if I know an authority that would punish these crimes, do I seek justice temporally.

Nevertheless, I still pray for justice though, which includes meting out vengeance and giving punishment to the wrongdoing party. If the persistent widow did it and so do the saints crying out to God out of their pain, then so should I it reasons.

 

[Baptist Believer]

I have just run out of fuse wire myself on issues of justice, but I know that God is far more persevering and loving than I am. I feel I must do something, and I settled on praying for justice and vengeance, the most powerful thing I could do.

There are actually two basic questions here:
(1) Is it okay and honorable that I want to call down God's justice and vengeance upon others?
Sometime yes, often no. The circumstances determine what is correct. As Rob pointed out, the Psalms show a number of prayers/songs along this line.

(2) Can I trust God enough to pray honestly and earnestly, knowing that God will do what is appropriate with my requests, as well as work within me to bring my heart in line with His?
Yes, absolutely.

 

[HankD]

I have seen God's wrath on those who have persecuted me over the years. But it means trusting him to deal with the persecutors and staying out of it. Some might say, "oh well, they just died early of natural causes." But if you believe God controls all, it is easy to see his wrath in those who persecute you and other believers.

“Do not avenge yourselves, dear friends, but give place to God’s wrath, for it is written, “Vengeance is mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. Rather, if your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him a drink; for in doing this you will be heaping burning coals on his head.Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.” (Romans 12:19–21) (NET)

I do believe however we can bring our case before the LORD showing those who are unjustly persecuting us or speaking lies and leaving it in his hands.

I would say however there is a line that can be crossed and then it becomes a matter of prayer for resolution and even perhaps a legal matter of libel, slander and/or defamation of character.

 

[1689Dave]

Nevertheless, I still pray for justice though, which includes meting out vengeance and giving punishment to the wrongdoing party. If the persistent widow did it and so do the saints crying out to God out of their pain, then so should I it reasons.

When Jesus prayed "Father forgive them" I think it sent me in that direction. I pity the lost but realize they are conjuring up wrath fro themselves apart from me asking for it. But I can see it your way too. The martyrs in Revelation ask how long until God visits his wrath on their murderers.

 

[TCassidy]

I have seen God's wrath on those who have persecuted me over the years.

You have been persecuted? How? When? Where?

 

[1689Dave]

You have been persecuted? How? When? Where?

I thought Christian persecution is common to all who follow Christ. Perhaps a testimony section where others might join in too?

 

[TCassidy]

I thought Christian persecution is common to all who follow Christ. Perhaps a testimony section where others might join in too?

Perhaps we have a different definition of "persecution." Heb 12:4 "You have not yet resisted unto blood."

 

[1689Dave]

Perhaps we have a different definition of "persecution." Heb 12:4 "You have not yet resisted unto blood."

“Now in fact all who want to live godly lives in Christ Jesus will be persecuted.” (2 Timothy 3:12) (NET)

 

[TCassidy]

“Now in fact all who want to live godly lives in Christ Jesus will be persecuted.” (2 Timothy 3:12) (NET)

Yes, in Paul's day Christians were in the vast minority and such persecution was rampant. Today, in this country, not so much.

 

[1689Dave]

Yes, in Paul's day Christians were in the vast minority and such persecution was rampant. Today, in this country, not so much.

My experience with this scripture is different from yours. Proving that we can both experience the same scripture in different ways. I know this, the carnally minded crowd I once ran in, hates me until this day. Why? The carnal mind is enmity against God. People do not hate those who think like them.

 

[Steven Yeadon]

Yes, in Paul's day Christians were in the vast minority and such persecution was rampant. Today, in this country, not so much

I don't understand your use of Hebrews 12:4. I see no context in Hebrews 12 to denote that is what persecution looks like, especially since the bible shows persecution can take the form of confiscated property or imprisonment.

According to biblegateway, 2 Timothy 3:12's word for persecute means:
to put in rapid motion; to pursue; to follow, pursue the direction of

I see no reference to bloodshed, only of being pursued by someone wanting to harm you.

Not many Christians persecuted overseas get blood drawn, as imprisonment and confiscation of property are quite common. Abusers pursuing Christians to harm us in any panoply of ways besets all believers the world over, which is in line with the scripture referenced. In America I know we are persecuted by the increasing oppression that comes form a denial of religious liberty and the slander that besets our community. Of course, this persecution is light compared to most overseas.

 

[1689Dave]

I don't understand your use of Hebrews 12:4. I see no context in Hebrews 12 to denote that is what persecution looks like, especially since the bible shows persecution can take the form of confiscated property or imprisonment.

According to biblegateway, 2 Timothy 3:12's word for persecute means:
to put in rapid motion; to pursue; to follow, pursue the direction of

I see no reference to bloodshed, only of being pursued by someone wanting to harm you.

Not many Christians persecuted overseas get blood drawn, as imprisonment and confiscation of property are quite common. Abusers pursuing Christians to harm us in any panoply of ways besets all believers the world over, which is in line with the scripture referenced. In America I know we are persecuted by the increasing oppression that comes form a denial of religious liberty and the slander that besets our community. Of course, this persecution is light compared to most overseas.

I think if we surround ourselves with Christians and work for Christians, we insulate ourselves from persecution. Many come up in sheltered environments and remain in them through bible college and into the pulpit. But dragging Jesus' cross along with you in the pagan workplace can present some real tests of faith. Especially in upper management when your work orders run against the grain of Christ from start to finish. You can expect demotion, loss of wages, threats of replacement, segregation, and ongoing intimidation. There are other forms of persecution when going against the government (Kim Davis, the Christian Bakers, Conscientious Objectors, etc.,) when they try to force you to comply under threat of law and imprisonment. So sheltered is good, but we cannot use it as a standard for persecution when others pay many dues following Christ on a daily basis.

 

[Steven Yeadon]

I think if we surround ourselves with Christians and work for Christians, we insulate ourselves from persecution. Many come up in sheltered environments and remain in them through bible college and into the pulpit. But dragging Jesus' cross along with you in the pagan workplace can present some real tests of faith. Especially in upper management when your work orders run against the grain of Christ from start to finish. You can expect demotion, loss of wages, threats of replacement, segregation, and ongoing intimidation. There are other forms of persecution when going against the government (Kim Davis, the Christian Bakers, Conscientious Objectors, etc.,) when they try to force you to comply under threat of law and imprisonment. So sheltered is good, but we cannot use it as a standard for persecution when others pay many dues following Christ on a daily basis.

What you call sheltered, I call isolated and lonely. In modern parlance, abused by neglect. There are bible verses on this form of pain such as Psalms 25:16-21.

No where in scripture do I find it accepted to pursue being persecuted. In fact, we are told to live quiet lives (1 Thessalonians 4:11). The problem here is that if we know that being baker will get us persecuted, then we should reconsider being bakers. Unless God makes it clear to be a baker. What if the government decides to take away our livelihood after years of baking, while we knew this would likely happen? Shouldn't we do what is prudent and wise, and avoid jobs that will get us persecuted, unless God has made it plain to us to do that job?

 

[Darrell C]

I have wanted more and more to pray for justice and vengeance from the LORD against those that do harm to the lowly or persecute the saints. It finally got to the point that I call out to the LORD in pain for those so harmed on a regular basis. This may sound well and good at first, but in praying, I am realizing that I am asking for wrath against many people in America, the West, and on the news. Is it right to daily call out for justice against people I know or know of? I do pray for these enemies as well that they may be saved, and that they may have joy every day for as long as they can.

I have just run out of fuse wire myself on issues of justice, but I know that God is far more persevering and loving than I am. I feel I must do something, and I settled on praying for justice and vengeance, the most powerful thing I could do.

If you are viewing the nonsense of the Liberal Movement and Agenda as persecution, I'm going to have to say I think your imprecations should cease:


Luke 9:54-56
King James Version (KJV)

54 And when his disciples James and John saw this, they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did?

55 But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of.

56 For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them. And they went to another village.


Pray rather that God move in their hearts.

Our efforts should always be for the purpose of men being saved, not damned.

Even Liberals.




God bless.

 

[1689Dave]

What you call sheltered, I call isolated and lonely. In modern parlance, abused by neglect. There are bible verses on this form of pain such as Psalms 25:16-21.

No where in scripture do I find it accepted to pursue being persecuted. In fact, we are told to live quiet lives (1 Thessalonians 4:11). The problem here is that if we know that being baker will get us persecuted, then we should reconsider being bakers. Unless God makes it clear to be a baker. What if the government decides to take away our livelihood after years of baking, while we knew this would likely happen? Shouldn't we do what is prudent and wise, and avoid jobs that will get us persecuted, unless God has made it plain to us to do that job?

I'm not looking for persecution. I'm only saying the Christian can expect it in the workplace. The Disciples did not go looking for it, it found them and hunted them down.
“Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.” (2 Timothy 3:12) (KJV 1900)

 

[supersoldier71]

Pray that God's will be done, and pray for our enemies.

This is very difficult,

But remember that sin--all sins--fall into one of two binary categories.

If the person that sins against you is subsequently saved and repents, then his sin (along with yours and mine!) is nailed to the cross and covered by the Blood.

If not...God has that sorted in the proper time, at the proper place and in the proper measure.

 

[Steven Yeadon]

If you are viewing the nonsense of the Liberal Movement and Agenda as persecution, I'm going to have to say I think your imprecations should cease:


Luke 9:54-56
King James Version (KJV)

54 And when his disciples James and John saw this, they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did?

55 But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of.

56 For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them. And they went to another village.


Pray rather that God move in their hearts.

Our efforts should always be for the purpose of men being saved, not damned.

Even Liberals.




God bless.

What you refer to, the average liberalizers of America, they would be mild sinners compared to what I am talking about generally. I mean, I imagine in a prayer against Christian persecutors and harmers of the lowly, they may come up before the LORD. But I am not praying against them primarily, and they are not even really on my mind when I pray.

I am far more angry at aborters or those preaching perverted sexuality to children than the average liberal. That forgets though the crimes against our Brethren overseas or against the lowly the world over. To America's credit, right or left, we try and offer our lowly people some assistance. How do I put it, I am praying primarily for justice against those that torment people here on earth.