Arrogance of changing Scripture

And to say that it means 'gods' is to have Jesus claiming other men are also gods as He is God ... hence the confusion of many who read those words and struggle to honestly understand what Jesus' intended meaning was.

 

I choose option (3), which you do not list. Jesus was testing their Bible knowledge, and they failed miserably.

The OT word elohim, which is in the plural, can mean "judges," not just "gods." You've used Strong's dictionary, but that is not very reliable. BDB, the standard Hebrew lexicon, has "(plural) 1a) rulers, judges 1b) divine ones 1c) angels 1d) gods." The word was used in Ps. 82:6

However, the LXX (Septuagint translation) that the opponents of Jesus used had the Greek plural theoi, "gods," so Jesus was testing their knowledge. The actual meaning in Ps. 82:6 was "judges," and it is also used that way in Ex. 21:6 (and other verses): "Then his master shall bring him unto the judges."

 

It cannot mean as literal gods, for that would mean Benny Hinn is right, in that we are born again as little gods now...
I think that Jesus point was indeed they know not the scriptures nor God, for if mortal men who stood in for God as judges for Him could be called "gods", how much more the One who stands in as Judge for God who is also the Son of God be called God?

 

Once again, your poor syntax betrays you. "A verse that was not judges." What do you mean by that? I'm going to assume you are saying that elohim in Ps. 82:6 should not be translated "judges." Can you prove that? Do you know a single scholar who agrees with you?

V. 3 makes it plain that the elohim in v. 6 were judges: "Defend (Heb. "judge") the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy." Here is what the commentary by Keil and Delitzsch says on Ps. 82:6. "God Himself speaks in Psa_82:5 (v. 6--JoJ) of the judges, but reluctantly alienated from them; and confident of the futility of all attempts to make them better, He tells them their sentence in Psa_82:6" (v. 7--JoJ; vol. 5, p. 403).

I don't know what you are trying to say here. What do you mean by "It"?

You say that in John "they are not being stated they are judges." On the contrary, Jesus was directly comparing them to the unjust and unrighteous judges of Ps. 82. They were committing the same sins: judging unrighteously (Ps. 82:2), ignoring the poor and orphans (v.3), etc.

V. 1 plays on two meanings of elohim: God Himself, and "the gods." Then v. 6 plays on those meanings with the meaning of "judge." The meaning in v. 6 cannot be idolatrous gods, which are not gods at all and are not even alive. (How would lifeless idols die, as per v. 7? I saw many idols in Japan of stone, brass, gold, etc.--they never even twitch, much less die. ) So it must be referring to human "gods," ie, judges, the other meaning of "gods." The Pharisees were clueless of all of this, and that is why they could not answer Jesus.

 

There is a sense in which human judges are 'gods' (with a small g). If you will recall the time of Moses, someone with an 'issue' would go to one of Moses' appointed helpers to 'judge' the matter. If necessary, the matter could be taken to Moses himself (the man who spoke with GOD face to face). If Moses felt the matter required an even higher authority, GOD was available in the tent outside the camp to judge the matter Himself.

Under the theocracy, GOD allowed and expected men to stand in for GOD and pass righteous judgements of life and death on people as 'gods' standing in for the one true GOD. It is not an accident that the word for God, Angel and Judge is the same ... there is a real relationship implied and expected. So much greater was the sin of the corrupt Judges of Psalm 82 ... they had not only done evil to the people, they had slandered the name and honor of God by betraying a holy trust.

 

Removing this verse from its context gives a false impression of its meaning.

It must be reconciled with these verses:
[Act 10:42 NASB] 42 "And He ordered us to preach to the people, and solemnly to testify that this is the One who has been appointed by God as Judge of the living and the dead.
[2Ti 4:1 NASB] 1 I solemnly charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by His appearing and His kingdom:
[1Pe 4:5 NASB] 5 but they will give account to Him who is ready to judge the living and the dead.

 

HOW? Like this:

Matthew 25:31-46 NASB

31 “But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered before Him; and He will separate them from one another, as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats; 33 and He will put the sheep on His right, and the goats on the left.

34 “Then the King will say to those on His right, ‘Come, you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. 35 For I was hungry, and you gave Me something to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me something to drink; I was a stranger, and you invited Me in; 36 naked, and you clothed Me; I was sick, and you visited Me; I was in prison, and you came to Me.’ 37 Then the righteous will answer Him, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry, and feed You, or thirsty, and give You something to drink? 38 And when did we see You a stranger, and invite You in, or naked, and clothe You? 39 When did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?’ 40 The King will answer and say to them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of these brothers of Mine, even the least of them, you did it to Me.’

41 “Then He will also say to those on His left, ‘Depart from Me, accursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels; 42 for I was hungry, and you gave Me nothing to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me nothing to drink; 43 I was a stranger, and you did not invite Me in; naked, and you did not clothe Me; sick, and in prison, and you did not visit Me.’ 44 Then they themselves also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not take care of You?’ 45 Then He will answer them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.’ 46 These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”​

 

Here is John 8:15 in the context of the entire paragraph containing the sentence:

John 8:12-20 NASB

12 Then Jesus again spoke to them, saying, “I am the Light of the world; he who follows Me will not walk in the darkness, but will have the Light of life.” 13 So the Pharisees said to Him, “You are testifying about Yourself; Your testimony is not true.” 14 Jesus answered and said to them, “Even if I testify about Myself, My testimony is true, for I know where I came from and where I am going; but you do not know where I come from or where I am going. 15 You judge according to the flesh; I am not judging anyone. 16 But even if I do judge, My judgment is true; for I am not alone in it, but I and the Father who sent Me. 17 Even in your law it has been written that the testimony of two men is [fn]true. 18 I am He who testifies about Myself, and the Father who sent Me testifies about Me.” 19 So they were saying to Him, “Where is Your Father?” Jesus answered, “You know neither Me nor My Father; if you knew Me, you would know My Father also.” 20 These words He spoke in the treasury, as He taught in the temple; and no one seized Him, because His hour had not yet come.
​

Respectfully, I will not spoon feed you. You will need to chew it for yourself.

Who is he talking to?
What are they accusing him of?
When does this occur?
Where is he?
Why is he talking with them?
How does this paragraph fit in with the Gospel narrative that John is carefully unfolding?

Then you can decide exactly what Jesus was saying in verse 15. [HINT: Jesus was not saying that He never judges anyone.]

[Act 10:42 NASB] 42 "And He ordered us to preach to the people, and solemnly to testify that this is the One who has been appointed by God as Judge of the living and the dead.
[2Timothy 4:1 NASB] 1 I solemnly charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by His appearing and His kingdom:
[1Peter 4:5 NASB] 5 but they will give account to Him who is ready to judge the living and the dead.

 

Could you rephrase the question? I told you HOW judgement occurs, so you are not really looking for the mechanics of Judgement Day. I don't want to guess at what you really mean.

 

Thank you.

This proves nothing in relation to the passages in question. Because of the context, I consider the KJV to be mistaken in translating elohim as "gods." In the this the NASB ("rulers"), the K & D commentary ("judges"), and various other sources agree with me. You've not addressed my point in regards to the context of the whole psalm.

Are you actually saying that there are other "gods" besides the almighty God of the Bible? That the idols are actual "gods" rather than sculpted, un-moving statues with demons behind them? If this is what you are saying, there are so many things

Really??? The "judge unjustly" of v. 2 refers to God almighty???

No, Jesus does not call the human Jews questioning Him "elohim." That is a very mistaken way to exegete the passage. I dare you to find an exegete who agrees with you. Jesus is using an OT rendering from the LXX to see if they comprehend what God was saying and why He Himself was the Son of God.

Irrelevant.

You've lost me again. I don't know what you are saying.

Verse 7 of what? John or Psalm 82?

At any rate, look again at John 10:35--"If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came...." Jesus clearly stated that the "gods" being addressed in Psalm 82 were the Jews. Since there is no indication anywhere in the OT that the Jews were divine individually (plural "gods"), the possibilities are "rulers" (NASB) or "judges" (me and many others).